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Thread: North Korea reportedly fires at South

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Both of these things can be true. We're assholes, AND they're lunatics.
    (although they aren't suicidal)
    Some of them are lunatics, more than we have, because we tend to turn our lunatics into scapegoats who don't get re-elected. I'm not going to lie, I think Kim Jung Il is the biggest problem there, because he seems to be a lunatic and is in charge.
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter
    Some of them are lunatics, more than we have, because we tend to turn our lunatics into scapegoats who don't get re-elected. I'm not going to lie, I think Kim Jung Il is the biggest problem there, because he seems to be a lunatic and is in charge.
    How is he a lunatic?
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    My guess is that the Norht Korean army would provide stiff resistance at first, but then buckle as their lines of communication get cut. Just like what happened in Iraq.
    Are you talking about in 1991 or 2003? I do not think the situation is even remotely comparable in either case, but even less so for 2003 in Iraq. North Korea is in many ways a military state. They been preparing for war for decades and have over a million troops with, as I recall, over 100,000 special forces. Obviously in a war with the U.S. they will lose (even with just South Korea they would likely lose), but it will be far bloodier than either war with Iraq. Never mind that any war will not involve us pounding them for a month before any ground forces get involved.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Japan was the largest buyer of American scrap metal, in the world...prior to 1941.
    Japan's interest strongly clashed with our own, as such there was a greater incentive for war.
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    How is he a lunatic?
    Top 10 Crazy Facts About Kim Jong Il As it says on the site, the last 5 are true. Some of them just seem something that a Communist leader would do, out of a need to control the masses. Not to mention the fact that his life has been rather sheltered, not as much as his son, but that type of environment builds a huge ego. And like all politicians, I'm sure he surrounds himself with Yes men to make him feel good.

    He has also consistently put the military before the people, who have been starving for decades. I'd say all of those things compounded would make him out of touch with reality, to say the least.
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter
    Top 10 Crazy Facts About Kim Jong Il As it says on the site, the last 5 are true. Some of them just seem something that a Communist leader would do, out of a need to control the masses. Not to mention the fact that his life has been rather sheltered, not as much as his son, but that type of environment builds a huge ego. And like all politicians, I'm sure he surrounds himself with Yes men to make him feel good.
    I don't see how any of those make him crazy, or a lunatic. Most of those are just regarding the cult of personality that the bureaucracy has developed around himself.

    He has also consistently put the military before the people, who have been starving for decades. I'd say all of those things compounded would make him out of touch with reality, to say the least.
    Quite the contrary, I think it shows that he, as a politician, is deeply grounded in reality. States the world over continually put the interests of this or that group over the interests of the people over which it resides. That does not make said politicians lunatics. That makes them politicians.

    Moreover, I think that his role in the government, much like any dictator, is greatly exaggerated by both North Korean sources (who wish to portray this in a good manner) and foreign sources (who wish to portray it in a bad manner).

    I think people portray in their mind whenever they picture a dictatorship some kind of 1984-esque situation where the government is omniscient and omnipresent, and where the common man works long hours for little pay to purchase substandard goods, and that he is threatened at every corner with banishment to the work camps or execution for any single word that escapes his mouth that could be construed as in opposition to the current order, and that the police come and beat him up and take all his stuff whenever they want, etc... In reality that really isn't the case.
    Last edited by Khayembii Communique; 11-24-10 at 01:59 AM.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post

    I think people portray in their mind whenever they picture a dictatorship some kind of 1984-esque situation where the government is omniscient and omnipresent, and where the common man works long hours for little pay to purchase substandard goods, and that he is threatened at every corner with banishment to the work camps or execution for any single word that escapes his mouth that could be construed as in opposition to the current order, and that the police come and beat him up and take all his stuff whenever they want, etc... In reality that really isn't the case.
    lol

    That is exactly the case in North Korea.

    Human rights in North Korea - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Banishment to work camps?

    North Korean Prison Camp Escapee Tells of Horrors, Worries About Those Left Behind - washingtonpost.com

    That from an actual escapee. But, oh, things are fine in North Korea...

