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Thread: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

  1. #321
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Sure they can if Congress deems the economic impact to the country, the States and to the citizenry to be so paramount that a mandate is either necessary and proper or for the overall welfare of the country. All insurance is considered interstate commerce (hence, the reason the "commerce clause" was used as justification for the mandate), but commerce alone, IMO, isn't justification enough. The Constitution does grant Congress the power to write laws and levy taxes. It's a matter of if Congress is able to tie all these things (or a combination of any two) together - interstate commerce, general welfare, necessity and justifiable cause - w/taxation in order to impose a mandate.
    That's not their job. We live in a free market economy and the government doesn't have the right to impose mandates, based on what they think is best for us. That equates to nothing less than full bore nanny statism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  2. #322
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Oops......

    The Congressional Budget Office, in an email to Capitol Hill staffers obtained by the Spectator, has said that repealing the national health care law would reduce net spending by $540 billion in the ten year period from 2012 through 2021. That number represents the cost of the new provisions, minus Medicare cuts. Repealing the bill would also eliminate $770 billion in taxes. It's the tax hikes in the health care law (along with the Medicare cuts) which accounts for the $230 billion in deficit reduction.

    The American Spectator : AmSpecBlog : BREAKING: CBO Says Repealing ObamaCare Would Reduce Net Spending by $540 Billion
    So, basically it's the loss of tax revenues the health care bill would otherwise collect that's in question...

    We already knew that. but notice that according to that same email the government would take in more revenue that it puts out over a 10-year perioed. I don't see that as problematic. But the deficit hawks apparently do!

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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Who said anything about giving Congress new powers? The Constitution has always given Congress this authority. They just have to ensure that whatever law is wirtten is within their power to pass. If such is in question, it's up to the Supreme Court to determine whether or not they overstepped their bounds.
    New powers as in a powers given to them by the founding fathers. What that clause does is just ensure that they can do what is needed to do their enumerated powers. It doesn't actually give any new powers.

    As for the supreme court comment, that doesn't actually mean anything to me. The supreme court understanding is the the result of the understanding of the people. If the people don't understand what is written we can't expect the people that come from the people to understand it either, aka the supreme court.

    As for the supreme court as it stands now, its doesn't actually run by its original intent. If it did, all people that show political basis would be booted, which clearly does not happen though it did originally.
    Last edited by Henrin; 01-07-11 at 07:10 PM.

  4. #324
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That's not their job. We live in a free market economy and the government doesn't have the right to impose mandates, based on what they think is best for us. That equates to nothing less than full bore nanny statism.
    Sure it is! Why else do we elect people to Congress? To sit on their hands? C'mon, apdst!

    What you're really trying to say is, "That's not what I want them to do." I guess that's what the midterms were all about. Time will tell if what was done is of benefit or hinderence to our country's overall health and welfare.

    I'm fine letting the Supreme Court iron things out.

  5. #325
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    There's no reason for them riase premiums
    then why did KATHLEEN SEBELIUS exempt the 200+

    LOL!

    Approved Applications for Waiver of the Annual Limits Requirements of the PHS Act Section 2711 as of December 3, 2010

    including the SERVICE EMPLOYEES INTERNATIONAL UNION

    you don't know what you're talking about

    would a person who is demonstrably unfamiliar with MISTER mccaskill even know who sebelius is?

  6. #326
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Here again, nobody's harming you economically if they can afford to buy health care for themselves. But you are harmed economically if they can get health care but refuse to do so. How? Because each time someone does go to the hospital ER but does not pay for the medical treatment they receive those cost eventaully get passed on to the consumer, specifically those individuals who do have health insurance.
    Who passed the law that said people can't be turned away, because they don't have insurance?

    I know you are aware of this - that a portion of our insurance premiums go towards paying for those non-funded health care costs. What you're complaining about - individuals on social programs like Medicaid - are dipping in your pockets via your tax dollars. But that's not the issue at hand here. Regardless, either way YOU ARE PAYING FOR IT - be it Medicaid for the poor or higher premiums due to the lazy SOB who refuses to get health care but can afford to do so.
    So, instead of that, now I have to pay even more money out of my pocket, because of Obamacare? How does this help me, again?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  7. #327
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    New powers as in a powers given to them by the founding fathers. What that clause does is just ensure they that they can do what is needed to do their enumurated powers. It doesn't actually give any new powers.
    Again, no one has said the necessary and proper clause was a new power. Congress has always had that authority under the Constitution. How they justify it's use is up to interpretation by the Supreme Courty.

  8. #328
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Sure it is! Why else do we elect people to Congress? To sit on their hands? C'mon, apdst!

    What you're really trying to say is, "That's not what I want them to do." I guess that's what the midterms were all about. Time will tell if what was done is of benefit or hinderence to our country's overall health and welfare.

    I'm fine letting the Supreme Court iron things out.
    Obviously, the American people don't think so. Did you notice the midterms?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #329
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Who passed the law that said people can't be turned away, because they don't have insurance?
    Congress...I believe that was either in the Social Security Act or the Public Health Act...not sure.

    So, instead of that, now I have to pay even more money out of my pocket, because of Obamacare? How does this help me, again?
    I fail to see how someone would be taking money out of your pocket if EVERYONE were paying for their own health insurance...you know...that "being responsible" thing you and Conservative and cpwill and so many others are always talking about that everyone should be doing anyway.

    Again, it's a "freedom" vs "individual responsibility" thing. Which side are you on?

  10. #330
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    Re: Health care repeal will cost $230 billion

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Obviously, the American people don't think so. Did you notice the midterms?
    I did mention them in my post #324 did I not? Geez...pay attention.

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