White House Concedes on Upper Income Tax Cuts

disneydude said:

LOL...once again displaying your inability to answer the question...

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Like I said -- I didnt expect a meaningful response.

Look.. I cant dumb this down any further.

If, at this point, I haven't illustrated the argument in terms that you can understamd, allowing you a chance to show how I am wrong using those terms, there's not much else I can do. You either cannot understand what's been put to you, or you choose not to.

Either way, its -your- failure. Nothing -I- can do about it.

Goobieman said:

Like I said -- I didnt expect a meaningful response.

Look.. I cant dumb this down any further.

If, at this point, I haven't illustrated the argument in terms that you can understamd, allowing you a chance to show how I am wrong using those terms, there's not much else I can do. You either cannot understand what's been put to you, or you choose not to.

Either way, its -your- failure. Nothing -I- can do about it.

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Its fun making you dance.....keep shuffling Goob.

ARealConservative said:

contracts that place burdens on people that don't even exist today are pretty ****ty contracts.

do you agree with that?

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Completely disagree with you. If one does not want abide by the Social Contract and what composes it for a particular nation, they have the right to remove themselves from both. Otherwise, you live here and you accept the broader social contract and what is in it.

Every child born does not get a vote to ratify the US Constitution or other laws of the land. That is simply the way it is.

disneydude said:

Its fun making you dance.....keep shuffling Goob.

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Enjoy your failure!

:wave:

Chappy said:

The only way to meet the budget challenges now and in the future is for Americans to act responsibly and allow all the Bush tax cuts to expire; there's a reason why those tax cuts were passed through Congress under reconciliation rules and thereby were time constrained, and, that reason is staring us right now straight in the eyes: unrelenting red ink for decades to come. It is shameful that so-called conservatives fail to acknowledge that.

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well, it's too bad the white house surrendered, then

kinda makes all your so thoughtful contribution mere academics, no?

as such, have you subjected your observations to peer review?

LOL!

maybe you could run em by boo

I MADE A HORRIBLE MISTAKE!!!! :soap

This whole THREAD is BS! Obama is NOT going to cave. Huffington Post is full of crap. I heard it on the radio and I also researched a bit more.
I cant believe I was LAZY enough to not research BEFORE I posted. SEE! This is how the spin doctors use their power. To lie and decieve.

it's really not up to obama at this point

the party has to act on the middle class, it can't let taxes go up on the middle in january

he just doesn't have the votes, neither downstairs nor up

in the house there's heath shuler and joe donnelly and jim matheson and dan boren and gerald connolly and mark critz and jason altmire and betty sutton and ed perlmutter and mike ross and jim marshall and jim costa and the 3 iowans and ben chandler...

these people will NOT endorse the progressive economics of pelosi/obama, not after all they've been thru

upstairs there's jiltin joe lieberman, stiffneck ben nelson, bye bye evan bayh and budget chair from north dakota kent conrad---they're all on record

quietly behind em, eyes already wide in anticipation of 2012, are combat boots webb in virginia, john tester in montana, sherrod brown in ohio, byron dorgan in arkansas...

have you ever heard ohio's junior senator on the topic of cap and trade?

he sounds like joe manchin

where do you think manchin's gonna come down on the bush tax cuts for the rich?

you think he's gonna run to stand behind a mumbling obama who can't even make up his own feverish mind?

get real

obama's only role concerning the extension or not of the bush tax cuts is---will he veto what's produced or sign it?

why do you think axelrod said what he said?

answer---reality

why did they take it back---talk to the professional left, heels dug in in denial

it is what it is

i've never in my lifetime seen an american president get his ass so badly kicked on every front

why, just since the election last tuesday, look---humiliating defeat at the g20, his anxiously awaited debt commission cruelly kicked and all but forgotten in 48 hours, his press conference to explain the meaning of the election which only left all but the fringe saying the president just doesn't get it, pelosi's selfishness splits the caucus in really ugly ways, this surrender of these bush cuts...

