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Thread: DADT cloture passes

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No, but it will be more likely to happen when it is homosexual sex than heterosexual sex. One is viewed by most to be acceptable. Heck, many see it as if they could, they would. Two men getting together though (and yes, I believe the most issues will come from men, not women) is viewed as unacceptable, wrong, immoral, and/or icky by many straight men. They are much more likely to ignore a roommate having sex with a woman than they are to ignore a roommate having sex with a man. And, even if they did have issues with their roommate having sex with a woman in their room, they are much more likely to simply talk to the guy about the issue than to turn him in if they do not view the act as wrong, but just inappropriate. Not everyone will be like this, but many, who are likely to be uncomfortable with homosexuals in the first place, would do as I described.
    It's more likely to be reported, because it's homosexual sex vice heterosexual sex. Whether, or no it will be enforced is irrelevant. Any officer that ignores a violation of the UCMJ can find himself appearing at his own court martial for violating several articles of the UCMJ.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It's more likely to be reported, because it's homosexual sex vice heterosexual sex. Whether, or no it will be enforced is irrelevant. Any officer that ignores a violation of the UCMJ can find himself appearing at his own court martial for violating several articles of the UCMJ.
    Oh come on. Historically commands have turned a blind eye to many UCMJ violations, and not just article 125(which has a long history of being ignored).
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The DADT Bible also shows that 38% of the members of the Marine Corps say they will get out, if DADT is abolished. Can we really afford to lose 38% of the Marine Corps? Ready for national conscription?
    I am not sure that this is entirely accurate.

    From the survey - page 54.

    DADT Survey Findings

    18.5% of all Service members reported they would consider leaving sooner than their current intentions if repeal occurs. This is the group of Service members who “switched”their military career intentions when considering DADT repeal. They were not considering leaving, but said repeal will cause them to “think about leaving sooner” or“leave sooner.”

    Among all Service members, Marine Corps members were most likely to say they will leave sooner than planned or will consider leaving sooner than planned (38.1%)
    I would not equate "leaving sooner than planned" or "considering leaving sooner than planned" to equal a wholesale loss that would lead to national conscription.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by satandog View Post
    I am not sure that this is entirely accurate.

    From the survey - page 54.

    DADT Survey Findings



    I would not equate "leaving sooner than planned" or "considering leaving sooner than planned" to equal a wholesale loss that would lead to national conscription.
    Further, prior to the UK allowing gays to serve openly they got similar results, but the exodus never happened.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Oh come on. Historically commands have turned a blind eye to many UCMJ violations, and not just article 125(which has a long history of being ignored).
    Turning a blind eye to UCMJ violations is illegal. Just because officers in the past have broken the law, doesn't make it ok.

    I personally never saw an officer ignore a violation of the UCMJ. Any officer that does is putting his career on the line.

    I caught a soldier ass ****ing a chick in the barracks one time and had him locked myself. He was charge and convicted of an Article 125 and an Article 92 violation and dishonorably discharged. Had I just closed the door and went about my business, i would have been looking at a courts martial for violating Articles 78 accessory after the fact, 192 failure to obey and order, or regulation, and 134 all disorders and neglects to the prejudice of good order and discipline in the armed forces, all conduct of a nature to bring discredit upon the armed forces, and crimes and offenses not capital, of which persons subject to this chapter may be guilty.

    Sorry, but I wouldn't put my career on the line for some asshole that can't follow the rules. Nor, have I ever known any officer, or NCO that was worth his salt, that would.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It's more likely to be reported, because it's homosexual sex vice heterosexual sex. Whether, or no it will be enforced is irrelevant. Any officer that ignores a violation of the UCMJ can find himself appearing at his own court martial for violating several articles of the UCMJ.
    Yeah, right. Before this recent repeal, which was most likely to be even looked into by a command, a man who received a BJ from a woman or a man who received a BJ from a man. Both are considered sodomy, yet most commands would only charge a heterosexual with that if the person was a ****bag and the command was trying to find enough against the person to get them discharged.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    We had a good sailor who developed an alcohol problem when his wife left him. He showed up drunk a couple times. Rather than boot him out, we handled things in command and talked him into volunteering for the rehab program(forget what it is called). He never went to a UCMJ, his showing up drunk never appeared on his record.

    Sex in the barracks was commonplace, and our officers knew it. We had two semi openly gay people over my time in the command, one was a yeoman who was the skippers secretary. This was prior to DADT.

    I think you would be surprised at how often commands look the other way on things.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by satandog View Post
    I am not sure that this is entirely accurate.

    From the survey - page 54.

    DADT Survey Findings



    I would not equate "leaving sooner than planned" or "considering leaving sooner than planned" to equal a wholesale loss that would lead to national conscription.
    If everything is sop peachy in the British Army, why is the commander seeking the advice of gay rights groups to end the tension within the ranks?

    BBC NEWS | UK | Army acts to promote gay rights

    Besides that, this isn't the UK, nor does the British Army have the same military regulations that the United States military has.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    If everything is sop peachy in the British Army, why is the commander seeking the advice of gay rights groups to end the tension within the ranks?

    BBC NEWS | UK | Army acts to promote gay rights

    Besides that, this isn't the UK, nor does the British Army have the same military regulations that the United States military has.
    Where did you get that there was tension in the ranks? They don't even mention that from what I read.
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    Re: DADT cloture passes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    If everything is sop peachy in the British Army, why is the commander seeking the advice of gay rights groups to end the tension within the ranks?

    BBC NEWS | UK | Army acts to promote gay rights

    Besides that, this isn't the UK, nor does the British Army have the same military regulations that the United States military has.
    You used this link before and it did not go over well. It's also old news(2.5 years ago).

    Your source makes no mention of retention post-gay integration, so it does not address what I said in any way. Also, while the UK does not have significant problems with gays serving that is not the same as no problem. Trying to improve is a positive trait.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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