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Thread: North Korea reportedly fires at South

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    ok, let's run with your premise that the USA is the real key and can assert its power to effect change in NK
    what exactly does the USA do to alter NK's ways?
    i look forward to your response
    I would think its obvious. We could try assassinating their military brass and top politicians like in Iraq, and destroy their artillery/missiles. After that, if they still want to go at it, they can proceed with a ground attack, die, and then we counterattack until they don't have the military capacity to continue fighting. And then we take Pyongyang. If we are willing to do whatever to crush this problem.

    More likely than not, we're going to piss them off with our war games, stay prepared, and use China's inaction against them. It doesn't matter what anyone tells us we're doing wrong, thats about as close to war as we can go without declaring it. Even then, the DPRK could declare on us and the ROK. In which case we could go straight to the defensive stance, and South Korea's going to get mauled bad.
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    ok, let's run with your premise that the USA is the real key and can assert its power to effect change in NK
    what exactly does the USA do to alter NK's ways?
    i look forward to your response
    They tell them that any further aggression will result in a declaration of war, and mean it.

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    ok, let's run with your premise that the USA is the real key and can assert its power to effect change in NK
    what exactly does the USA do to alter NK's ways?
    i look forward to your response
    Considering how economically tied China and America are, it is in the interest of both that North Korea behave. China knows this and America knows this. As China's economy widens, it will embrace more and more capitalism (as it has proven to do already). In order to allow capitalist expansion, in which to continue to compete with America, China will have to loosen civil rights prescriptions. Neither want to disrupt current ties and this means that North Korea would be sacrificed if it came down to it. North Korea is today's example of the future.

    As the rest (China, India, Brazil) rises to meet America's economic power, America and China are going to be key in most matters. Western Europe and Russia may not like it, but the future is the American/Chinese team.
    Last edited by MSgt; 11-27-10 at 12:15 PM.

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    I would think its obvious. We could try assassinating their military brass and top politicians like in Iraq, and destroy their artillery/missiles. After that, if they still want to go at it, they can proceed with a ground attack, die, and then we counterattack until they don't have the military capacity to continue fighting. And then we take Pyongyang. If we are willing to do whatever to crush this problem.

    More likely than not, we're going to piss them off with our war games, stay prepared, and use China's inaction against them. It doesn't matter what anyone tells us we're doing wrong, thats about as close to war as we can go without declaring it. Even then, the DPRK could declare on us and the ROK. In which case we could go straight to the defensive stance, and South Korea's going to get mauled bad.
    South Korea would get mauled either way.

    South Korea should be the one to determine how much of a response is made, as they will be the ones to suffer the effects of NK response
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    South Korea would get mauled either way.

    South Korea should be the one to determine how much of a response is made, as they will be the ones to suffer the effects of NK response
    North Korea is the Saddam Hussein scenario of Asia. North Korea is on record for antagonizing Japan as well. In the event of North Korean defense, retaliation, or plain nuclear launch, it is more than South Koea that will suffer. That's a whole lot of economic and environmental destruction that neither China nor America would not want to see. A nuclear North Korea has always been more than just dangerous to South Korea.

    Any South Korean determination of response is and always has been limited. South Korea would not be in this alone. The U.S. would (as alway) be the largest active military to engage the North Koreans. It is our obligation to bleed for the rest of you. None of America's allies have the right to determine absolute activity if they want Americans to bleed for them. That's the give and take. That's the price of relying so strongly on a big brother that understands obligation.
    Last edited by MSgt; 11-27-10 at 12:26 PM.

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    North Korea is the Saddam Hussein scenario of Asia. North Korea is on record for antagonizing Japan as well. In the event of North Korean defense, retaliation, or plain nuclear launch, it is more than South Koea that will suffer. That's a whole lot of economic and environmental destruction that neither China nor America would not want to see. A nuclear North Korea has always been more than just dangerous to South Korea.

    Any South Korean determination of response is and always has been limited.
    I am specifically talking about the response to this issue

    However given that any military campaign that involves ground forces would have to use SK territory as a staging ground, they can effectively control that aspect of any response. Air, and naval resposes of course would be out of their control
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    i see your post and recognize that other than insisting china will have to loosen civil rights (for God only knows what reason), you have posted NOTHING else specific which must be done to cause NK to change its ways, and absolutely nothing that the USA would be required to do to accomplish that end

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Considering how economically tied China and America are, it is in the interest of both that North Korea behave. China knows this and America knows this. As China's economy widens, it will embrace more and more capitalism (as it has proven to do already). In order to allow capitalist expansion, in which to continue to compete with America, China will have to loosen civil rights prescriptions. Neither want to disrupt current ties and this means that North Korea would be sacrificed if it came down to it. North Korea is today's example of the future.

    As the rest (China, India, Brazil) rises to meet America's economic power, America and China are going to be key in most matters. Western Europe and Russia may not like it, but the future is the American/Chinese team.
    we will soon be eclipsed by china economically
    we will remain a nation strong militarily, but it will not be surprising if our role changes such that our economic might, which prevailed in the USA-ussr cold war, will then favor china during the approaching chinese-USA cold war
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    I am specifically talking about the response to this issue
    This issue is the same as any. If Americans are obligated to bleed, then South Koreans only have so much to determine. If we say "no" then South Korea is without big brother. Not even Europeans would play this game.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    However given that any military campaign that involves ground forces would have to use SK territory as a staging ground, they can effectively control that aspect of any response. Air, and naval resposes of course would be out of their control
    American troops have occupied South Korea since it was carved in half. This is the same scenario that Germany was in for 46 years. If it came down to having to defend South Korea, an "OK" is all South Korea is afforded. America would take it from there.

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    QUOTE Grant

    Perhaps this is because Liberals tend to be for wars, and vote for them, until they are soon against them.
    Of course you can document these strawman that you have built.


    They will refuse to see any war through to completion by always looking for "withdrawal" dates, and will not support their leaders should the American people dare elect a Republican.
    First, this imaginary they, who is THEY? I need something other than a strawman named “THEY” before I can reply. Take another sip of Kool-Aid and come up with something that makes at least a smidgen of sense.
    Last edited by Donc; 11-27-10 at 12:52 PM.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    i see your post and recognize that other than insisting china will have to loosen civil rights (for God only knows what reason), you have posted NOTHING else specific which must be done to cause NK to change its ways, and absolutely nothing that the USA would be required to do to accomplish that end
    If you looked past your nose, you'd figure out why
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