the lame duck, like all lame ducks, will AVOID as much action as possible---no dadt, no dream act, no nutrition bill for michelle (paid for by MORE cuts to food stamps)...

the national journal reported on his g20 getaway thus---obama's RODNEY DANGERFIELD moment

obama has diminished significantly just since the election

he's THAT bad

sorry

The Prof said:

it's really not up to obama at this point
the party has to act on the middle class, it can't let taxes go up on the middle in january

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When those cash-strapped, just-barely-above-water, almost-unable-to-feed-their-kids middle-class families see their taxrs go up in January, there's no one to blame but the Dems.

there is no justification for leadership having failed to act all this time

reliance on a lame duck is lame leadership

it should be embarrassing

to someone

where do these people go to get back their self respect?

if the tax cuts continue, they should also kill the exemptions that countered the taxation as well.. if i cant claim my expenses(car, utilities, maintenance, etc.) then nobody should.

Goobieman said:

When those cash-strapped, just-barely-above-water, almost-unable-to-feed-their-kids middle-class families see their taxrs go up in January, there's no one to blame but the Dems.

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Which is why the line needs to be drawn in the sand for all the nation to see and it must be done now. Not in January when the new Congress takes its seats but now. The Democrats in both houses need to act on a bill which restores the tax cuts for the lowest 98% of the public. every Democratic congress person should then embark on a campaign of going home and having town hall meetings to publicize the bill and the tax cuts. The President needs to go on Tv and discuss it. Every day that line must be drawn deeper and deeper for the nation to see. The nation must see that Democrats favor tax cuts for the middle class. Let republicans defend the rich and use the middle class as their pawn with an entire legion of Demcoratic congresspersons to publicize it. Make this the cause celebre of the lame duck session.

Then we will see who gets blamed for what.

haymarket said:

Which is why the line needs to be drawn in the sand for all the nation to see and it must be done now. Not in January when the new Congress takes its seats but now. The Democrats in both houses need to act on a bill which restores the tax cuts for the lowest 98% of the public. every Democratic congress person should then embark on a campaign of going home and having town hall meetings to publicize the bill and the tax cuts. The President needs to go on Tv and discuss it. Every day that line must be drawn deeper and deeper for the nation to see. The nation must see that Democrats favor tax cuts for the middle class. Let republicans defend the rich and use the middle class as their pawn with an entire legion of Demcoratic congresspersons to publicize it. Make this the cause celebre of the lame duck session.

Then we will see who gets blamed for what.

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After Obamacare, the Dems don't have enough credibility to tell anyone, about any legislation they've passed.

If they're going to do anything, they should get rid of the new tax laws that were snuck into the Obamacare bill.

haymarket said:

Which is why the line needs to be drawn in the sand for all the nation to see and it must be done now. Not in January when the new Congress takes its seats but now. The Democrats in both houses need to act on a bill which restores the tax cuts for the lowest 98% of the public. every Democratic congress person should then embark on a campaign of going home and having town hall meetings to publicize the bill and the tax cuts. The President needs to go on Tv and discuss it. Every day that line must be drawn deeper and deeper for the nation to see. The nation must see that Democrats favor tax cuts for the middle class. Let republicans defend the rich and use the middle class as their pawn with an entire legion of Demcoratic congresspersons to publicize it. Make this the cause celebre of the lame duck session.

Then we will see who gets blamed for what.

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Health Care strategy? Won't work, Obama has already caved.


j-mac

The fact that two conservatives do NOT want the Dems to adopt my strategy tells me that it is a very worthwhile plan indeed.

And health care has not a darn thing to do with it.

haymarket said:

The fact that two conservatives do NOT want the Dems to adopt my strategy tells me that it is a very worthwhile plan indeed.

And health care has not a darn thing to do with it.

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It is the exact strategy that the administration tried to use for the HC debate, that's what I meant. So you are anti conservative are you? Hmmm. wonder why you find it necessary to not disclose your political lean? Ah well, never mind, it's clear anyway.

