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Terrorist found not guilty

j-mac said:
That's how I see it. But as usual you jump to the lib defense.....Look Ikari I don't have any particular beef with anyone in here, but I will say what I think and an opinion is neither true or false, it is what it is....Now I suppose you can insert your little insult here.


j-mac
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I don't jump to either side. But people were bitching how some are saying "It's all Bush's fault", and I was merely reminding people that they pulled the same card with the It's all Clinton's fault crap that went on for the first half of Bush's presidency. It's the same crap. Partisan hackery and nothing more.
 
It's William the Conqueror's fault. He really is the hard stop of responsibility.
 
I don't jump to either side. But people were bitching how some are saying "It's all Bush's fault", and I was merely reminding people that they pulled the same card with the It's all Clinton's fault crap that went on for the first half of Bush's presidency. It's the same crap. Partisan hackery and nothing more.
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Personally I blame the American people when things go wrong. When you have power over something you have responsibility for it, and all political authority proceeds from the people.

Americans seem to want their representatives to tailor economic, cultural, and political realities according to their tastes, down to the letter. Even a tyrant wouldn't enjoy the level of control necessary to make Americans happy. And yet, in spite of their lofty demands, they contribute very little to the political process.
 
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j-mac said:
Yeah wow. Truth hurts don't it.


j-mac
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Lol, I can't even respond dude. I'm not mad or anything like that. I stand in awe. You have truly brought debating to an art form. I am thoroughly disappointed in myself for even trying to debate you. Remember, if anyone else criticizes your posts or debate style, it must be because they're jealous. No other reasonable explanation...
 
Morality Games said:
Personally I blame the American people when things go wrong. When you have power over something you have responsibility for it, and all political authority proceeds from the people.
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Ok, yes. Ultimately all responsibility and blame does fall upon us. We're the ones who are supposed to control government and ensure that it is properly limited. When things start breaking down, it is due to our negligence.

"I apprehend no danger to our country from a foreign foe . . . Our destruction, should it come at all, will be from another quarter. From the inattention of the people to the concerns of their government, from their carelessness and negligence, I must confess that I do apprehend some danger. I fear that they may place too implicit a confidence in their public servants, and fail properly to scrutinize their conduct; that in this way they may be made the dupes of designing men, and become the instruments of their own undoing. Make them intelligent, and they will be vigilant; give them the means of detecting the wrong, and they will apply the remedy."
— Daniel Webster
 
Ikari said:
I don't jump to either side. But people were bitching how some are saying "It's all Bush's fault", and I was merely reminding people that they pulled the same card with the It's all Clinton's fault crap that went on for the first half of Bush's presidency. It's the same crap. Partisan hackery and nothing more.
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At least Bush never said that it was Clinton's fault. Bush is a classy guy and assumes his responsibility like a grown man. This pathetic cry baby just won't do the same, he needs to grow up or have his diaper changed.
 
Ikari said:
Are people's memories so short? How about during the vast majority of Bush's first term when it was All Clinton's Fault? You think the left has a monopoly on partisan crap? Like hell. Both sides are well versed in the stupidity of partisan rhetoric.
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Nothing compared to the steady whinning about Bush for the past 2 years and over 1 year of solid campaigning from the big cry baby Obama. I am going to send him a two years supply of pampers and some kleenex.
 
Red Crow said:
At least Bush never said that it was Clinton's fault. Bush is a classy guy and assumes his responsibility like a grown man. This pathetic cry baby just won't do the same, he needs to grow up or have his diaper changed.
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Bush says he inherited recession - Aug. 7, 2002
Bush blames Clinton for Recession.

Bush Faults Clinton Policy, But the Debate is Complex - washingtonpost.com
Bush blames Clinton for North Korean nuclear weapons

Quoting George W. Bush about 9/11:

They looked at our response after the hostage crisis in Iran, the bombings of the Marine barracks in Lebanon, the first World Trade Center attack, the killing of American soldiers in Somalia, the destruction of two U.S. embassies in Africa, and the attack on the USS Cole. They concluded that free societies lacked the courage and character to defend themselves against a determined enemy.
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Seems to me that he and his adminitration spent a lot of time blaming Clinton for everything that went wrong during their time in office. Hell, they try to blame the 2nd recession that started six years into their term on Clinton and everyone before them.
 
