Page 80 of 113 FirstFirst ... 3070787980818290 ... LastLast
Results 791 to 800 of 1129

Thread: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

  1. #791
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    If the only people that had to pay taxes are the ones that had a last name that began with Z, most people would want to keep that system.

    your replies are increasingly pathetic and easy to counter.

    sophomoric economics.
    declaring victory is often a sign of losing. But, do go on.

    The person I repsonded to say a vague many cross the boarder. How many is a valid question. And polls about statisfaction also are valid. There are other valid points on both sides, but your response includes none of them. But good for a smile.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  2. #792
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Ran across this and thought I'd sahre;

    It has become increasingly apparent, as data accumulate, that the overall improvement in health in a society with tax-supported health care translates to better health even for the rich, the group assumed to be the main beneficiaries of the American-style private system. If we look just at the 5.7 deaths per thousand among presumably richer, white babies in the United States, Canada still does better at 4.7, even though the Canadian figure includes all ethnic groups and all income levels. Perhaps a one-per-thousand difference doesn't sound like much. But when measuring mortality, it's huge. If the U.S. infant mortality rate were the same as Canada's, almost 15,000 more babies would survive in the United States every year.

    If we consider the statistics for the poor, which in the United States have been classified by race, we find that in 2001, infants born of black mothers were dying at a rate of 14.2 per thousand. That's a Third World figure, comparable to Russia's.8

    But now that the United States has begun to do studies based on income levels instead of race, these "cultural" and genetic explanations are turning out to be baseless. Infant mortality is highest among the poor, regardless of race.

    Vive la différence! Genetically, Canadians and Americans are quite similar. Our health habits, too, are very much alike -- people in both countries eat too much and exercise too little. And, like the United States, there is plenty of inequality in Canada, too. In terms of health care, that inequality falls primarily on Canadians in isolated communities, particularly Native groups, who have poorer access to medical care and are exposed to greater environmental contamination. The only major difference between the two countries that could account for the remarkable disparity in their infant and adult mortality rates, as well as the amount they spend on health care, is how they manage their health care systems.

    The facts are clear: Before 1971, when both countries had similar, largely privately funded health care systems, overall survival and mortality rates were almost identical. The divergence appeared with the introduction of the single-payer health system in Canada.

    The solid statistics amassed since the 1970s point to only one conclusion: like it or not, believe it makes sense or not, publicly funded, universally available health care is simply the most powerful contributing factor to the overall health of the people who live in any country. And in the United States, we have got the bodies to prove it.

    Canadian Single-Payer Health Care Program: Is it Better than US Health Care?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #793
    cookies crumble
    ARealConservative's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    04-21-17 @ 09:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    14,518

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    declaring victory is often a sign of losing. But, do go on.

    The person I repsonded to say a vague many cross the boarder. How many is a valid question. And polls about statisfaction also are valid. There are other valid points on both sides, but your response includes none of them. But good for a smile.

    The Canadian health care system was implemented via mob rule. The majority voted for it and the majority benefit financially from the system. A minority of people are far, far worse off financially

    Yet somehow, you seem to think anybody gives a rats ass that the majority that voted for it like it.

    Duh! They benefit from it, that is why they voted for it. Next up you going to tell me the sun rises in the East?

    And do everyone a favor and run your nonsense through a spell checker. A few misspellings here and there are one thing, but this is a comedy of errors, and speaks volumes about how much you actually have to offer on damn near any topic.

  4. #794
    Debate MMA
    Prof. Peabody's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Seen
    07-30-12 @ 11:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,361

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    So many? How many? And if you look at polls, most wouldn't trade their system for ours. Same around the world. We are actually less satisfied then canada and other countries are with their system.

    One-fourth of American respondents are either "very" or "somewhat" satisfied with "the availability of affordable healthcare in the nation," (6% very satisfied and 19% somewhat satisfied). This level of satisfaction is significantly lower than in Canada, where 57% are satisfied with the availability of affordable healthcare, including 16% who are very satisfied. Roughly 4 in 10 Britons are satisfied (43%), but only 7% say they are very satisfied (similar to the percentage very satisfied in the United States).

    Looking at the other side of the coin, 44% of Americans are very dissatisfied with the availability of affordable healthcare, and nearly three-fourths (72%) are either somewhat or very dissatisfied. The 44% in the United States who are very dissatisfied with healthcare availability is significantly higher than corresponding figures in either Canada (17%) or Great Britain (25%).


    Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada
    Peakes woman loses her baby, dignity while awaiting hospital treatment - Local - News - The Guardian

    CBC News - Health - Wait times for surgery in Canada at all-time high: study

    In Canada, a move toward a private healthcare option - Los Angeles Times

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...y_suicide_rate

    Just a touch of reading for you.
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

  5. #795
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    The Canadian health care system was implemented via mob rule. The majority voted for it and the majority benefit financially from the system. A minority of people are far, far worse off financially

    Yet somehow, you seem to think anybody gives a rats ass that the majority that voted for it like it.

    Duh! They benefit from it, that is why they voted for it. Next up you going to tell me the sun rises in the East?

    And do everyone a favor and run your nonsense through a spell checker. A few misspellings here and there are one thing, but this is a comedy of errors, and speaks volumes about how much you actually have to offer on damn near any topic.
    So, what a majority wants is invalid because a majority want it. Is that your argument?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  6. #796
    Sage
    Conservative's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    67,293

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    So, what a majority wants is invalid because a majority want it. Is that your argument?
    Boo, what you have a problem understanding is the old adage, "the grass is always greener on the other side" until you get there. You continue to buy the rhetoric about how good healthcare is in Canada and Europe while ignoring the other point of view. Be careful what you ask for because once committed there is no going back. The healthcare in Canada and Britain have their problems which you seem to ignore. The question is why?

  7. #797
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    I gave some reading above, but I'll give you some more:

    What country endures such long waits for medical care that even one of its top insurers recently admitted that care is "not timely" and people "initially diagnosed with cancer are waiting over a month, which is intolerable?"

    If you guessed Canada, guess again. The answer is the United States.

    Scrambling for a response to the popular reaction to Michael Moore's SiCKO and a renewed groundswell for a publicly-financed, guaranteed health care, single-payer health care solution like HR 676, the big insurers and their defenders have pounced on Canada, pulling out all their old tales of people waiting years in soup kitchen-type lines for medical care.

    But, here's the dirty little secret that they won't tell you. Waiting times in the U.S. are as bad as or worse than Canada. And, unlike the U.S., in Canada no one is denied needed medical care, referrals, or diagnostic tests due to cost, pre-existing conditions, or because it wasn't pre-approved.

    Deborah Burger: Ugly Health Care Waiting Times? Look at the U.S

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  8. #798
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Boo, what you have a problem understanding is the old adage, "the grass is always greener on the other side" until you get there. You continue to buy the rhetoric about how good healthcare is in Canada and Europe while ignoring the other point of view. Be careful what you ask for because once committed there is no going back. The healthcare in Canada and Britain have their problems which you seem to ignore. The question is why?
    No, that's really not the case. I recognize and realize all sytems have problems. What I dispute is the claims made by your side that the other side is a sbad as you say. I think we need a universal payer for a couple of reasons, access and cost being primary reason why. and when I speak of cost, I mean more than just eliminating paper work and reducing the cost of the actual care. I mean also that we remove it from the employer and allow business to compete with the rest of the world competition who don't ahve to provide health care for their employers. We spend more for less access than the rest of the world. Sure, it likely won't be perfect, and I don't expect prefection. I seek better. And not just better for the few, but across the board.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  9. #799
    Sage
    Conservative's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    67,293

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, that's really not the case. I recognize and realize all sytems have problems. What I dispute is the claims made by your side that the other side is a sbad as you say. I think we need a universal payer for a couple of reasons, access and cost being primary reason why. and when I speak of cost, I mean more than just eliminating paper work and reducing the cost of the actual care. I mean also that we remove it from the employer and allow business to compete with the rest of the world competition who don't ahve to provide health care for their employers. We spend more for less access than the rest of the world. Sure, it likely won't be perfect, and I don't expect prefection. I seek better. And not just better for the few, but across the board.
    Boo, right now the burden on hospital and doctors is excessive and that burden is going to increase. There aren't enough doctors, enough hospitals to serve the needs of the public now and what the healthcare bill has done is reduce the incentive to even go into the business. We have had this argument over and over again and still you make the same claims that have been refuted by actual results. IMO healthcare is a state issue, not a Federal taxpayer issue. If someone doesn't have the money to pay for ER services the taxpayers in the state pay the bill, not the Federal Taxpayer. What national healthcare and a single payer does is put the Federal Govt. in a position it has no history of doing right and you have created a major bureaucracy that will not improve healthcare and will bust the budget. Stop buying what you are told and think about all the successes the Federal Govt. has on other entitlement programs. History isn't on your side.

  10. #800
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    Re: 2010 Midterm Results Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Boo, right now the burden on hospital and doctors is excessive and that burden is going to increase. There aren't enough doctors, enough hospitals to serve the needs of the public now and what the healthcare bill has done is reduce the incentive to even go into the business. We have had this argument over and over again and still you make the same claims that have been refuted by actual results. IMO healthcare is a state issue, not a Federal taxpayer issue. If someone doesn't have the money to pay for ER services the taxpayers in the state pay the bill, not the Federal Taxpayer. What national healthcare and a single payer does is put the Federal Govt. in a position it has no history of doing right and you have created a major bureaucracy that will not improve healthcare and will bust the budget. Stop buying what you are told and think about all the successes the Federal Govt. has on other entitlement programs. History isn't on your side.
    As I've told you before, you overstate that problem. We'll adjust fine. Had we adopted a universal payer, we'd have cut some 160 million from the deficit in paper work alone. We'd ahve done well with a public option. But evenw ith what we did, we'll still do better in terms of acess than we were doing. hopefully, we can improve the problems and move forward. But, you're skipping the conversation we're having to bring a realatively minor problem.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

Page 80 of 113 FirstFirst ... 3070787980818290 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •