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Thread: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I would do it and happily accept punishment as I would have deserved, knowing that I did the right thing. Two wrongs do not make a right.

    Hmmm.....Do you also think that sending captured prisoner AQ, or Taliban to other countries to be questioned under these extra interrogation techniques is also punishable as a war crime?

    WASHINGTON — The CIA's secret prisons are being shuttered. Harsh interrogation techniques are off-limits. And Guantanamo Bay will eventually go back to being a wind-swept naval base on the southeastern corner of Cuba.

    But even while dismantling these programs, President Obama left intact an equally controversial counter-terrorism tool.

    Under executive orders issued by Obama recently, the CIA still has authority to carry out what are known as renditions, secret abductions and transfers of prisoners to countries that cooperate with the United States.

    Obama preserves renditions as counter-terrorism tool - Los Angeles Times
    I guess its all good if you farm it out.


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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Hmmm.....Do you also think that sending captured prisoner AQ, or Taliban to other countries to be questioned under these extra interrogation techniques is also punishable as a war crime?



    I guess its all good if you farm it out.


    j-mac
    Yeah, but that was Obama. (he won the Nobel Peace Prize you know)

    Now stop with the crazy talk....



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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Cole View Post
    Yeah, but that was Obama. (he won the Nobel Peace Prize you know)

    Now stop with the crazy talk....






    .

    the nature of the crime is only defined by those opposed to its supposed criminal as defined by that persons enemies.


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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Hmmm.....Do you also think that sending captured prisoner AQ, or Taliban to other countries to be questioned under these extra interrogation techniques is also punishable as a war crime?

    I guess its all good if you farm it out.

    j-mac
    I don't know the legalities, but I think it should be considered one. Its the torture thats important, not who does it.

    Personally, if Obama is involved, I think he should be prosecuted as well. A crime is a crime (assuming the law is how I prefer it to be)
    Last edited by tacomancer; 11-11-10 at 09:16 AM.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I don't know the legalities, but I think it should be considered one. Its the torture thats important, not who does it.

    Personally, if Obama is involved, I think he should be prosecuted as well. A crime is a crime (assuming the law is how I prefer it to be)
    Well, good for you. I did notice however you left yourself an out. Ah well, I guess that is to be expected when confronted with the reality that even ones own hero does it too.


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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Well, good for you. I did notice however you left yourself an out. Ah well, I guess that is to be expected when confronted with the reality that even ones own hero does it too.


    j-mac
    1. Why do you assume he is my hero, simply because I am a liberal? There is plenty that Obama does that I disagree with. This is the kind of hackish lazy thinking that is very annoying and corrosive to a real discussion.
    2. What out?

    Also, I need to amend my previous post. I said "who does it" and I mean't "what country/agency/institution does it". Lazy language on my part and easily misinterpreted since I used a collective who (who is in what group of people) and it can be construed as a singular who (as in what person). Is this part of my out? If so, my fault. Ultimately I meant to say its wrong no matter in what location it is done.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 11-11-10 at 09:35 AM.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Commander Frank Wead, United States Navy:

    This time we went right to the water hose in the face, and a wet towel held tightly on my forehead so that I could not move my head. I had embarrassed my captors and they would now show me that they had total control. The most agonizing and frightful moments are when the wet towel is placed over your nose and mouth and the water hose is placed directly over your mouth. Holding your breath, bucking at the straps, straining to remain conscious, you believe with all your heart that, that, you are going to die.
    SERE Training of our own military includes (included?) waterboarding. (The D.O.D. will not comment on whether or not it is still using waterboarding in SERE training.)

    I see a few problems with indicting George Bush:

    #1 -- Is waterboarding torture? Congress was asked to legislate that it indeed was and declined to do so. Our own military uses waterboarding as a training technique.
    #2 -- Are terrorists protected by any treaties signed by the US outlawing torture? Or are they excluded?
    #3 -- If waterboarding of terrorist suspects was indeed illegal, why did President Obama issue an Executive Order banning its use?
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    No one's going to touch this. Obama's not going to let his DOJ get anywhere near it. He's got enough problems, as it is, without prosecuting a former president for protecting the country.
    I agree with you that it won't happen. But let's not be dishonest. Torturing was not protecting this country. We have more evidence that what we got from torture hurt this country than we do that it helped. Breaking the law is breaking the law, no matter how misguided ones beliefs are.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I agree with you that it won't happen. But let's not be dishonest. Torturing was not protecting this country. We have more evidence that what we got from torture hurt this country than we do that it helped. Breaking the law is breaking the law, no matter how misguided ones beliefs are.
    So would you hold that standard to Obama on any number of given issues? You can say yes right now, but only time would tell how that too would shift with the sands in debate as is the norm.

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So would you hold that standard to Obama on any number of given issues? You can say yes right now, but only time would tell how that too would shift with the sands in debate as is the norm.

    j-mac
    Absolutely. Torture is wrong and illegal. And it is morally reprehensible to try and excuse it.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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