Page 66 of 67 FirstFirst ... 165664656667 LastLast
Results 651 to 660 of 663

Thread: DADT cloture passes

  1. #651
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,584

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    I think our men and women in uniform can handle the passing of this historic legislation.. they have been through years and years of war for ****s sake
    I think that the love, effection, respect and confidence that most Liberals have in our service members is very selective and certainly conditional.

    Most Liberals that hail our armed service members as the smartest, most professional military force in history are the same ones that were calling them murderers and war criminals, just a few short years ago.

    they have been through years and years of war for ****s sake
    I reckon the wars weren't for naught, afterall. Eh?

    P.S. ever notice how Libbos like to apply, "historic", to everything that Obama has his cabbage collectors in?
    Last edited by apdst; 12-29-10 at 12:43 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  2. #652
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Ft. Campbell, KY
    Last Seen
    12-31-14 @ 08:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    12,177

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I think that the love, effection, respect and confidence that most Liberals have in our service members is very selective and certainly conditional.

    Most Liberals that hail our armed service members as the smartest, most professional military force in history are the same ones that were calling them murderers and war criminals, just a few short years ago.
    That is an absurd generalization.

  3. #653
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,584

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    How is that any different than the situation describing the end of racial segregation? I won't deny there won't be issues but those Soldiers with issues will change, Soldiers will say they are being ordered to do something because they are gay just like there were some who claimed racism. And Soldiers will file complaints for bunking with a gay Soldier like they did for a black one, but it will go away as they change.
    It'll go away as seperate billets are built and assignments made. Or, because local commands insititute their own versions of DADT.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  4. #654
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,584

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    That is an absurd generalization.
    But, it's true, I'm sure.

    Notice I said, "most". Redress doesn't fall into that catagory, but she's the exception, not the rule.

    Whatcha' wanna bet that every single Liberal that responds to that post says the same thing, "uh, uh, I didn't do that!". To be followed up with, "yooz a racist", or, "yooz a homophobe", or, well, you get the picture.
    Last edited by apdst; 12-29-10 at 12:49 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  5. #655
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Ft. Campbell, KY
    Last Seen
    12-31-14 @ 08:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    12,177

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It'll go away as seperate billets are built and assignments made. Or, because local commands insititute their own versions of DADT.
    You assume the commanders will want to go along with that, I certainly won't recommend it to my CO if any of my Soldiers have a problem billeting with a gay Soldier. Why? Because I have to trust my Soldiers to be able to perform every duty required of them with their fellow Soldiers. Having to seperate Soldiers for those reasons, outside of Army policy required seperation like gender seperation, will only add another layer of complexity to the mission, and quite frankly I'm far more in favor of forcing those Soldiers to adapt or get out. The same way the Army forced Soldiers with problems against those of another race to adapt or get out. But at NO TIME will I punish or have another Soldier go out of his way, one who has not violated any Army policy or done anything to warrent that punish, to bear an additional burden for a Soldier who cannot operate within the required standards of an Army Soldier. Those standards being in this case tolerance for differences among Soldiers, and respect for fellow Soldiers.

    As for establishing their own verisons of DADT, you should know that is impossible because no commander can create a command policy in direct conflict with Army policy. And you assume again they will have the resources required to seperate their Soldiers.

    And your generalization is still just as absurd, calling someone, you specifically, a racist or homophobe is not akin to believing all Soldiers are war criminals or murderers.

  6. #656
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,584

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    You assume the commanders will want to go along with that, I certainly won't recommend it to my CO if any of my Soldiers have a problem billeting with a gay Soldier. Why? Because I have to trust my Soldiers to be able to perform every duty required of them with their fellow Soldiers. Having to seperate Soldiers for those reasons, outside of Army policy required seperation like gender seperation, will only add another layer of complexity to the mission, and quite frankly I'm far more in favor of forcing those Soldiers to adapt or get out. The same way the Army forced Soldiers with problems against those of another race to adapt or get out. But at NO TIME will I punish or have another Soldier go out of his way, one who has not violated any Army policy or done anything to warrent that punish, to bear an additional burden for a Soldier who cannot operate within the required standards of an Army Soldier. Those standards being in this case tolerance for differences among Soldiers, and respect for fellow Soldiers.

    What rank are you? or, rather, what's your future former rank?

    The first time one of your soldiers stands tall, starts quoting AR600-20 and calls his congress critter, telling about how his/her rights are being violated, you'll let that soldier billet damn near anywhere that he/she wants to. You'll let that soldier sleep on your livingroom couch, if it keeps that congressman from crawling up your ass and building a nest there. That's if the congressman is a Democrat; you better pray to God that that soldier doesn't have a congressman that was elected on the tea party vote.


    As for establishing their own verisons of DADT, you should know that is impossible because no commander can create a command policy in direct conflict with Army policy. And you assume again they will have the resources required to seperate their Soldiers.
    Creating a version of DADT that doesn't punish sexual orientation, but forbids discussing sexual orientation wouldn't be in conflict with DoD policy. Cancelling social functions, indefinitely, or barring significant others from social functions wouldn't be in conflict, either. Lots-a-leeway for commanders, when it comes to interpretation of the regulations.

