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Thread: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Good post, Obama is back in campaign mode although this time he is going after the independent votes that helped elect him in 2008 by implementing more supply side economic policy knowning it will generate positive results thus giving him something positive to run on in 2012.

    That is the take on the surface, I'll give you that. However, I think it is too 'what he wants you to think' in a sense. It is the shiny distraction if you will.

    Think about it, this entire past two years events as distractions to ram through legislation that was nearly unanimously unpopular, that he didn't write, and no one actually read. Obama is the quintessential passive, aggressive Socialist crap manager. ****ting all over business one day, and having them to lunch to pat them on the back the next, all the while driving a knife in their backs.

    There is another shoe to drop, watch the left hand.


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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by SirPwn4lot View Post
    Although I disagree with a lot of the finer points, I do agree that Obama is more than likely a liar, although for different reasons, and most modern presidents do also(I don't have an example of every president from the 20th Century, so I'll refrain from saying all), and the vast, vast, vast, vast, vast majority of politicians in general, but I agree with you nonetheless.

    I disagree with the 3rd paragraph, but agree on bipartisanship. People don't want bipartisanship. They want what's right.



    Although from a budget standpoint tax cuts are not in themselves expenses, by definition... it's incorrect to state that they don't add to the deficit. Budget = Revenue - Expenses. I think this is the point the "left" is trying to make, although they're not doing a very good job of it.



    Obama has lost a significant portion of his base... let alone independents. You can't offer change, give more or less the status quo, then expect people to reelect you.

    Thanks!
    Yet tax cuts have grown revenue everytime rates were cut so higher revenue doesn't increase deficits, but higher revenues do increase spending. Bush withholding tax reduction July 2003

    Yr Tot Rev Income Tax
    2000 3,132 2202.8
    2001 3,118 2163.7
    2002 2,987 2002.1
    2003 3,043 2047.9
    2004 3,265 2213.2
    2005 3,659 2546.8
    2006 3,996 2807.4
    2007 4,197 2951.2
    2008 4,072 2790.3

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    I am left wondering a couple of things here. First, we all know that Obama is a duplicitous liar, so why this apparently broad reaching package now? What's the real end game for this guy whom didn't even tell his own leadership in the Congress that he was doing this?

    Something stinks here. Obama, and the liberals have engaged in a bitter two year class war, beating the drum endlessly about how business was bad, and that all corporations were greedy, and that they harmed the middle class, (although all the while leaving out that they are a part of the economy that creates jobs, along with small businesses).

    It just isn't kosher, Obama railed against all common sense that he wanted a tax hike on those making over $250K per year, ignoring the fact that that would hit something like 80% of small business that files their taxes at the personal rates.

    He calls not our enemies, but rather the American people "enemies, and hostage takers" all the while talking out of his ass about how he gets that the American people want more bipartisanship. He is a liar plain and simple, and to date has done a great job of outing the liars within the demo party as well.

    But as far as this goes? I don't trust Obama, or demo's as far as I can throw them....

    j-mac
    too funny........repubs get what they want, at least short term, and now they are trying to figure out how obama screwed them by letting them have what they wanted!!

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Well you got your wish, now you can stop bitching about the deficit... right? Because these tax cuts are gonna add a ****load more to it.
    No, they won't. If businesses can and do expand, and you cut unemployment in half, you can add a HUGE number of people to the taxable base AND take them off the unemployment benefits payroll.

    Of course, with 13 more months of unemployment coming, many will just choose to continue to sleep 14 hours a day and play.

    If you want to cut the deficit, the ONLY way is to drastically cut spending, primarily on wasteful and useless welfare programs. But those are the Dems pet projects they use to ensure votes.

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by SirPwn4lot View Post
    Although I disagree with a lot of the finer points, I do agree that Obama is more than likely a liar, although for different reasons, and most modern presidents do also(I don't have an example of every president from the 20th Century, so I'll refrain from saying all), and the vast, vast, vast, vast, vast majority of politicians in general, but I agree with you nonetheless.

