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Thread: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

  1. #821
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Zimmer, you're factually incorrect:


    Funny. You would think that if the C.I.A.’s interrogation of high-value detainees was all it took, the U.S. government would have succeeded in locating bin Laden before 2006, which is when the C.I.A.’s custody of so-called “high-value detainees” ended. Instead, after the Supreme Court ruled that year that prisoners needed to be treated humanely in compliance with the Geneva Conventions, the C.I.A. was forced to turn its special detainees over to the military for detention and interrogation using more lawful tactics in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba. It took five more years before all the dots could be adequately connected.

    Many key details are still missing. But according to the New York Times, the turning point came when detainees being held in Guantánamo—not in the C.I.A.’s secret black-site prisons—revealed to American interrogators the pseudonym used by a key bin Laden courier, whom they also identified as a protégé of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.



    Read more News Desk: Bin Laden Dead, Torture Debate Lives On : The New Yorker

    Tortured stope din 2006. We didn't get the name until 2007. It simpley couldn't have produced the name. This suggests that other methods were more effective.
    I smell a lot of back pedaling coming from Libs... and it's a shame we can't harness this as an energy source because it might be enough to power a few major cities.

    .
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    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    I smell a lot of back pedaling coming from Libs... and it's a shame we can't harness this as an energy source because it might be enough to power a few major cities.

    .
    You can pretend to smell whatever you want, but you can't and haven't disputed the timeline. If we did not get the name until 2007, as Fox reports, then we did not get from torture. In fact, torture failed to get it.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You can pretend to smell whatever you want, but you can't and haven't disputed the timeline. If we did not get the name until 2007, as Fox reports, then we did not get from torture. In fact, torture failed to get it.
    Please do not wear out your Spin-O-Matic and please don't asphyxiate yourself while keeping head in sand.

    US officials say one of the key clues that led to bin Laden was a thread of information about an al-Qaeda courier. That thread, they say, may have come from the mastermind of the September 11th attacks - Khalid Sheik Mohammed, or from the so-called 20th hijacker Mohammad al-Qahtani.

    "The CIA got a nickname for one of bin Laden's couriers in interrogation of high targets - very controversial interrogation. Let's make no bones about it in 2002-2004 range," said David Ignatius, Washington Post.

    Authorities acknowledge both Khalid Sheik Mohammad and Mohammad al-Qahtani had been subjected to enhanced interrogation, a policy authorized by former President George Bush.
    Bin Laden death prompts more questions on enhanced interrogation - 13 WTHR and many other sources like FOXNEWS

    The initial threads of intelligence began surfacing in 2003 and came in the form of information about a trusted bin Laden courier, a senior U.S. official told Fox News on condition of anonymity. The information included an alias for the courier.

    Read more: Bush-Era Interrogations Provided Key Details on Bin Laden's Location - FoxNews.com
    .
    Last edited by zimmer; 05-03-11 at 03:18 PM.
    The Clintons are what happens...
    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    Please do not wear out your Spin-O-Matic and please don't asphyxiate yourself while keeping head in sand.



    .
    Again, you're not addressing the point. Your sources say we got the name in 2007. Torture stopped in 2006. You have not addressed the timeline. A year later, after they tortured KSm, they got the name. While torturing, they did not get the name.

    Your source:

    But it was four years later, in 2007, that terror suspects at the Guantanamo Bay military prison started giving up information that led to the identification of the key courier.
    See, it could not have been from torture.
    Last edited by Boo Radley; 05-03-11 at 03:24 PM.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Again, you're not addressing the point. Your sources say we got the name in 2007. Torture stopped in 2006. You have not addressed the timeline. A year later, after they tortured KSm, they got the name. While torturing, they did not get the name.

    Your source:



    See, it could not have been from torture.
    (Reuters) - The possibility that U.S. spies located Osama bin Laden with help from detainees who'd been subjected to "enhanced interrogation" techniques seems certain to reopen the debate over practices that many have equated with torture, security experts said on Monday.

    One of the key sources for initial information about an al Qaeda "courier" who led U.S. authorities to bin Laden's Pakistani hide-out was Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the al Qaeda operative said to have masterminded the September 11, 2001 attacks, a former U.S. national security official said.

    KSM, as he was known to U.S. officials, was subjected to "waterboarding" 183 times, the U.S. government has acknowledged.
    Bin Laden kill may reopen CIA interrogation debate | Reuters
    Plus 1500 plus similar stories.

    Now why would this reignite the use of waterboarding if it did not play a key role.

    I didn't bother to post Cheney's comments on the likelihood because I didn't want the comment to pop your head off.

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    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    Plus 1500 plus similar stories.

    Now why would this reignite the use of waterboarding if it did not play a key role.

    I didn't bother to post Cheney's comments on the likelihood because I didn't want the comment to pop your head off.

    .
    Stories don't equal fact. I gave your fact. You article states clearly that immates started giving information in 2007. The fact is torture stopped in 2006. Stories don't change that. And Cheney has been proven wrong before. He stated torture of KSM proved intel that stopped the second 9/11, which was stopped before we even captured KSM. I understand the desire to accept the proposition that torture works and saves all, but you can changed the facts to do it. You need more than stories and vague claims. You need factual and verifiable information.

    So, to review, fact, your soruce says they started giving information in 2007. Fact, torture stopped in 2006.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Stories don't equal fact. I gave your fact. You article states clearly that immates started giving information in 2007. The fact is torture stopped in 2006. Stories don't change that. And Cheney has been proven wrong before. He stated torture of KSM proved intel that stopped the second 9/11, which was stopped before we even captured KSM. I understand the desire to accept the proposition that torture works and saves all, but you can changed the facts to do it. You need more than stories and vague claims. You need factual and verifiable information.

    So, to review, fact, your soruce says they started giving information in 2007. Fact, torture stopped in 2006.

    Maybe by that time all they needed to do was threaten the water board again, and the coward spilled it....but a larger argument would be what if KSM would have been tried as you libs wanted prior to 2006, and under rules that you will admit couldn't be submitted he was set free. We wouldn't have that information either. Good thing Obama keeps Gitmo open isn't it?

    j-mac
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Maybe by that time all they needed to do was threaten the water board again, and the coward spilled it....but a larger argument would be what if KSM would have been tried as you libs wanted prior to 2006, and under rules that you will admit couldn't be submitted he was set free. We wouldn't have that information either. Good thing Obama keeps Gitmo open isn't it?

    j-mac
    That's speculation, but as they were asking the question while they were doing it, and didn;t get (posted links on that earlier), it makes that kind of doubtful.

    And there was no case he be set free. But more interestingly is that you would not blame the person who so badly violated the law to make trying and obeying rule all difficult for this. you seem quite willing to accept illegal acts, even immoral acts.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    he didn't talk

    they eit'd him

    his spirit was broken

    he began to cooperate, and to an extraordinary extent, conducting terrorist tutorials and becoming langley's preeminent source

    that's when sheikh abu was first known

    those are the facts---according to THE CIA INSPECTOR GENERAL'S REPORT AS RELEASED IN 2009 BY THE DEPT OF JUSTICE

    How a Detainee Became An Asset - washingtonpost.com

    grow up

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    So, you have nothing. Is grow your tag amiision line that you have nothing?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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