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Thread: DADT cloture passes

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Maybe, sorry. I know that I was talking to someone who is very against DADT repeal about this who was also in the military. I thought it was you, if not, I apologize.
    No, not maybe...
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    You said that they didn't have the same rules that we have. I want to know why that matters. You made a claim, I am asking you to back it up.
    The British Army doesn't have a sexual harassment prevetion policy that the United States does, hence the reason that 99% of the female soldiers in the British Army have reported some kind of sexual harassment. Want to adopt a lax sexual harassment policy like the Brits have?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The British Army doesn't have a sexual harassment prevetion policy that the United States does, hence the reason that 99% of the female soldiers in the British Army have reported some kind of sexual harassment. Want to adopt a lax sexual harassment policy like the Brits have?
    No, I want to know why you think that it has any bearing on how gays or straights will be in worse shape with such a policy and gays being able to serve openly than without such a policy or gays serving with such a policy and under DADT? Most of the problems that come from our sexual harassment policies are based on the fact that there will always be some people that abuse the policy or who assume that some are abusing the policy. This is true no matter what the policy is. And, with DADT in place, cases of harassment against a gay person are rarely reported because it opens the gay person up to scrutiny that could cause them to be discharged for doing trying to report wrongdoing.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The British Army doesn't have a sexual harassment prevetion policy that the United States does, hence the reason that 99% of the female soldiers in the British Army have reported some kind of sexual harassment. Want to adopt a lax sexual harassment policy like the Brits have?
    Also, I don't think that it is true that The British Army doesn't have a sexual harassment prevention policy in place at all. It may look different than the US's, but I highly doubt that they don't have one at all.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No, I want to know why you think that it has any bearing on how gays or straights will be in worse shape with such a policy and gays being able to serve openly than without such a policy or gays serving with such a policy and under DADT?
    I'm saying that adjustments are going to be made and housing will be one of those adjustments and when soldiers stop living together, unit cohesion will suffer.

    Most of the problems that come from our sexual harassment policies are based on the fact that there will always be some people that abuse the policy or who assume that some are abusing the policy.
    100% of the sexual harassment issues exist, because male and female soldiers serve together.


    And, with DADT in place, cases of harassment against a gay person are rarely reported because it opens the gay person up to scrutiny that could cause them to be discharged for doing trying to report wrongdoing.
    If a modified version of DADT were left in place, there would be no gay/straight sexual harassment problems. Since that's not going to be the case, the problems are going to exist.


    I'm not saying any of that. All I'm saying, is that there are going to be diffferent housing arrangements within our military.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The British Army doesn't have a sexual harassment prevetion policy that the United States does, hence the reason that 99% of the female soldiers in the British Army have reported some kind of sexual harassment. Want to adopt a lax sexual harassment policy like the Brits have?
    Oh, perhaps you'd like link to where you got that 99% number?
    (hint: it was probably your ass)
    edit: (but don't worry, with DADT being repealed it's ok for you to link your ass sometimes I crack myself up)

    Next, show us the same figures for the US military, in the spirit of fairness.
    Last edited by Deuce; 12-23-10 at 03:32 PM.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    The 99 % is from a 2006 study and is legit sorta. Sexual harassment rife in armed forces | UK news | The Guardian

    Sexual harassment is rife in the armed forces, with 99% of servicewomen reporting they had been subjected to some form of sexual remark or material by male colleagues in the past year. One in seven - 15% - say they have had a "particularly upsetting" experience over the same period, ranging from sexually explicit comments through to sexual assault.
    However:

    The research is the first phase in an action plan against sexual harassment that the armed forces have agreed to implement, and reflects an acknowledgment by senior MoD officials that a cultural change is needed.
    So it does appear the claim that they have no sexual harassment policy is in error, though I cannot find proof one way or the other.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I'm saying that adjustments are going to be made and housing will be one of those adjustments and when soldiers stop living together, unit cohesion will suffer.



    100% of the sexual harassment issues exist, because male and female soldiers serve together.




    If a modified version of DADT were left in place, there would be no gay/straight sexual harassment problems. Since that's not going to be the case, the problems are going to exist.


    I'm not saying any of that. All I'm saying, is that there are going to be diffferent housing arrangements within our military.
    They won't stop living together, no matter how much you or others may want this to happen. Any objects can easily be met with the fact that straights have been living with gays the entire time. There is no proof that the majority of gay men or gay women would view a naked body of the gender that they are attracted to as a sexual object and/or not be able to act professionally while showering with them. The same cannot be said about males and females showering together. Our society does not view men and women together, in potentially naked situations, as normal.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    The 99 % is from a 2006 study and is legit sorta. Sexual harassment rife in armed forces | UK news | The Guardian



    However:



    So it does appear the claim that they have no sexual harassment policy is in error, though I cannot find proof one way or the other.
    They do have a "branch" (I'm guessing that it is similar to a department?) that is dedicated to equality and diversity, so I'd bet that they have some policies concerning it.

    Lt. Col. Colin Bulleid of the British Army Equality and Diversity Policy Branch told The Independent last year
    British Army Actively Recruits Gay Soldiers
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Also, I don't think that it is true that The British Army doesn't have a sexual harassment prevention policy in place at all. It may look different than the US's, but I highly doubt that they don't have one at all.
    Obviously it's not effective. Right?

    But, if you'll go back and re-read my post, you'll see that I never said that the Brits didn't have a policy in place.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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