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Thread: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

  1. #231
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I dont know about sticking up for him, but they have certainly created for him a built in defense. Its not his fault...he was cwaaaaaazy! And how could he not be with this constant climate of hatred...like...well...like what this Fuller cat is spewing...
    Maybe they are sticking up for him because they know exactly how it feels to hate conservatives, Beck, Palin, Rush Limbaugh and the tea party, like he did.
    Catawa is my favorite bleeding heart liberal.
    1/27/12

  2. #232
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    How objective are you being in ignoring that the guy already had it in for the T party. Couldn't that, at least, suggest something other than PTSD was at work here?
    Read my posts without blinders on. I am not making excuses for his behavior. His partisan hackery combined with the mental illness to propel him to the targets that he made the threats against. If he had been a militant rightwing hack, he would have chosen different targets. The fact that he hated the Tea Party gave him direction, but the mental illness fueled the behavior. And again, this does not excuse what he did or absolve him from consequences.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  3. #233
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbbtx View Post
    Maybe they are sticking up for him because they know exactly how it feels to hate conservatives, Beck, Palin, Rush Limbaugh and the tea party, like he did.
    Or, maybe this is another erroneous statement from you.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  4. #234
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Read my posts without blinders on. I am not making excuses for his behavior. His partisan hackery combined with the mental illness to propel him to the targets that he made the threats against. If he had been a militant rightwing hack, he would have chosen different targets. The fact that he hated the Tea Party gave him direction, but the mental illness fueled the behavior. And again, this does not excuse what he did or absolve him from consequences.
    You know more about PTSD than I do. I thought, for somebody to act out on it, there needs to be some triggering event. Is that not the case? I ask because I'm wondering what, at that rally, would have triggered his PTSD.
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
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  5. #235
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Or, maybe this is another erroneous statement from you.
    I'm not referring to you. I don't think you hate conservatives or the others I mentioned. Aunt Spiker, same for you.
    I should have thought before I posted. There are quite a few on DP that do hate Beck/Palin/Rush etc. with a passion.
    Catawa is my favorite bleeding heart liberal.
    1/27/12

  6. #236
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    You know more about PTSD than I do. I thought, for somebody to act out on it, there needs to be some triggering event. Is that not the case? I ask because I'm wondering what, at that rally, would have triggered his PTSD.
    Getting shot might have helped.
    PTSD isn't something that's only there for the few minutes after the event and everything's dandy afterwards.

  7. #237
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbbtx View Post
    I'm not referring to you. I don't think you hate conservatives or the others I mentioned. Aunt Spiker, same for you.
    I should have thought before I posted. There are quite a few on DP that do hate Beck/Palin/Rush etc. with a passion.
    OK, this I agree with. There are certainly those at DP who hate those folks. I may not like what they say or what they stand for at times, but hate? That's ridiculous.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  8. #238
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    You know more about PTSD than I do. I thought, for somebody to act out on it, there needs to be some triggering event. Is that not the case? I ask because I'm wondering what, at that rally, would have triggered his PTSD.
    PTSD reactions that are negative or obvious don't always happen immediately in response to a situation. PTSD is complicated because, unlike shell shock, the symptoms can vary person to person. Some who have it can't sleep well at night. Others have night terrors. Some have adjustment issues in social settings. Some relapses are severe, some are not.

    It's like a hodge podge of symptoms - and that makes it hard to treat. But treatment and a close-eye on those with it is essential because many with PTSD are more likely to hurt theirselves (suicide, cutting, dangerous behavior) and more likely to lose control over their emotions (anger, fear, sadness).

    This doesn't apply to everyone - there's no one set of defined perameters that anyone fits into. It's just not a very simple thing.

    Some can handle it with some light therapy and support. But for some people it's extremely severe - these people tend to be more likely to take their anger and problems out on others (like what Fuller seems to be doing - but I might be wrong).

    Have you ever heard someone with a chronic illness or pain say "I have good days and I have bad days" - well that's how PTSD is for many. Sometimes they're fine. Maybe for a few days or weeks - maybe even months or years. And the things that trigger relapse might be serious (such as being shot) or far less serious (stress at work).
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
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  9. #239
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
    Getting shot might have helped.
    PTSD isn't something that's only there for the few minutes after the event and everything's dandy afterwards.
    Why go to the rally in the first place? Was that the PTSD too?
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mahatma Gandhi


  10. #240
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    Re: AZ shooting victim arrested for making death threats against Tea Party leader

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    You know more about PTSD than I do. I thought, for somebody to act out on it, there needs to be some triggering event. Is that not the case? I ask because I'm wondering what, at that rally, would have triggered his PTSD.
    The shooting was the triggering event. Wikipedia's article on PTSD is excellent. I encourage you to read it to learn more about it. Here are some highlights:

    PTSD is believed to be caused by either physical trauma or psychological trauma, or more frequently a combination of both. According to Atkinson et al. (2000)[citation needed] PTSD is more likely to be caused by physical or psychological trauma caused by humans such as rape, war or terrorist attack than trauma caused by natural disasters. Possible sources of trauma include experiencing or witnessing childhood or adult physical, emotional or sexual abuse. In addition, experiencing or witnessing an event perceived as life-threatening such as physical assault, adult experiences of sexual assault, accidents, drug addiction, illnesses, medical complications, or employment in occupations exposed to war (such as soldiers) or disaster (such as emergency service workers).[citation needed]
    Physical trauma and psychological trauma, more often caused by terrorist attacks than natural disasters. Experiencing or witnessing an event perceived as life threatening.

    One of the criterion:

    This must have involved both (a) loss of "physical integrity", or risk of serious injury or death, to self or others, and (b) a response to the event that involved intense fear, horror or helplessness.
    The shooting would be consistent with that.

    Another criterion. Note what I place in bold:

    One or more of these must be present in the victim: flashback memories, recurring distressing dreams, subjective re-experiencing of the traumatic event(s), or intense negative psychological or physiological response to any objective or subjective reminder of the traumatic event(s).
    This is what happened to him at that meeting. Because of his partisanship and PTSD, he had an intense negative response to Tea Partiers. Hence, the trigger of the fear and his reaction to the fear.

    Doesn't excuse his behavior. Any appropriate consequences should be levied. All it does is explain it.

    Link used in this post:

    Posttraumatic stress disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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