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Thread: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

  1. #191
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    ask and ye shall receive

    Top US Marginal Income Tax Rates, 1913--2003 (TruthAndPolitics.org)

    the first column is the year, the second is the percentage taken by the feds, the third is the level of income needed for that percentage to kick in



    1950 84.36 400,000
    1951 91 400,000
    1952 92 400,000
    1953 92 400,000
    1954 91 400,000
    1955 91 400,000
    1956 91 400,000
    1957 91 400,000
    1958 91 400,000
    1959 91 400,000
    1960 91 400,000
    1961 91 400,000
    So what happens between 250k and 400k, again deductions matter and how much govt. revenue was collected. How do you explain tax revenue going up after both the Reagan and Bush tax CUTS?

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Deductions are available to anyone. Please explain to me why 47% of the U.S. income earners didn't pay any Federal income taxes last year and that number has been high since the Bush tax cuts were signed into law. All this outrage over the rich getting bigger tax cuts but totally ignoring that the rich paid a greater share of the taxes after the Bush tax cuts. Doesn't fit your agenda, does it?
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  3. #193
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    And that naturally it would lead to my car being stolen. Cut in money given to states to pay police does not guarantee increase in crime, let alone significant enough that things such as cars being stolen are a routine enough thing that you can throw it out there as an obvious example of why it must not be cut.
    I didn't say that it was certain that your car would be stolen. It would be more likely to happen though. It was an example of what could happen. Since we are talking about the future, all we have are hypotheticals. You are trying to make it sound unreasonable when it is perfectly reasonable extrapolation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Again, you're assuming there's going to be a plethora of potholes that it is so impossible to avoid that i'm guaranteed to have a front end incident. I think that's ridiculous exaggeration.
    It's certainly a possibility. Maybe you have never driven in Chicago.

    Like I said, we are talking about hypotheticals. I got this example from a real life incident. Please don't think I mean this will happen to everyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Because there was literally 1 month to act before it went up for EVERYONE, regardless of what anyone thought. Things that have a ticking timer on them generally get tackled first.
    They still could have handled this differently. It's not like the top 2% were facing a crisis. That's what the GOP was fighting for.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Ahh, yes, I gotcha. The evil wealthy, controlling everything.

    Nevermind that by that logic if the tax rates did go up, for the top 2% or for everyone, then it'd still be decided by the Top 2%.

    Actually, by that logic, every decision made on every issue every day in the united states is only controlled by the top 2%. Funny though, I don't hear the demonization of them when the "Top 2%" pushes for health care, or the "top 2%" pushes for global warming legislation", or other sort of stuff...since you know, politicians and spin doctors = the top 2%.
    I didn't call them evil. You keep reverting back to that strawman. Not facing a crisis is not equal to evil.

    There are those in the top 2% that are fine with their taxes going up. I didn't say that those in control were the whole top 2%.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Absolutely agree with you on term limits. Beyond that though, while I agree with you with regards to voter power I think if you're taking it from that angle your use of the top 2% as a complaint is nothing but a bit of a strawman because it would apply to everything, including both sides of this particular issue.
    Only if you strawman my statements to mean that the top 2% were a homogenous group ideologically.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    I haven't heard much talk of the budget as of yet since, as I said, you had a time sensitive issue right now. Proposing an amendment concerning a balanced budget is something I'm going to watch for in the next year since I believe that was something on the Contract From America that a good deal of new house members signed onto.

    That said, you're right, often you can't help someone till they hit rock bottom. You're not going to hit rock bottom by feeding their addiction.
    I understand you not wanting to enable them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Nope, there's not. But, and I know this is likely the difference in mentalities here, I will happily take some bad times for the (large in my mind) chance that it will cause a rebound into long term good times rather than having a long, drawnout, continual decline.

    I'll take hitting rock bottom and bouncing back up then slowly floating down, down, down, without ever a hope of rising back to the top.
    I think too many people would be harmed by a complete immediate collapse of our economy and government. Of course, they really haven't proposed any remedies either way yet. Time will tell.
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    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



  4. #194
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Obama said the economy has recovered, he has saved or created millions of jobs so what triggers stopping payments to the unemployed?
    I think you are being less than honest in your paraphrasing of what Obama has said.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



  5. #195
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    So what happens between 250k and 400k, again deductions matter and how much govt. revenue was collected. How do you explain tax revenue going up after both the Reagan and Bush tax CUTS?
    I made that graph for you too bro, use it.

  6. #196
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    I think you are being less than honest in your paraphrasing of what Obama has said.
    He said he "brought us back from the brink and saved or created millions of jobs" So tell me when we stop extending unemployment payments? Why 99 months and how do we pay for it?

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by SirPwn4lot View Post
    I made that graph for you too bro, use it.
    I have used the actual data from the Treasury Dept. that is all that I have any interest in seeing and the actual bank account for the U.S. Govt. shows an increase in revenue. Why does any other matter?

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    He said he "brought us back from the brink and saved or created millions of jobs" So tell me when we stop extending unemployment payments? Why 99 months and how do we pay for it?
    You seemed unable to differentiate between statements made which apply generally to the entire nation of 310 million people and programs intended to help a small number of persons who are still unemployed and in dire economic straits.
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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    You seemed unable to differentiate between statements made which apply generally to the entire nation of 310 million people and programs intended to help a small number of persons who are still unemployed and in dire economic straits.
    Small number of people? 16+ million? 4 million more since Obama took office? Those dire economic straits show a recession ending in June 2009.

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    Re: Obama Announces 'Framework' for Deal With Congress to Extend Bush-Era Tax Cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    He said he "brought us back from the brink and saved or created millions of jobs" So tell me when we stop extending unemployment payments? Why 99 months and how do we pay for it?
    99 months??? didnt realize it was that long..lol

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