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North Korea reportedly fires at South

Which is why they'll take the North Koreans and go no further. It simply isn't in their interests to face the United States and her allies in a military conflict.

The Communist Chinese are going to invade the Communist North Koreans? That makes zero sense, bro.
 
No, not with this administration.

What I meant was regardless of what Obama says and wants to do, when the first shots are fired, the Military goes into automatic. No one, and nothing an stop it. It'd be the same if the Soviets attacked West Germany, the President can't do anything, all he can do is wait for the first waves of the enemy to go down, and then asses our position.

The first waves of North Koreans would die, and they wouldn't have a lot more to throw at us; the Chinese would be closing on Pyongyang from the North, and the USAF would destroy anything and everything with wheels/tracks.
 
You're thinking like a westerner.

It's not like the U.S.--with our lilly-livered prez--and those dipsticks in NATO have announced from a position of strength. They can't even conjer up a strategy to defeat the Taliban. Why should China be afraid of them coming up with a plan to defeat the Chinese Army? I mean, hell, our current president will be wanting to read Chi-com soldiers their Miranda rights on the battlefield.

Has anyone told you lately that you are a special waste of space? Goochie, goochie

When I read threads/comments like these, I start to understand the position of the Al-Qaeda.

Please tell me our nation really is not full of ignorant, self interested, gluts. Please learn a little about foreign policy and international relations before you make a fool of yourself.

-your Father
 
The Communist Chinese are going to invade the Communist North Koreans? That makes zero sense, bro.

Not at all. Look at how China has been treating the DPRK. They've been basically treating them like a little brother thats getting out of hand. And eventually, the little brother is going to piss off China's business partners, and the Chinese are going to beat on them.

Just because they're both Commies means nothing. Under Kruschev, the USSR had real tense with China, and built up a lot of military infrastructure for the explicit purpose of going to war with China.
 
Has anyone told you lately that you are a special waste of space? Goochie, goochie

When I read threads/comments like these, I start to understand the position of the Al-Qaeda.

Please tell me our nation really is not full of ignorant, self interested, gluts. Please learn a little about foreign policy and international relations before you make a fool of yourself.

-your Father

Why, yes, in this very thread, as a matter of fact.
 
Moderator's Warning:
Let's all knock it off with the baiting and personal attacks. Civilly debate the topic at hand and cease with the attacks.
 
This is quite scary, if this ends up being a full scale war on the Korean Peninsula the U.S. will most likely be dragged into a second Korean War, but this time instead of Communist Russia backing the North it will be the Chinese that practically own us and since we already are in two wars I dont think we would be able to win this and China could see this as a way to take us down for good economically and possibly through force given the chance and depending on if this escalates to full scale war. This could in the long run and if it escalates be the beginning of the end of America......just my two cents.
 
Ok. Do you understand the difference between Facism and Communism?

yes I do

It deals generally with the ownership of private property. Communism tends to be against it, while Facism tends to rather protect it.

China has gone from being a country with almost no private ownership of property to a huge amount of private property, the number of billionaries, millionaries and overall wealth of many Chinese is growing at a fast rate. The number of privately owned homes has increased dramatically, along with privately owned business small and large. It still is a dictatorship of course and one that bends both the private sector and still considerable public sector to do the states wish`s


It truely resembles the system of Chile under Pinochet then any communist country
 
This is quite scary, if this ends up being a full scale war on the Korean Peninsula the U.S. will most likely be dragged into a second Korean War, but this time instead of Communist Russia backing the North it will be the Chinese that practically own us and since we already are in two wars I dont think we would be able to win this and China could see this as a way to take us down for good economically and possibly through force given the chance and depending on if this escalates to full scale war. This could in the long run and if it escalates be the beginning of the end of America......just my two cents.

Last time, it was the Chinese who attacked us as we approached their border, not the Russians. The Koreans were a buffer for both sides, and that buffer balance was upset by the DPRK when they attacked South Korea. Todays scenario is completely different. China will not, for at least a decade, confront the U.S. openly, because then we don't owe them any money, and we get a chance to destroy their factories, and kill their people. It is against their interests to support the DPRK militarily.
 
Why, sure they have. It's usually some stupid asshole that has nothing else to say and bases his argument on revised historical bull****.

Uh huh. Thanks for verifying you are a chronologically or mentally a teenager.
 
yes I do

It deals generally with the ownership of private property. Communism tends to be against it, while Facism tends to rather protect it.

China has gone from being a country with almost no private ownership of property to a huge amount of private property, the number of billionaries, millionaries and overall wealth of many Chinese is growing at a fast rate. The number of privately owned homes has increased dramatically, along with privately owned business small and large. It still is a dictatorship of course and one that bends both the private sector and still considerable public sector to do the states wish`s


It truely resembles the system of Chile under Pinochet then any communist country

You're sorta right. While Communism is about government ownership of all property, Facism allows the ownership of property, but the government dictates what you do with that property. Ultimately, there isn't mucha difference. Personally, I prefer full-blown, unbridled capitalism and entrepreneurship.
 
