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Thread: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

  1. #301
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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    All we need to do is get Navy Pride to say START is dead, and that will pretty much ensure that it passes.
    a very petty observation

    But seriously, it has nothing to do with DADT. McCain has a personal animosity to Obama just as he had a personal animosity to Bush. If Reid had put START first, then chances are that neither DADT nor START would have passed.
    you haven't been following

    Republicans threaten to derail START - Shira Toeplitz - POLITICO.com

    remember, last time he was asked (dec 18), limp lindsey voted "yes"

    but don't let start derail your parade, stay up

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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    here, by the way, is your hero:

    Joe Lieberman: Democrats? man of the hour - Shira Toeplitz - POLITICO.com

    he did it on the sabbath, very unusual for jiltin joe

    fyi

  3. #303
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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    Republicans threaten to derail START - Shira Toeplitz - POLITICO.com

    remember, last time he was asked (dec 18), limp lindsey voted "yes"

    but don't let start derail your parade, stay up
    It won't. If some members of the GOP are so pathetic that they want to derail START because of DADT then who cares. It just shows what the GOP is made of.

    It also makes some members, particularly the 8 who voted for DADT, all the more valuable.
    Last edited by CriticalThought; 12-19-10 at 04:38 PM.

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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelzie View Post
    It might be cowardly but it's also a good stepping stone for getting the rest of the country to change. Didn't the military desegregate blacks before the rest of the country?
    Yes. Women were Commanding Officers and Generals before they were CEOs. Blacks were patrolling and being promoted equally and fairly with whites long before Affirmative Action. I've brought this up before to people here, but they all seem too interested in pretending that our military is always the last hold out. In their eagerness to ensure that "they pay our robot salaries" they forget that it has always been the robots that have led social change....not them. The difference is that we are forced to maintain high standards while they use their protected freedoms to maintain the choice between good and bad morality.

    But the great contradiction remains... - "You are good enough to go die for my unearned rights, homosexual, but **** you if you want to get married in our courts."
    Last edited by MSgt; 12-19-10 at 07:00 PM.

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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Yes. Women were Commanding Officers and Generals before they were CEOs. Blacks were patrolling and being promoted equally and fairly with whites long before Affirmative Action. I've brought this up before to people here, but they all seem too interested in pretending that our military is always the last hold out. In their eagerness to ensure that "they pay our robot salaries" they forget that it has always been the robots that have led social change....not them. The difference is that we are forced to maintain high standards while they use their protected freedoms to maintain the choice between good and bad morality.

    But the great contradiction remains... - "You are good enough to go die for my unearned rights, homosexual, but **** you if you want to get married in our courts."
    All of that would be great and true, but the fact is, the rest of the country already lets gays work openly for them. In fact, in most(I think) states, gays cannot be discriminated in employment. In this case, the military is behind.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    All of that would be great and true, but the fact is, the rest of the country already lets gays work openly for them. In fact, in most(I think) states, gays cannot be discriminated in employment. In this case, the military is behind.
    You are evading because you want to believe that gays get a fair shake across our country and that once the military backs off, utopia will magically emerge. It will not. The military have always been removed from the civilian social debates, because tradition and orders will always trump the utopian dreams of university classrooms and political agendas. But it was always the military that was forced to do what civilians would not. This is the very same exact thing that happened with blacks and women. In every case, the civilian world moaned and marched, but in the end forced the military to achieve what they could not long after their tired debates.

    1) Gays do not have the same legal rights heterosexuals have. In the military, the legal code will be altered to allow gays the same rights as the rest. Their loved ones will be the beneficiaries, despite civilian courts denying them marriage and spousal legal rights.

    2) Gays are the subject of ridicule in Hollywood and television. In the military, singling out gays will result in Non-Judicial Procedures and Courts Martials. Military careers will be ruined while civilians maintain their right to ridicule and ostricize for the world's entertainment.

    Once again, the social and legal ineqaulity of the unaccepted will be a civilian shame. It will be the military, once again, that leads the way. We like to pretend that generals are the great bigots of our society, simply because we live during a time of social change, but none of this is new. And I guarantee you that no matter how many gays have been killed in the civilian sector, they will be dismissed for the few that may be killed inside the military. And do you know why? It's because, just like with racial segregation, civilians expect us to be better than them. They expect us to lead where they cannot (and plenty simply refuse).
    Last edited by MSgt; 12-19-10 at 07:26 PM.

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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    I support getting rid of DADT and allowing gays to serve in most-if not all-military roles. Think of some poor brainwashed Islamist waiting interrogation and worrying that the guy who is going to be grilling him is Gay!!. The US military could use the homophobia intrinsic in the hard core Islamists to our benefit!



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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    You are evading. The military was always behind the civilian debates, because tradition and orders will always trump the utopian dreams of university classrooms and political agendas. But it was always the military that was forced to do what civilians would not. This is the very same exact thing that happened with blacks and women. In every case, the civilian world moaned and marched, but in the end forced the military to achieve what they could not long after their tired debates.
    First off, treating people as people and based on their actions is not some Utopian dream.

    The military is not being asked to do something civilians cannot, they are being asked to do what the rest of the country already can do.

    1) Gays do not have the same legal rights heterosexuals have. In the military, the legal code will be altered to allow gays the same rights as the rest. Their loved ones will be the beneficiaries, despite civilian courts denying them marriage.
    Oh noz, the military will have to let people designate their own next of kin. The horror!

    2) Gays are the subject of ridicule in Hollywood and television. In the military, singling out gays will result in Non-Judicial Procedures and Courts Martials. Military careers will be ruined while civilians maintain their right to ridicule and ostricize for the world's entertainment.
    Gays are also sometimes positively portrayed by Hollywood. Here is a hint: Hollywood is not the whole of the US. If I work with a gay in the civilian world and call him a dirty fag, guess what, I am probably going to be subject to discipline. My career could be ruined. And it's been like that for years. Welcome to the 21st century.

    Once again, the socially and legal ineqaulity of the unaccepted will be a civilian shame. It will be the military, once again, that leads the way.
    Really? So being in the rear is leading now?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  9. #309
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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I support getting rid of DADT and allowing gays to serve in most-if not all-military roles. Think of some poor brainwashed Islamist waiting interrogation and worrying that the guy who is going to be grilling him is Gay!!. The US military could use the homophobia intrinsic in the hard core Islamists to our benefit!
    You do know that some people are going to call you a RINO, now, don't you?
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: House approves repeal of 'don't ask, don't tell'(edited)

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    You do know that some people are going to call you a RINO, now, don't you?
    When I think RINO I think TD....
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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