• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

"Dream Act" immigration bill blocked in Senate

Redress

Liberal Fascist For Life!
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 5, 2008
Messages
112,903
Reaction score
60,359
Location
Sarasota Fla
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
"Dream Act" immigration bill blocked in Senate - Yahoo! News

Reuters 2pm-A controversial measure providing a pathway to citizenship for illegal immigrants who came to the United States as children was dealt a death blow in the Senate on Saturday by Republicans who said it would reward illegal activity.

The so-called "Dream Act" passed the House of Representatives earlier this month, but it failed to gain the 60 votes necessary to overcome opposition in the 100-member Senate.

This is one where I have to come down on the same side as republicans. I like the concept of DREAM, but I think, at least for now, it should be limited to military service as the route to access to citizenship.
 
Hopefully the dread act will stay dead. Illegals should not be rewarded with amnesty, especially if all they have to do is go to college or join a POG MOS.
 
I'm willing to compromise.

First, we need to take the steps necessary to stop the next wave of illegals. end birthright citizenship. ramp up illegal immigration enforcement of companies that hire illegally. Figure out a way to remove the economic advantage of coming to this country illegally.

then and only then can we selectively reward children of law breakers, but only the children that can demonstrate themselves as assets in American life. They must be able to read and write, they must understand and appreciate our views on private property, and individual liberty.
 
Illegal immigration should never be allowed to pay off, either directly or indirectly. No Dream Act. Not now. Not ever.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mpg
I am very happy that this did not pass. I agree with those who are saying we should first make it less enticing to come here before we even consider giving anyone here illegally amnesty. If their parents brought them here, it is sad, but that doesn't mean they should get the reward, especially not when doing so gives other parents more reason to illegally bring their children into our country for those same rewards.

Now, I am for citizenship through military service. You do so much time in the military, with honorable service, you get citizenship.
 
I am very happy that this did not pass. I agree with those who are saying we should first make it less enticing to come here before we even consider giving anyone here illegally amnesty. If their parents brought them here, it is sad, but that doesn't mean they should get the reward, especially not when doing so gives other parents more reason to illegally bring their children into our country for those same rewards.

Now, I am for citizenship through military service. You do so much time in the military, with honorable service, you get citizenship.

The incentive for most of them comes from the shady employers who keep hiring these people.
 
Hopefully congress will get serious about securing the border. Once the border is secured and ICE get serious about deporting those who overstay their visas, I would love to support a bill like the DREAM Act.
 
The incentive for most of them comes from the shady employers who keep hiring these people.

I think there are lots of incentives out there. I think we should be very tough on employers who either knowingly hire illegal immigrants or hire them just because they can't take the time it takes to do a proper background/employment check.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mpg
To me, I think DREAM would work if, at least for now, it allowed those who came into the country under the age of 16 and have broken no other laws to serve in the military(if they qualify otherwise, ie if they can get in) and serve 4 years to get access to the chance to attain citizenship. Along with that, we need to do things to slow as much as possible(it's impossible to completely end illegal immigration) by going after employers and those in the country illegally and making it more difficult to enter the country illegally. I think all this should be done together.
 
These are kids who through no fault of their own are here, who in many cases have no personal recollection of any other country but this one, who are among the top achievers of our public school systems, and who have enormous potential to contribute to our society and strengthen our nation. The DREAM act empowers that realization and in my opinion it is only human shortsightedness that prevents this urgently needed legislation from being the law of the land.
 
These are kids who through no fault of their own are here, who in many cases have no personal recollection of any other country but this one, who are among the top achievers of our public school systems, and who have enormous potential to contribute to our society and strengthen our nation. The DREAM act empowers that realization and in my opinion it is only human shortsightedness that prevents this urgently needed legislation from being the law of the land.

As the saying goes,
"Law's the law." and "Life's unfair."

The only thing I would approve is the military service will help them with citizenship, but that's just me. If they are willing to put their lives on the line for a country, wouldn't it be good for them to be part of that country? But for education, ummmm there's a line... And it starts with the legal residents and the student visas.
 
These are kids who through no fault of their own are here, who in many cases have no personal recollection of any other country but this one, who are among the top achievers of our public school systems, and who have enormous potential to contribute to our society and strengthen our nation. The DREAM act empowers that realization and in my opinion it is only human shortsightedness that prevents this urgently needed legislation from being the law of the land.

I refuse to consider DREAM or any other immigration act an urgent issue until Hispanics are willing to compromise on immigration enforcement and border security.

I think congress should take the best parts of the DREAM act, incorporate them into a bill that secures our borders and deports those here illegally. Perhaps a compromise can be reached with the Hispanic groups and they will get behind such legislation.

What if congress made a law that gave all illegals 6 months or a year to go get ID proving their current residency and anyone without ID after that was subject to deportation via real enforcement of immigration laws? Getting an ID wouldn’t guarantee the right to become a citizen but it would be a way of proving when you were living here.

If Hispanics aren’t interested in anything that doesn’t include an open border and citizenship for all, I have no interest in listening to their complaints and will push for immigration control only. If they can support border enforcement and immigration control, I’m willing to support the DREAM act and/or something better.
 
I'm willing to compromise.

First, we need to take the steps necessary to stop the next wave of illegals. end birthright citizenship. ramp up illegal immigration enforcement of companies that hire illegally. Figure out a way to remove the economic advantage of coming to this country illegally.

I agree with most of this. Ending "birthright citizenship" however will be almost impossible, and you know it..

then and only then can we selectively reward children of law breakers, but only the children that can demonstrate themselves as assets in American life. They must be able to read and write, they must understand and appreciate our views on private property, and individual liberty.

I am honestly torn on this issue. I am also against illegal immigration, but if these kids are graduating from college and serving in the active duty military, isn't that the kind of person the U.S. should welcome?
 
Children should never have to pay for their parents' mistakes. Anyone who was raised and educated in any given country from a very young age should have the opportunity to become a citizen of that country or at the very lest legal foreign residents. As Chappy said, many of them have never been back to their home country, many don't even speak their native language at all, not all of them are Hispanic or Mexican and can't easily cross oceans to rejoin a culture that has become completely alien to them. And some don't realize they're actually in the country illegally until they're almost adults. It makes no sense to deport these people whose life in the US as made them as American as if they were born there. If you're going to punish anyone, punish the parents. The kids don't deserve to be kicked out of the only country they call home. At least give them Green Cards, ffs.
 
Hopefully the dread act will stay dead. Illegals should not be rewarded with amnesty, especially if all they have to do is go to college or join a POG MOS.

As far as college some will be treated better than American citizens. They would pay in state tuition while those from outside the state would not.
We are not ready for this kind of reform.
It's dead for now. It's catch 22. Dems won't secure the border. They think if they do Rep. won't vote for any kind of amnesty because they got what they wanted.
Republicans won't vote for any kind of amnesty because the borders are wide open.

I think we already fast track illegals who have served in our military.
 
Children should never have to pay for their parents' mistakes. Anyone who was raised and educated in any given country from a very young age should have the opportunity to become a citizen of that country or at the very lest legal foreign residents. As Chappy said, many of them have never been back to their home country, many don't even speak their native language at all, not all of them are Hispanic or Mexican and can't easily cross oceans to rejoin a culture that has become completely alien to them. And some don't realize they're actually in the country illegally until they're almost adults. It makes no sense to deport these people whose life in the US as made them as American as if they were born there. If you're going to punish anyone, punish the parents. The kids don't deserve to be kicked out of the only country they call home. At least give them Green Cards, ffs.

Here's a thought. Send them back as soon as we realize the are here illegally. Don't allow them to go to our schools. Don't make them automatic citizens for being born here. Don't give them welfare, foodstamps and healthcare. Don't give them jobs. If we did that, there would be no need for a fence.
We need to find a way to speed up the process so that it's not years of waiting in line to become legal. But there still needs to be a line.
 