    Saying that ALL politicians lie is in many respects not refutable, it is however troubling the reasons for those lies. Obama in my humble opinion is lying for a purpose far more destructive to this nation than those in the past.

    I disagree with the 3rd paragraph, but agree on bipartisanship. People don't want bipartisanship. They want what's right.

    What is being discussed is raising the tax rate on those making over $200 k. For those poor at math, including Ryan, $200 k is much less than $1 million, let alone millions and millions of dollars.

    The Small Business Administration defines a small business as one having less than 500 to 1,500 employees (depending on industry).

    Focusing solely on the smaller number of <500 employees, there were 12.6 million small businesses employing 0 to 500 employees in the US, using US Census Bureau statistics from 2007 (newest available).

    This represents 91% of all US businesses, small or large.

    In Ohio, there were 422,318 small businesses employing 0 to 500 employees, which equals 89% of all Ohio businesses.

    The average gross receipts of these small businesses were $905 k (US) and $925 k (Ohio).

    Tim Ryan still pushing for tax hike on small business owners - Youngstown Trumbull County Conservative | Examiner.com
    However, there is a perception among politicians and pundits that letting the top-tier tax rates expire and revert to the higher, pre-2001 levels will simply increase taxes on the wealthy. That is not true. Seventy-three percent of manufacturers file their business taxes at the individual rate - including Power Curbers Inc. Let there be no doubt, these burdensome tax increases will hit small manufacturers like us, and they will hit hard.

    As a result, instead of reinvesting, hiring and expanding, employers are going to make more cuts. This concern is not unique to us but something I hear from other manufacturers as well - forcing difficult choices regarding wages, benefits and other actions that could have negative consequences for employees. As hard as the tax increases will be on employers, they will hurt employees just as much.

    MESSINGER: Tax hikes aimed at the rich hit everyone - Washington Times
    What exactly do you disagree with? These are the facts.


    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by randel View Post
    too funny........repubs get what they want, at least short term, and now they are trying to figure out how obama screwed them by letting them have what they wanted!!
    Repubs ain't got jack ****! Obama isn't a king althoughI know good union members like yourself would like it to be so. These proposals have to pass House and Senate, and because of your demo reps it doesn't look likely.

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Repubs ain't got jack ****! Obama isn't a king althoughI know good union members like yourself would like it to be so. These proposals have to pass House and Senate, and because of your demo reps it doesn't look likely.

    j-mac
    Actually, judging by how Democrats are ripping each other to pieces right now, I think Obama has the votes to get it through. This will drive Harry, Nancy, Durbin, Wiener, Grayston, etc, insane.

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    This country doesn't have a revenue problem, it has a spending problem. So what you are saying is that every dime spent by the Federal Govt. is necessary and cannot be cut? If I have less revenue I cut spending and that happens when taxes are raised>
    But you aren't a politician spending other people's money....I think we can all agree that govt wastes the money they get, and will waste all that they get, plus more, building deficits and debt. National referendum on those issues would help, but the existing politicians will never propose it...
    Oracle of Utah
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    But you aren't a politician spending other people's money....I think we can all agree that govt wastes the money they get, and will waste all that they get, plus more, building deficits and debt. National referendum on those issues would help, but the existing politicians will never propose it...
    Then why are you wanting to give them MORE money when they've shown absolutely zero ability to actually reduce spending, stop being wasteful, and actually worry about the deficit with real actions?

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    But you aren't a politician spending other people's money....I think we can all agree that govt wastes the money they get, and will waste all that they get, plus more, building deficits and debt. National referendum on those issues would help, but the existing politicians will never propose it...
    Hence, the tea party. I don't care what "party" or group does it, we must stop electing the kind of people we have, or at least start championing those who stand for integrity in regards to our money.

    But it's just too easy to buy people's votes with promises of welfare programs. Therein lies the problem. It's those type of character flawed politicians that are so carelessly wasteful with tax revenue.

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