    And your generalization is still just as absurd, calling someone, you specifically, a racist or homophobe is not akin to believing all Soldiers are war criminals or murderers.

    Are you calling me a homophobe, or a racist, or both?
    Last edited by apdst; 12-29-10 at 01:20 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  7. #657
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Ft. Campbell, KY
    Last Seen
    12-31-14 @ 08:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    12,177

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    What rank are you? or, rather, what's your future former rank?

    The first time one of your soldiers stands tall, starts quoting AR600-20 and calls his congress critter, telling about how his/her rights are being violated, you'll let that soldier billet damn near anywhere that he/she wants to. You'll let that soldier sleep on your livingroom couch, if it keeps that congressman from crawling up your ass and building a nest there. That's if the congressman is a Democrat; you better pray to God that that soldier doesn't have a congressman that was elected on the tea party vote.
    I am a 2LT. And as a PL if a Soldier outright refuses to be billeted with a gay Soldier he'll receive a counseling statement when I am soonest able to. And if he wishes to make a UCMJ issue out of it, I'll be sure to bring my PSG in for his opinion as well as inform the CO who will probably for command and Army policy reasons address the issue personally. However I'm aware that forcing the issue on the spot may cause additional problems and until I can deal with the issue better accommodations will be made. Now I'm not as familiar with AR 600-20 as I'd like to be admittedly, and no post DADT regulations have been written or at least released yet, but I will become as familiar as I can. For example I know chapter 4-19 on homosexual policy will be amended if not completely removed.

    As for a Congressmen, well thats a little out of my pay grade to be worrying about what some Congressmen thinks of my day to day actions. And frankly I've never heard or seen of a junior officer creating an incident that led to Congressional involvement.

  8. #658
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,584

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    I am a 2LT. And as a PL if a Soldier outright refuses to be billeted with a gay Soldier he'll receive a counseling statement when I am soonest able to. And if he wishes to make a UCMJ issue out of it, I'll be sure to bring my PSG in for his opinion as well as inform the CO who will probably for command and Army policy reasons address the issue personally.
    I hope you enjoyed your time in the Army, El-tee. You won't be there long.


    [quote]However I'm aware that forcing the issue on the spot may cause additional problems and until I can deal with the issue better accommodations will be made.[quote]

    And, at that point, you just lost the fight, sir.


    Now I'm not as familiar with AR 600-20 as I'd like to be admittedly, and no post DADT regulations have been written or at least released yet, but I will become as familiar as I can. For example I know chapter 4-19 on homosexual policy will be amended if not completely removed.
    Wait! What? I'm just a dumb, unejumacated, homophobic racist nigger from the Louisiana piney woods and AR600-20 was one of the first regulations that I became familiar with. I suggest that you become familiar as hell with it in the next few weeks. That information just might save your career, Sir.

    As for a Congressmen, well thats a little out of my pay grade to be worrying about what some Congressmen thinks of my day to day actions. And frankly I've never heard or seen of a junior officer creating an incident that led to Congressional involvement.
    Out of your paygrade, until that soldier's letter to his/her congressman says, "2LT Wiseone ordered me...", and, "2LT Wisone's PS, SSG. Brightone also issue an order that violates my rights as a soldier and Captain Smartone backed them both of them up, so on, so on and so forth...". Oh yeah, it'll be within your paygrade then, Sir.

    You think you're outta the woods if they don't find any violations with that soldier? Naw! They'll **** around your AO, til they do find something ****ed up.

    You may want to become very familiar with FM 27-1--if you're not already.

    CORRESPONDING WITH A MEMBER OF CONGRESS
    Soldiers may write or petition any member of Congress about a complaint. You should not interfere with or try to dissuade a soldier from exercising this right. UCMJ, Article 138 (Chapter 13), protects a soldier's right to complain and request correction of a grievance against his commander.
    Last edited by apdst; 12-29-10 at 02:23 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #659
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    29,054

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Why not? Because it's something you don't agree with?

    Sounds to me like you're selling our service members short and saying that they're not professional enough to look past a person's personal beliefs and soldier on.
    I explained, in detail, why exactly they aren't professional. How about you try to refute the post instead of trying to attack me?
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  10. #660
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    29,054

    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It'll go away as seperate billets are built and assignments made. Or, because local commands insititute their own versions of DADT.
    You seem to be making a lot of assumptions here, but have given absolutely zero evidence to back them up.

    And constantly bringing up AR600-20 doesn't mean squat. First of all, the soldier would have to be absolutely familiar with it to even suggest it. Second, most people do not interpret that to mean that men or women should have separate berthings/showers based on their sexuality. In fact, it is not likely that any in the upper chain of command do so, since none of them have even mentioned this article. And many on here have told you that it really doesn't apply, since you would have to make the case that it is very likely that two men of differing sexualities are likely to cause one of them to face sexual harassment issues if they live together much more often than if they just work together. You can interpret that policy how ever you wish, but you nor any enlisted soldier would be the ones who get to decide how that policy applies in cases of sexuality, that would be up to those who are actually in charge of making and ensuring that military/Army policies are enforced/followed correctly.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

Page 66 of 67 FirstFirst ... 165664656667 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •