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Thread: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    The Hague has about as much jurisdiction over Americans as Judge Judy.
    Wrong. War criminals fall under universal jurisdiction no matter what their nationality, and no matter what their home country's status as signatory to the Rome Statute. Look it up.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Wrong. War criminals fall under universal jurisdiction no matter what their nationality, and no matter what their home country's status as signatory to the Rome Statute. Look it up.
    Universal jurisdiction is a highly-disputed concept to which the United States has never acceded. Nonetheless, the jurisdiction of any international body is determined exclusively by the agreements which create it, and the United States is not subject to the ICC. There is no "universal jurisdiction" there.
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Amnesty International is a hypocritical organization. Bush was not a war criminal, and the whole concept of internationally regulated "war practices" is foolish and should be tossed away as rubbish. The true injustice is treating terrorists like royalty and not getting life saving information by any means necessary.
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    This is a fundamental misunderstanding of the founding of this nation.
    A fundamental fact about the founding of this nation, you mean.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Universal jurisdiction is a highly-disputed concept to which the United States has never acceded.
    It's only highly disputed in the United States, and even then the critics are people like Henry Kissinger, who is himself a war criminal. Take that with a grain of salt. Real legal scholars know there is no dispute about universal jurisdiction's applicability to war criminals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Nonetheless, the jurisdiction of any international body is determined exclusively by the agreements which create it, and the United States is not subject to the ICC. There is no "universal jurisdiction" there.
    Yes, there is. Universal jurisdiction allows a war criminal to be haled into court in any jurisdiction he can be found. A war crime is a crime against all humanity, hence all courts are appropriate venue, subject to their internally limited jurisdiction. And nothing about the ICC's charter limits the scope of universal jurisdiction. QED

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Wrong. War criminals fall under universal jurisdiction no matter what their nationality, and no matter what their home country's status as signatory to the Rome Statute. Look it up.
    I have universal jurisdiction over you. That means that I can prosecute you for disagreeing with me, whether or not you agree with my assertion of jurisdiction.

    Amazing how that works, eh?
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I have universal jurisdiction over you. That means that I can prosecute you for disagreeing with me, whether or not you agree with my assertion of jurisdiction.

    Amazing how that works, eh?
    Nonsensical is more like it. Universal jurisdiction only extends to jus cogens crimes, nothing else. So war crimes, genocide, piracy, agression, crimes of that nature. So you're just all kinds of wrong, here.

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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Nonsensical is more like it. Universal jurisdiction only extends to jus cogens crimes, nothing else. So war crimes, genocide, piracy, agression, crimes of that nature. So you're just all kinds of wrong, here.
    Ah, and who exactly defined universal jurisdiction as such?
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    It's only highly disputed in the United States, and even then the critics are people like Henry Kissinger, who is himself a war criminal.
    Side note: Could it be any more obvious that you're getting your information about universal jurisdiction from wikipedia?

    Opponents, such as Henry Kissinger...
    Universal jurisdiction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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    Re: Amnesty International Wants Bush Prosecuted for Admitted Waterboarding

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Ah, and who exactly defined universal jurisdiction as such?
    You really want to know? Grotius, Vattel, Gentili, on down the line to Karl Llewellyn H. L. A. Hart and Richard Posner Ronald Dworkin have defined it as such. In short, everybody but a handful of neocons in the past decade. But perhaps most importantly to our discussion, Henry Billings Brown defined universal jurisdiction as such in the controlling Supreme Court case US v. The Ambrose Light. Look it up.
    Last edited by Guy Incognito; 11-13-10 at 04:36 PM.

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