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Thread: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by zip98053 View Post
    An Obama is right. Seems that the conservative definition of "compromise" is "do it my way". Obama needs to stand up to the people who do nothing but demand compromise and even when a compromise if offered, it isn't enough. It will never be enough for the dogmatic Republicans and Obama needs to side with the major of Americans who believe that, given the excessive deficit, letting the tax cuts for the wealthy laps is the right thing to do.

    Poll: Most Americans Want Tax Cuts for the Rich to Expire - Political Hotsheet - CBS News


    The Plum Line - New poll: Tax cut fight is winner for Dems in battleground states


    Gallup poll finds majority favor ending tax cuts for the rich - The Hill's On The Money

    It will be a very interesting game of chicken. Obama will accept extensions for everyone but the wealthy and the Republicans hold out for the wealthy. If the cuts laps because of the lack of "compromise" who is going to get skewered? Not Obama. The Republicans refusal to compromise on this issue at the expense of the vast majority of Americans probably will not sit all that well with the 95% of people who will see their taxes go up because the Republicans are looking out for their wealthy buddies (and themselves).
    class warfare is the dem elites stock in trade. people who don't pay taxes should have no say in the rates of income tax others pay.



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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    class warfare is the dem elites stock in trade. people who don't pay taxes should have no say in the rates of income tax others pay.
    First, it is actually the Republicans who are the champions of class warfare. They conduct it and it is the Democrats who try to keep the wealthy from winning the battle. So far, the Republicans have done a much better job of conducting the class warfare as is evidence from the growing gap between the rich and poor in this country.

    Next, I pay taxes, and I'm in the group of people would have to pay more under the Obama plan. I say, let them laps.

    Finally, Congress decides about taxes. All the voters get to do is elect the members of Congress. I suspect that if Congress doesn't behave sensibly, the voters will take action, just like they did this year.

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    ROTFLOL... you might THINK you're not a socialist, but you line up on that side over, and over and over.

    It must be terrible when you've been fooling yourself and are the last person to know the truth about yourself. But you're young. You've got time to learn about yourself.

    As for Universal Healthcare, it is a vile socialist program where the government acts as an intermediary to remove wealth from one group and give it to another. It's slow, corrupt, centralized and inefficient. It's why the Quebec Supreme Court ruled waiting lists do not constitute care. And why Kanuckistani's go to the US for serious and not so serious medical conditions. All this rot in not too many decades!!! OH! Kanuckistan!

    Milton Friedman called pre-ObamaKare "communist" in nature.

    Welcome to your Socialist Outing Party!

    As for your little chart, Americans try to and do save lives that other countries call lost causes.

    J-Mac,
    Not only countries have found the system unsustainable, slow and corrupt, but it's been the bane of auto companies in the US.



    .
    You can't be a socialist and also a communist.

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    But 100% true.

    I'm disinclined to become involved in a battle of wits with an unarmed person.
    Last edited by zip98053; 11-23-10 at 12:38 AM.

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean_H View Post
    You can't be a socialist and also a communist.
    Marx saw socialism as a necessary transition between capitalism and communism.

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by zip98053 View Post
    First, it is actually the Republicans who are the champions of class warfare. They conduct it and it is the Democrats who try to keep the wealthy from winning the battle. So far, the Republicans have done a much better job of conducting the class warfare as is evidence from the growing gap between the rich and poor in this country.

    Next, I pay taxes, and I'm in the group of people would have to pay more under the Obama plan. I say, let them laps.

    Finally, Congress decides about taxes. All the voters get to do is elect the members of Congress. I suspect that if Congress doesn't behave sensibly, the voters will take action, just like they did this year.
    thanks for that admission. the rich prosper because they engage in behaviour that society finds valuable be it investing, playing a guitar, throwing a baseball, making a movie, or building a company that sells a product many want. That isn't committing warfare against the poor anymore than a hard working student getting an A average is waging war against the slackers and dullards who can manage only a D avereage. You admit that the dems then try to keep the wealthy from "winning" meaning the dems try to handicap and hamstring those who wn.