To me, I think DREAM would work if, at least for now, it allowed those who came into the country under the age of 16 and have broken no other laws to serve in the military(if they qualify otherwise, ie if they can get in) and serve 4 years to get access to the chance to attain citizenship. Along with that, we need to do things to slow as much as possible(it's impossible to completely end illegal immigration) by going after employers and those in the country illegally and making it more difficult to enter the country illegally. I think all this should be done together.

I wouldn't say impossible. Hard, most certainly, but not impossible.

Two layers of razor fencing with land mines in between the fences and seismic monitors paced far enough apart that you can zero in on where the land mine explodes (or someone walks) with in 5 meters. Enough agents to cover the area to where there is at least 1 agent per half mile. All agents armed with a full arsenal of guns to shoot anyone that manages to get past the fences/mines. (of course before they shoot them they should determine if they are here illegally first. Don't want to kill innocents)

For those that come here on ships...search every single ship that comes into port with dogs and the proper technology to find hidden panels. Once the illegals are found....shoot em. Then shoot the Captain of the ship.

I would imagine that with this kind of security then NO ONE would even want to attempt to come into the country illegally.
 
Last edited:
Oh, for my "compromise", once my above post has been implemented then anyone that wants to serve in the US military for X amount of time (say 10 years?) and is discharged honorably could become an automatic citizen. If that person has a spouse/children then they too can become automatic citizens provided they pass a criminal background check.

Those that come here on a student visa and wants to become a citizen must serve in the related field that they chose to be in for 10 years for the government. During that service basic nessicities(sp?) will be payed for (this will include clothing and a car to get to work (and only for work) food and housing) and get a $100 monthly allowance for extra "wants".
 
Children should never have to pay for their parents' mistakes. Anyone who was raised and educated in any given country from a very young age should have the opportunity to become a citizen of that country or at the very lest legal foreign residents. As Chappy said, many of them have never been back to their home country, many don't even speak their native language at all, not all of them are Hispanic or Mexican and can't easily cross oceans to rejoin a culture that has become completely alien to them. And some don't realize they're actually in the country illegally until they're almost adults. It makes no sense to deport these people whose life in the US as made them as American as if they were born there. If you're going to punish anyone, punish the parents. The kids don't deserve to be kicked out of the only country they call home. At least give them Green Cards, ffs.

Children always pay for thier parents mistakes. It is the way life is. If a childs dad has a reputation of being nasty you can be sure that the child will get attention for that..and not in a positive way. Children also have to pay for thier parents bills when the parent dies.
 
Children always pay for thier parents mistakes. It is the way life is. If a childs dad has a reputation of being nasty you can be sure that the child will get attention for that..and not in a positive way. Children also have to pay for thier parents bills when the parent dies.


Yeah, the first one due now will be the tax bill for estates over $5 mil....Let's hope that mom and dad didn't own a farm, or a sucessful business you thought you'd inherit, because big daddy gubment want's that now.

j-mac
 
The incentive for most of them comes from the shady employers who keep hiring these people.

I agree that is about half of it. But I just want to repeat what someone else already said and it cannot be said enough, crack down on immigration first, then ask us to embrace laws concerning citizenship. Build the wall, arrest employers, aggressively enforce immigration laws, and convince us that this is not just another incremental amnesty bill. We should shout down any proposal like this until the government shows us it will enforce the laws we elected them to uphold.
 
I've worked professionally with the children of illegal immigrants. It's very difficult, many of these kids have been here since they were toddlers and are much more American than Mexican. They can't legally work in the U.S., but they want to remain here because to them, this is home. We should definitely offer up the military as a path to citizenship.
 
I've worked professionally with the children of illegal immigrants. It's very difficult, many of these kids have been here since they were toddlers and are much more American than Mexican. They can't legally work in the U.S., but they want to remain here because to them, this is home. We should definitely offer up the military as a path to citizenship.

Once our borders are FULLY enforced, fine by me. But not one second before.
 
Back
Top Bottom