Last time, it was the Chinese who attacked us as we approached their border, not the Russians. The Koreans were a buffer for both sides, and that buffer balance was upset by the DPRK when they attacked South Korea. Todays scenario is completely different. China will not, for at least a decade, confront the U.S. openly, because then we don't owe them any money, and we get a chance to destroy their factories, and kill their people. It is against their interests to support the DPRK militarily.


I seem to remember a certain U.S. general saying the exact same thing back in 1950.
 
Has anyone told you lately that you are a special waste of space? Goochie, goochie

When I read threads/comments like these, I start to understand the position of the Al-Qaeda.

Please tell me our nation really is not full of ignorant, self interested, gluts. Please learn a little about foreign policy and international relations before you make a fool of yourself.

-your Father

Sounds like two grade schoolers playing battleship doesn't it? :lamo:lamo:lamo
 
Last time, it was the Chinese who attacked us as we approached their border, not the Russians. The Koreans were a buffer for both sides, and that buffer balance was upset by the DPRK when they attacked South Korea. Todays scenario is completely different. China will not, for at least a decade, confront the U.S. openly, because then we don't owe them any money, and we get a chance to destroy their factories, and kill their people. It is against their interests to support the DPRK militarily.

hmmm intresting good points.
 
I'm fixin' to be 42. And you are?

42 chronologically that is.

I'm still young enough to be redeployed to load munitions on aircraft if we end up in three wars. We'll be spread pretty thin.
 
yes I do

It deals generally with the ownership of private property. Communism tends to be against it, while Facism tends to rather protect it.

China has gone from being a country with almost no private ownership of property to a huge amount of private property, the number of billionaries, millionaries and overall wealth of many Chinese is growing at a fast rate. The number of privately owned homes has increased dramatically, along with privately owned business small and large. It still is a dictatorship of course and one that bends both the private sector and still considerable public sector to do the states wish`s


It truely resembles the system of Chile under Pinochet then any communist country

Your wasting your time LT. You're so far above him intellectually he probably can't understand a word you say.
 
42 chronologically that is.

I'm still young enough to be redeployed to load munitions on aircraft if we end up in three wars. We'll be spread pretty thin.

And, I'm just a teeanager?

What? We're supposed to feel sorry for you, because you got some POG MOS in the what? Navy? Air Force? I doubt you'll see much trigger time, so don't sweat it, kid.
 
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I would't be so sure, SK's president is calling for a "enormous retaliation" now:

After North Korean strike, South Korean leader threatens 'retaliation'

After North Korean strike, South Korean leader threatens 'retaliation' - CNN.com

Even the strongest political leaders have a point where they can't be seen as constantly taking it on the chin and their patience has been tried too far.

Leaders talk and very rarely follow through. In a situation like this where the potential damage is much greater it is even more the case.

If you were China, right now, you would be sticking with your Communist brothers. What's China going to do? Abandon NorKo and allow them to be overwhlemed by the Democratic South Korea?

Some folks need a serious history lesson, prior to posting on this issue.

China was never and has never been committed to that notion of communist solidarity. Even the alliance with Stalin was difficult to get done and had our troops not parked ourselves right on the Yalu River and officials had not been jabbering about going to China next the Chinese probably would not have intervened directly.

Today? The state of things has changed. China and the U.S. have far more reason to get along than to get in a fight, North Korea is now even more of a liability, and in the long run South Korea will leave our orbit and enter China's. That does not mean China has no interest at the moment in keeping North Korea around, but if they start making a scene you are more likely to see Chinese tanks rolling into Pyongyang to stop the North rather than assist them.
 
I seem to remember a certain U.S. general saying the exact same thing back in 1950.

That doesn't mean we're wrong this time. Back then, we were in a Cold War, of Capitalism vs. Communism. Now, China has combined a free market with communist regulations, and if it attacks the largest free market in the world, its free market is giong to collapse. Remember, the United States represents the demand for their country's goods, and they lose that if we got to war.
 
That's the downside to all out war. However I'm thinking there may be a contingency plan in place that could hit NK so hard and so fast and so devistatingly it may preclude that with some luck. But Seoul is so close to the DMZ it would be hard to pull off. It would have to be a surprise attack of massive force. Stealth bombers would be the way to go. Not sure if we would bring them in theater though, and I know SK doesn't have any of their own.

Problem is, no matter how fast, the North Koreans would get at least one NUKE off. Where, is anyones guess? I see troops on the ground to pull something that quick and devastating off. All combined forces aworking as one, and it would require a good amount of NATO, if not UN (Smirk) support. Problem is that to drum up that support, NK will have time. Time to prepare. That said, I don't see how, without China's help, North Korea suvives a modern invasion. Yes, they do damage (A lesson for ever allowing Iran to get NUKES), but NK would cease to exist. The damage they inflict on some unsuspecting nation, Japan perhaps, is weighed against the effort to remove the regime, and replace it. Is it worth it? There are a great many people with more information than I that are debating that very subject right now.

Obama, on the other hand, is thnking politically. Politcs will direct his decision, and if it turns out in his mind that politically, it's best to play hardball with more sanctions, then that is what it will be. All the while, making it even more difficult for the next President to resolve.


My guess is that the Norht Korean army would provide stiff resistance at first, but then buckle as their lines of communication get cut. Just like what happened in Iraq.



Tim-
 
Anyone beside myself think that maybe the ole man has died and the son has take over?
 
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