    Songun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    It is very obvious that the military-first 'Songun' policy has had overwhelmingly deleterious effects for the general population in a resource-starved country such as North Korea. It's not a question of states putting one interest group or another first, it is a question of why this particular country has implemented a system which so egregiously harms anyone who is not in the military.

    Seriously, how can you defend in any way this sickening regime?
    Last edited by Yossarian; 11-24-10 at 02:20 AM.

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post

    Quite the contrary, I think it shows that he, as a politician, is deeply grounded in reality. States the world over continually put the interests of this or that group over the interests of the people over which it resides. That does not make said politicians lunatics. That makes them politicians.

    Not when he puts his own interests above the interests of the people. Not when he disregards the suffering of his own people to satisfy his need of attention/revenge/assertion of power.

    North Korean citizens are as much a victim in this as anyone else.

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Seriously, how can you defend in any way this sickening regime?
    Lol I'm not, that's your delusion not mine. Why didn't you just come out and ask "why do you hate freedom?"

    Quote Originally Posted by Animus
    Not when he puts his own interests above the interests of the people. Not when he disregards the suffering of his own people to satisfy his need of attention/revenge/assertion of power.
    Neither of those make him a lunatic first off, and second he is part of a bureaucracy which is an entire stratification in its own right. "He" is not the one implementing policy, the bureaucracy is, and that is what I am saying people lose sight of. What we are talking about is a North Korean Thermidor.
    Last edited by Khayembii Communique; 11-24-10 at 02:36 AM.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Hello everybody. I'm back for those who know me. After watching thenews on Yeonpyongdo (Yeonpyong Island),it made my blood boil and made me return to this forum after leaving

    Some facts about the attack
    The North Koren artillery attacked Yeonpyong Island between 2:34pm to 2:50pm (Korean time) We responded by K-9 howitzers raining upon them artillery shells (much more advanced equipment I might add)
    2 marines dead
    2 civilians disappeared
    19 injured

    The theory of why it happened:
    1. a few days ago, a new nuclear facility was discovered in North Kore. I think the attack was meant to turn off attention from the facility or maybe we were on the verge of discovering something new. Maybe to divert attention

    2. The Lee-Myung-Bak administration was the first modern administration to take an aggressive stance against NK. NK responded first by the Cheonan incident, and now this. I think that they taking what they think is defensive stance

    3. Kim-Jong-Uen is about to take power. Yet many think that there's competition for power inside. To assert his power, I think Kim-Jong-Uen orchestrated this attack (many also suspect him of orchestrating the Cheonan incident for the same reason)

    All three theories are the most likeliest one. I think that the first one is the likeiest. It is too much to be a coincidence
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    Re: North Korea reportedly fires at South

    Quote Originally Posted by Proud South Korean View Post
    Hello everybody. I'm back for those who know me. After watching thenews on Yeonpyongdo (Yeonpyong Island),it made my blood boil and made me return to this forum after leaving

    Some facts about the attack
    The North Koren artillery attacked Yeonpyong Island between 2:34pm to 2:50pm (Korean time) We responded by K-9 howitzers raining upon them artillery shells (much more advanced equipment I might add)
    2 marines dead
    2 civilians disappeared
    19 injured

    The theory of why it happened:
    1. a few days ago, a new nuclear facility was discovered in North Kore. I think the attack was meant to turn off attention from the facility or maybe we were on the verge of discovering something new. Maybe to divert attention

    2. The Lee-Myung-Bak administration was the first modern administration to take an aggressive stance against NK. NK responded first by the Cheonan incident, and now this. I think that they taking what they think is defensive stance

    3. Kim-Jong-Uen is about to take power. Yet many think that there's competition for power inside. To assert his power, I think Kim-Jong-Uen orchestrated this attack (many also suspect him of orchestrating the Cheonan incident for the same reason)

    All three theories are the most likeliest one. I think that the first one is the likeiest. It is too much to be a coincidence

    Okay fine, I say let people on the Korean peninsula take care of it.

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