On topic: Is it your contention that those that have attained wealth did it unfairly? or don't already pay more in taxes than the rest of us? How much should they pay? 90%, 95%, All of it?


j-mac

haymarket said:

Every Democratic congress person should then embark on a campaign of going home and having town hall meetings to publicize the bill and the tax cuts.

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Ah, the irony -- Dems campaigning furiously and desperately to continue 98% of the Bush-era tax cuts.
Its a beautiful day.

haymarket said:

The fact that two conservatives do NOT want the Dems to adopt my strategy tells me that it is a very worthwhile plan indeed.

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if it's such a winning strategy why isn't leadership pursuing it

j-mac said:

It is the exact strategy that the administration tried to use for the HC debate, that's what I meant. So you are anti conservative are you? Hmmm. wonder why you find it necessary to not disclose your political lean? Ah well, never mind, it's clear anyway.

On topic: Is it your contention that those that have attained wealth did it unfairly? or don't already pay more in taxes than the rest of us? How much should they pay? 90%, 95%, All of it?


j-mac

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If that was the Dem strategy in the health care debate, it was poorly executed. Its time to learn from errors of the past and do it better this time.

My political leanings are clear..... I am now and have always been an American on the side of the American people as a society which represents the best hope of mankind.

It would be silly, foolish and pointless to characterize the wealthy as one group and say how they got their money. How much should they pay? I am not a tax expert but I would give a try to allowing their current tax breaks to expire as scheduled and then popping the cap on FICA deductions for all money earned.

Lets see how that works.

disneydude said:

Its funny how its NOT "Class warfare" to you guys when Republicans come in a cut taxes for the wealthiest of Americans which results in redistribution of wealth in favor of the top 2% of the country....yet it IS "Class warfare" to you guy when people seek to end those tax breaks.

You gotta love that right-wing way of thinking.

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1. In red above... Ahhhhhhhhh Disney... these people earned that money. It is theirs. They didn't steal it from anyone. Why should I labor for you, and have the government punish me for creating wealth? Equal under the law. Not for libs. The tax code is there to punich and redistribute. It's sick, and creates a society of jealousy... class warfare.

2. That money is in far better hands in the private sector than being run through the government grinder... where a dollar in turns into a quarter being spit out.

3. If I decide to share my wealth with you fine... but I do not see where you get off thinking what is mine is yours, and the government should be there to act as a conduit to steal wealth.

4. It is really none of your business who makes what, how much someone has... and in fairness, you know... all people being equal under the eyes of the law... we should all pay the same rate.

The flaw-gic you apply is amazing.

.

haymarket said:

My political leanings are clear..... I am now and have always been an American on the side of the American people as a society which represents the best hope of mankind.

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Funny, that is what this guy says:




j-mac

I suspect lots of patriots have said much the same thing. I bet that guy also eats a few meals each day too.

What the dems should do is simply let the taxcuts expire and then reintroduce middle class tax cuts next year in the senate and dare the republicans to fillibuster it during the lame duck session.

megaprogman said:

What the dems should do is simply let the taxcuts expire and then reintroduce middle class tax cuts next year in the senate

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Can't happen.
Constitution 101:
Article I
Section 7. All Bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

and dare the republicans to fillibuster it during the lame duck session

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The lame duck session ends this year.

haymarket said:

This is very sad that the WH has conceded this important point. Very very sad for the nation.

Yesterday I was reading the last few chapters in the excellent book THE FOURTH TURNING and it obvious we are in the middle of a serious crisis that will either doom this nation or force it to a better day. Developments like this one makes me think the momentum is swinging towards disaster. Maybe we have to hit rock bottom before we will face reality?

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Money in the hands of the federal govt usually spells doom on a long term basis. The fed extends its reach where the states should be taking responsibility. That's why the fed should concentrate only on its constitutional duties, primarily defense, foreign policy and interstate commerce justice and protecting the rights of the people.