FilmFestGuy said:
Bush says he inherited recession - Aug. 7, 2002
Bush blames Clinton for Recession.

Bush Faults Clinton Policy, But the Debate is Complex - washingtonpost.com
Bush blames Clinton for North Korean nuclear weapons

Quoting George W. Bush about 9/11:



Seems to me that he and his adminitration spent a lot of time blaming Clinton for everything that went wrong during their time in office. Hell, they try to blame the 2nd recession that started six years into their term on Clinton and everyone before them.
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He blamed Clinton but not for over 3 CONSTANT years like baby Obama has and he will still blame Bush for the next 2 years AND if Obama gets reelected he will still blame Bush for another 4 years. I guarantee it.

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Red Crow said:
He blamed Clinton but not for over 3 CONSTANT years like baby Obama has and he will still blame Bush for the next 2 years AND if Obama gets reelected he will still blame Bush for another 4 years. I guarantee it.

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Uhhh...really? You just said Bush manned up and took responsibility, so I don't get your argument now. He only blamed Clinton some of the time?

And, in case you didn't realize it, Obama hasn't been in office for 2 years yet (the 2-year anniversary will happen on January 20, 2011).
 
OscarB63 said:
… people alway whine and cry about how the system sucks because sometimes an innocent person is convicted. how about all those times where some guilty POS is released due to some bull**** technicality?
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It's a free country, whine all you like.

The American justice system says that it is the prosecution's responsibility to prove the guilt of the accused and that the accused cannot be compelled to incriminate themselves.

Not a fan? Fine.
 
Foreigners and those caught on the battle field should not have the same rights as American citizens. They should be tried in military courts and not civilian courts.
 
digsbe said:
Foreigners and those caught on the battle field should not have the same rights as American citizens. They should be tried in military courts and not civilian courts.
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This guy wasn't captured on a battlefield.

And foreigners, really? You think a German guy who robs a liquor store should go to a military tribunal?
 
Albert Di Salvo said:
Obama and Holder wanted to use this case to establish a legal precedent for the prosecution of Gitmo detainees in US civilian courts.

The legal precedent was not established. The DOJ legal team left the courtroom in absolute silence. This verdict was a major defeat for Holder, Obama and what's left of America.
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That's a point which is getting lost in this big blame game.

He wasn't convicted of anything involving terrorism; he was convicted of being in a conspiracy to harm government buildings.

This was supposed to show that the criminal justice system is up to the task of trying terrorists. But it didn't do that. If there had been no federal building involved -- as is often the case -- he'd have walked.

Except, of course, that he wouldn't have, because that wasn't going to happen, period.
 
Deuce said:
This guy wasn't captured on a battlefield.

And foreigners, really? You think a German guy who robs a liquor store should go to a military tribunal?
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Yes he was. You think this is like "Gettysburg" boundaries or something ? In terror, the battlefield is where the victim got blown up.

Christ this is pathetic.
 
FilmFestGuy said:
Uhhh...really? You just said Bush manned up and took responsibility, so I don't get your argument now. He only blamed Clinton some of the time?

And, in case you didn't realize it, Obama hasn't been in office for 2 years yet (the 2-year anniversary will happen on January 20, 2011).
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But he's already blamed Bush 100 times ? 1000 times ? Whaaaaaaaaaaa .... pathetic whining Presbo POS.
 
Chappy said:
It was the clown who left the WH two years ago who brought about the 284 not guilty verdicts by allowing Ghailani to be abused while in detention and thereby prevented critical evidence from being entered into court.

And the judge, in rejecting the critical evidence, noted that Ghailani would likely remain in detention regardless of trial's outcome because of his enemy combatant status.

Plus, the single guilty verdict that the jury did return carries with it a maximum sentence of 20 years. Some justice was rescued from the malfeasance of the Bush administration.

But, more important, in a pre-trial judgment, the judge ruled that Ghailani could be tried despite having been abused while in custody.

It won't be easy going forward with other defendants because evidence obtained under torture will be excluded, but, the precedent has been established that the Bush administration has not completely undermined the American justice system.
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And, the present clown in charge has authorized the TSA to strip search three-year-olds and pat down nuns' ******s, yet we can't rough a known AQ operator. Then, turn around and let the terrorist recieve a lesser charge, because of a technicality.

This administration is a ****ing joke.
 
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Eighty Deuce said:
Yes he was. You think this is like "Gettysburg" boundaries or something ? In terror, the battlefield is where the victim got blown up.

Christ this is pathetic.
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He was captured by police in Pakistan. Why should the US military have jurisdiction?

apdst said:
And, the present clown in charge has authorized the TSA to strip search three-year-olds and pat down nuns' ******s, yet we can't rough a known AQ operator. Then, turn around and let the terrorist recieve a lesser charge, because of a technicality.

This administration is a ****ing joke.
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Not accepting torture confessions as evidence is not a ****ing "technicality." No court in any civilized country would admit that as evidence.

edit: and 20-life is not a "lesser" charge. Murder has the same sentence.
 
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Deuce said:
He was captured by police in Pakistan. Why should the US military have jurisdiction?



Not accepting torture confessions as evidence is not a ****ing "technicality." No court in any civilized country would admit that as evidence.

edit: and 20-life is not a "lesser" charge. Murder has the same sentence.
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So, actually blowing up the building and killing the people inside the building are two different crimes?

Hint: if he hadn't blown up the building, those people wouldn't have died. Hello?!?

It would be no different, than if Timothy McVeigh had been charged with just grand theft auto. What's the sentence for that? 20 years? He got the death penalty, BTW. Not a 20 year sentence for murder.

I just can't say it enough: this administration is a ****ing joke!
 
apdst said:
So, actually blowing up the building and killing the people inside the building are two different crimes?

Hint: if he hadn't blown up the building, those people wouldn't have died. Hello?!?

It would be no different, than if Timothy McVeigh had been charged with just grand theft auto. What's the sentence for that? 20 years? He got the death penalty, BTW. Not a 20 year sentence for murder.

I just can't say it enough: this administration is a ****ing joke!
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You're aware this is not the guy who actually planted and detonated the bomb, right? We already captured and sentenced those guys to life.

edit: Why do I always do that? Ask a question like this when the answer is clear...

He made the bomb. He did not plant and detonate it. Convicting him of murder is tough, you have to prove that he knew the plot and was in on it. The CIA blew that when they tortured the key witnesses.
 
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FilmFestGuy said:
Uhhh...really? You just said Bush manned up and took responsibility, so I don't get your argument now. He only blamed Clinton some of the time?

And, in case you didn't realize it, Obama hasn't been in office for 2 years yet (the 2-year anniversary will happen on January 20, 2011).
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The cry baby has been in office close to two years too long and the next 2 years ( should I say two years and a couple of more months) will seem be the longest time in political history. You don't get my argument because you don't want to. I said that AT LEAST BUSH DIDN'T BLAME CLINTON CONSTANTLY FOR OVER 3 SOLID YEARS (counting cry baby's campaigning) LIKE CRY BABY HAS. Got it??? Comprende?? Oi, oi ,oi.. these Liberals have hard heads oi, oi, oi :lamo

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Deuce said:
You're aware this is not the guy who actually planted and detonated the bomb, right? We already captured and sentenced those guys to life.

edit: Why do I always do that? Ask a question like this when the answer is clear...

He made the bomb. He did not plant and detonate it. Convicting him of murder is tough, you have to prove that he knew the plot and was in on it. The CIA blew that when they tortured the key witnesses.
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You're aware that under our criminal justice system, conspiracy to commit murder carries the same sentence as actually doing the deed, right?

Unless, you're an Islamic terrorist, that is.
 
Deuce said:
He was captured by police in Pakistan. Why should the US military have jurisdiction?
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Are you serious ? We always had jurisdiction. Presidential decree has given the military jurisdiction, btw ... its kind of why we drop bombs on folks in Pakistan ... summary executions which I have not seen you bitch about, btw. Its only a question of getting physical posession of the perp, and fortunately, we had such treaties with Pakistan to get the asswipe back here.
 
Deuce said:
edit: and 20-life is not a "lesser" charge. Murder has the same sentence.
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I hope that your statement will bring satisfaction to the relatives of the 12 Americans that were killed when he blew up the building.

What a freeging joke this is. Oi. oi, oi
 
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