    Let them laps? OMG

    And you are naive if you think that tax policy doesn't influence how people vote. If it didn't, your dem masters wouldn't constantly whine that the rich need to pay more taxes.



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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by zip98053 View Post
    I'm disinclined to become involved in a battle of wits with an unarmed person.
    its funny but many liberals have this attitude towards those of us who don't need the government to take care of us. How is craving a nanny state indicative of intelligence?



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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    thanks for that admission. the rich prosper because they engage in behavior that society finds valuable be it investing, playing a guitar, throwing a baseball, making a movie, or building a company that sells a product many want. That isn't committing warfare against the poor anymore than a hard working student getting an A average is waging war against the slackers and dullards who can manage only a D average. You admit that the dems then try to keep the wealthy from "winning" meaning the dems try to handicap and hamstring those who wn.
    Nice misdirection. This isn't about the small percentage of folks who are in the entertainment or even those folks who build a company from scratch. There are too few of them to matter. This is about those folks who make money by moving money. It is about those folks who invent new investment schemes and get some rating company to declare it investment grade so that people like me who just want some safe place for their 401K dollars to go will invest, even though the investment is garbage. It is about those CEOs who have their pay set by other CEOs and who get inflated salaries so that it becomes the norm, for CEOs. It is about the hedge fund managers who get to claim all their income is capital gains. Fundamentally, it is about all those assholes who took the economy to the brink so that they could make a buck. I want to see them taxed. I am willing to pay more just to see those bastards pay more.

    It is not true that people accumulate wealth because their contribution to society is of value to society. It is naive to think that there is a correlation.


    Let them laps? OMG
    I would like to buy a vowel. (I'll also stop looking to correct your spelling mistakes and will be glad to ridicule you for a typo in the future).

    And you are naive if you think that tax policy doesn't influence how people vote. If it didn't, your dem masters wouldn't constantly whine that the rich need to pay more taxes.
    I don't think that I said anything to imply that tax policy doesn't influence voting. I think that it affects voting quite a bit which is why I think that the Republicans might end up regretting their defense of the tax breaks for the wealthy.

    I will admit that Democrats are fricking awful at finding the sound bytes that help them frame their arguments for the masses. The Republicans are much, much better at this. Instead of letting the Republican's frame this as a tax increase, the Democrats should call this what it is, a termination of the tax breaks for the wealthy.

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    its funny but many liberals have this attitude toward those of us who don't need the government to take care of us. How is craving a nanny state indicative of intelligence?
    Why is if that so many conservatives think that, because they can't feel anything for anyone other than themselves, that no one else can either. The Constitution says "promote the general welfare" which means ALL of us.

    I know that we aren't all given the same opportunities in this life. I also know that sometimes people need help. It is in my best interest that people are given help when they need it. It is cheaper to give people help when they need it than it is to defend myself from those people when they feel that they need to attack me for their survival.

    I don't need the government to do anything for me, other than to make sure that people who will do anything to make money don't do something that will threaten my life or my nest egg.

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    Re: Obama's Democrats in disarray over expiring tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by zip98053 View Post
    An Obama is right. Seems that the conservative definition of "compromise" is "do it my way". Obama needs to stand up to the people who do nothing but demand compromise and even when a compromise if offered, it isn't enough. It will never be enough for the dogmatic Republicans and Obama needs to side with the major of Americans who believe that, given the excessive deficit, letting the tax cuts for the wealthy laps is the right thing to do.

    Poll: Most Americans Want Tax Cuts for the Rich to Expire - Political Hotsheet - CBS News


    The Plum Line - New poll: Tax cut fight is winner for Dems in battleground states


    Gallup poll finds majority favor ending tax cuts for the rich - The Hill's On The Money

    It will be a very interesting game of chicken. Obama will accept extensions for everyone but the wealthy and the Republicans hold out for the wealthy. If the cuts laps because of the lack of "compromise" who is going to get skewered? Not Obama. The Republicans refusal to compromise on this issue at the expense of the vast majority of Americans probably will not sit all that well with the 95% of people who will see their taxes go up because the Republicans are looking out for their wealthy buddies (and themselves).
    Obama has never compromised in fact he has a habit of shutting out the GOP

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