Page 21 of 22 FirstFirst ... 1119202122 LastLast
Results 201 to 210 of 211

Thread: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

  1. #201
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,580

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Yep according to the book they are both violations even though the ideas being communicated are miles apart.
    That's right, which makes neither excusable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  2. #202
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,580

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    You still haven't answered the question. Is dismissal the only sanction available under the Court Martial or does it depend on the circumstances?
    He could go to prison. Is that what you mean?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  3. #203
    Sage
    disneydude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Last Seen
    12-15-17 @ 12:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    25,145

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    He could go to prison. Is that what you mean?
    No. What I mean is "What are the available sanctions"?

    If dismissal is the only sanction, the by all means both should be dismissed.

    If there are multiple sanctions available depending on the egrigiousness of the offense, then you cannot simply argue that they both should be treated the same. Perhaps the level of egrigiousness is the same...and if it is, then absolutely they should be treated the same.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

  4. #204
    Student Zyroh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Seen
    02-13-11 @ 02:04 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    237

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    one solution that is absolutely not available to us is to allow service members to think for themselves. mindless robots are way better killers than a critically thinking man being weighed down by morals and feelings.
    Democracy is two wolves and sheep voting on what's for dinner. Liberty is a well armed sheep willing to contest the vote.

  5. #205
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,580

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    No. What I mean is "What are the available sanctions"?

    If dismissal is the only sanction, the by all means both should be dismissed.

    If there are multiple sanctions available depending on the egrigiousness of the offense, then you cannot simply argue that they both should be treated the same. Perhaps the level of egrigiousness is the same...and if it is, then absolutely they should be treated the same.
    Yeah, I guess one could go to the stockade, while one is simply cashiered. The end result either way would be a dishonarble discharge.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  6. #206
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,580

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyroh View Post
    one solution that is absolutely not available to us is to allow service members to think for themselves. mindless robots are way better killers than a critically thinking man being weighed down by morals and feelings.
    That's inaccurate. The military encourages soldiers to think for themselves. It's just that there are regulations in place as to how they are allowed to do so.

    Dan Choi, for instance, could have 1) not worn his uniform to a political rally and 2) not broke the law and he wouldn't be in violation of any regulation. However, he chose not to do that. If his judgement is those instance were that poor, then his judgement as an infantry officer, leading men into battle must come into question. IOW, if he's too stupid to leave his uniform at home, he's too stupid to lead men into battle. Someone that stupid will get people killed, because of their poor judgment and bad decisions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  7. #207
    Student Zyroh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last Seen
    02-13-11 @ 02:04 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    237

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That's inaccurate. The military encourages soldiers to think for themselves. It's just that there are regulations in place as to how they are allowed to do so.
    anyone else see this contradiction? or does the military CoC prevent you from seeing it? if you call yourself very conservative i hope you've read 1984 and you know what double think is. list your values then try to fit this argument into them. i did exactly that (after leaving the military) and am no longer 'very conservative'. another piece that will help you: The Unthinking Right by Llewellyn H. Rockwell, Jr.
    Democracy is two wolves and sheep voting on what's for dinner. Liberty is a well armed sheep willing to contest the vote.

  8. #208
    The Almighty
    Kelzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Last Seen
    10-21-17 @ 11:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    13,534

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    I mean they are different, one is derogatory frat boy antics while the other is a political statement.
    I actually think what Choi did was worse on an individual basis. A military involved in politics is a dangerous combination. I have no sympathy for a service member who is disciplined because they made a political statement.
    be humble for you are made of earth; be noble for you are made of stars

    Serbian proverb

  9. #209
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Redneck Riviera
    Last Seen
    07-09-11 @ 06:11 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,728

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Dan Choi, for instance, could have 1) not worn his uniform to a political rally and 2) not broke the law and he wouldn't be in violation of any regulation. However, he chose not to do that. If his judgement is those instance were that poor, then his judgement as an infantry officer, leading men into battle must come into question. IOW, if he's too stupid to leave his uniform at home, he's too stupid to lead men into battle. Someone that stupid will get people killed, because of their poor judgment and bad decisions.
    I understand what you're saying.

    I think that what other people are saying is that there is a difference between civil disobedience for a higher purpose (Dan Choi) and frat boy antics.

    However, IN TERMS OF PENALTIES, by the military, they are the same, for all intents and purposes. Dan Choi should not be allowed to return to serve as an officer because his conduct in the service was in violation of the law, and was unbecoming to an officer. THAT is the penalty for his civil disobedience.

    Civil disobedience can be a noble action, but it is not without cost. Dan Choi will have to pay the cost for his actions, even though his cause has been vindicated. And, that is as it should be.

    People these days want civil disobedience to be free. It isn't, and never has been. Sometimes, you have to be willing to sacrifice in order to make change. This was Dan Choi's personal sacrifice which he made on behalf of other people. Good on him, but he shouldn't be allowed back in uniform.

    It is what it is.

  10. #210
    The Almighty
    Kelzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Last Seen
    10-21-17 @ 11:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    13,534

    Re: Navy opens investigation into raunchy videos

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    No. What I mean is "What are the available sanctions"?

    If dismissal is the only sanction, the by all means both should be dismissed.

    If there are multiple sanctions available depending on the egrigiousness of the offense, then you cannot simply argue that they both should be treated the same. Perhaps the level of egrigiousness is the same...and if it is, then absolutely they should be treated the same.
    He could be busted in rank, the military could decline to pick up his re-inlistment or he could have a black mark onhis records, effectively preventing him from getting promoted, ever. Those are other punishments I've heard of.
    be humble for you are made of earth; be noble for you are made of stars

    Serbian proverb

Page 21 of 22 FirstFirst ... 1119202122 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •