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Megachurch Pastor Comes Out Of Closet

A "true profit"? Freudian slip there. Nowadays, "true profits" have Televangelist shows, and open megachurches to reel in the gull...faithful, and their tithes.
 
He considered himself a true Prophet, I think you mean? Yeah. Where does Paul say that he's a "profit"? He calls himself a teacher, preacher, and pastor. That's different. The books that you are thinking of in the New Testament are letters that were written by Paul to early churches. They aren't on par with the gospels.

He was a true profit according to the church, Paul performed miracles which established his authority as a true prophet or spokesman of God, period. This is documented in the Bible even if he himself was a humble man.

Where did Christ mention that being anti-gay is a law of his?

Long before he came to earth...

"'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable."

Actually, that passage deals with divorce and the hypocrisy of the Jews in that era, treating their wives shamefully, giving them letters of divorcement that dishonored them, and pretending to be righteous before God.

Absolutly. It also shows us Gods plan for us.

I'm sensing some similarities here with the modern pharisees, to be blunt.

And you shall know them by there fruits. What you are sensing is your own lack of understanding. I mean we all know you are no longer a Christian. And you are now going to preach as if you ever understood? Your faith is gone.

Edit obviously it posted your reply to soon so I take that back, as you did not mock me that way.
 
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I'm a former Sunday School teacher who was taught to "rightly divide the word of truth." I don't know whose law you want to follow, but it isn't Christ's law.

His law was not to be divided, so you were taught wrong and did teach wrong.

The longer I live, the more I see truth in this thought: The God you choose to worship says more about you than it does about God. If you hate gays, you're likely to latch onto a version of God that hates gays.

Please point out where I said I hate gays? Please point out in over two years were I have said anything even close?

I don't think that's reflective of the teachings of Christ, though.

And you have no faith or guidance from the holy spirit. So it means little.
 
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He was a true profit according to the church

Citation?

Paul performed miracles which established his authority as a true prophet or spokesman of God, period. This is documented in the Bible even if he himself was a humble man.

Paul was an APOSTLE. There were several apostles (12 in all) and many of them performed miracles. Paul was in no way unique.

Long before he came to earth...

I don't think you understand the concept of old testament versus new testament law very well. Man failed at old testament law. That's why a savior was required. That savior brought a new law. Many scholars believe that Christ's law is quantified in Matthew Chapters 5-7.

People who are legalistic (i.e., focused on the law) tend to miss Christ's major points:

Matthew 5: 3 “Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are those who mourn,
for they will be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek,
for they will inherit the earth.
6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
for they will be filled.
7 Blessed are the merciful,
for they will be shown mercy.

8 Blessed are the pure in heart,
for they will see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they will be called children of God.
10 Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 “Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

I'd recommend a thorough reading of Matthew Chapters 5-7 so you can get a better perspective on Christ's priorities. He was clear.

"'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable."

Jesus Christ: For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

(legalism versus love)

Absolutly. It also shows us Gods plan for us.

God's plan for us:

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

... 7 “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 8 For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened.

9 “Which of you, if your son asks for bread, will give him a stone? 10 Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? 11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him! 12 So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.


Have you treated gays the way that you'd want them to treat you?


And you shall know them by there fruits. What you are sensing is your own lack of understanding. I mean we all know you are no longer a Christian. And you are now going to preach as if you ever understood? Your faith is gone.

Truth is truth.

In your case this would be a lie.

You mad?
 
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This is why I have a hard time discussing religion with some people. Some people just can't help but take a holier than thou approach when they have a disagreement with someone, and it's impossible to have a rational discussion.

I have been having a rational discussion. I have been posting evidence etc and yet most of it is ignored etc. So no, you don't want to have the discussion because you know in your heart you are wrong.

You want to rewrite Christianity to fit your life, this is absolutely wrong.

You are to bend to Gods will, not the other way around.
 
His law was not to be divided, so you were taught wrong and did teach wrong.

Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth (2 Timothy 2:15).

If you knew your scriptures, you'd know this one by heart.

Please point out where I said I hate gays? Please point out in over two years were I have said anything even close?

Please point out where I said that you hate gays. Feel free to re-read my statement.

And you have no faith or guidance from the holy spirit. So it means little.

Nice try, but no cookie.
 
I have been having a rational discussion. I have been posting evidence etc and yet most of it is ignored etc. So no, you don't want to have the discussion because you know in your heart you are wrong.

Your evidence was responded to and it was pointed out to you that Jesus Christ never condemned gays, or suggested that this was part of his gospel.

You want to rewrite Christianity to fit your life, this is absolutely wrong.

Wait, what? This, coming from the guy who wants to make the claim that you have to believe being gay is a sin in order to be a Christian? Rewriting Christianity, indeed. Again...where did Christ say this? Surely, if this was a requirement for Christianity, he'd have made time to mention it.

You are to bend to Gods will, not the other way around.

Micah 6:8: "What does the Lord ask of you but to do justice, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly before your God?"

You walking humbly, Bro. Dog? You loving mercy? You doing justice by those gays?

Note to Christians: remove plank from eye before criticizing other people's sinning.
 
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I can't help but feel that Bro. Dog is preaching out of the Gospel of Samuel L. Jackson.

 
I have been having a rational discussion. I have been posting evidence etc and yet most of it is ignored etc. So no, you don't want to have the discussion because you know in your heart you are wrong.

You want to rewrite Christianity to fit your life, this is absolutely wrong.

You are to bend to Gods will, not the other way around.

Calling yourself a true believer and insinuating others who disagree with you aren't, isn't very rational. And no, I don't want to rewrite Christianity, Christ said nothing of homosexuality, and John 3:16 says it all for me.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life.

Its plain, and simple right there. Whosoever believes in him, not whosoever believes in him(as long as their straight).
 
Citation?

Deuteronomy 18:21-22, "And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him." Check

Numbers 12:6, "And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a prophet among you, I the LORD will make myself known unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream." Check

Numbers 24:4 "He hath said, which heard the words of God, which saw the vision of the Almighty, falling into a trance, but having his eyes open:" Check

Numbers 24:16, "He hath said, which heard the words of God, and knew the knowledge of the most High, which saw the vision of the Almighty, falling into a trance, but having his eyes open:" check

Do I really need to go down the whole list?

Paul was an APOSTLE. There were several apostles (12 in all) and many of them performed miracles. Paul was in no way unique.

Of course he was. Not like being an apostle somehow excluded you from being a profit.

I don't think you understand the concept of old testament versus new testament law very well. Man failed at old testament law. That's why a savior was required. That savior brought a new law. Many scholars believe that Christ's law is quantified in the Beatitudes, but you could also look at Matthew 6 for insights.

But that is not the totality of the law. You want to pick and choose and leave the rest.

People who are legalistic (i.e., focused on the law) tend to miss Christ's major points:[/quote]

Oh please, I think I know all this already.

Have you treated gays the way that you'd want them to treat you?

#1 I am still waiting for you to show me where I said I hate gays.
#2 This was my last post on the subject of gays....

http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls...tially-punishable-death-2.html#post1059075750

Don't just gloss over it, and tell me what you really think about how much I hate gays.


About what?
 
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Calling yourself a true believer and insinuating others who disagree with you aren't, isn't very rational. And no, I don't want to rewrite Christianity, Christ said nothing of homosexuality, and John 3:16 says it all for me.

Please feel free to point out where I insulted someone as that is an offense on the forums. Please point out where I have been irrational?

Its plain, and simple right there. Whosoever believes in him, not whosoever believes in him(as long as their straight).

I am a sinner and have stated as much. The difference is I try not to live in it like it is correect or OK with God, it's not as I have shown.
 
Your evidence was responded to and it was pointed out to you that Jesus Christ never condemned gays, or suggested that this was part of his gospel.

He has, you seem to think Jesus and God the father are two different people?

Wait, what? This, coming from the guy who wants to make the claim that you have to believe being gay is a sin in order to be a Christian?

Please point out where I said that?

Rewriting Christianity, indeed. Again...where did Christ say this? Surely, if this was a requirement for Christianity, he'd have made time to mention it.

He did, I have posted it, you pretend not to see it so as to be comfertable. I mean really, no one wants to go to hell.

Micah 6:8: "What does the Lord ask of you but to do justice, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly before your God?"

You walking humbly, Bro. Dog? You loving mercy? You doing justice by those gays?

Yes, I am. Are you doing the same for the Christians and Mormons you constantly bash?

You have no room to sit in judgement of anyone.

Note to Christians: remove plank from eye before criticizing other people's sinning.

Has nothing to do with my statement nor does it apply
 
Deuteronomy 18:21-22, "And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him." Check

Numbers 12:6, "And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a prophet among you, I the LORD will make myself known unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream." Check

Numbers 24:4 "He hath said, which heard the words of God, which saw the vision of the Almighty, falling into a trance, but having his eyes open:" Check

Numbers 24:16, "He hath said, which heard the words of God, and knew the knowledge of the most High, which saw the vision of the Almighty, falling into a trance, but having his eyes open:" check

Where did Paul's peers refer to him as a prophet? (they didn't) Where did Paul use this term to describe himself? (he didn't).

Do I really need to go down the whole list?

Only if it involves New Testament folks speaking specifically of Paul as a Prophet and/or Paul referring to himself that way. Prophets weren't needed once the son of God came in the flesh. The prophets testified of Christ's imminent arrival.

Of course he was. Not like being an apostle somehow excluded you from being a profit.

They're two different things, bro.

But that is not the totality of the law. You want to pick and choose and leave the rest.

I want to follow Christ's law. You want to be stuck with the Pharisees in the Old Testment. If the law was sufficient, why was Christ's atonement necessary?

Oh please, I think I know all this already.

Really? by their fruits ye shall know them.

#1 I am still waiting for you to show me where I said I hate gays.

Learn to read. I NEVER said that you (specifically) expressed hatred for gays.

#2 This was my last post on the subject of gays....

Taking our ball and going home?

I don't blame you. The Bible doesn't confirm your positions.

Don't just gloss over it, and tell me what you really think about how much I hate gays
Please stop creating strawmen.
 
But that is not the totality of the law. You want to pick and choose and leave the rest.

Pick and choose, so lets see, are you okay with being forced to marry your rapist, or killing adulterers, are you okay with forcing a women who's husband died without a male heir to have sex with his brothers until one is produced? Are you okay with men having concubines? Who's really picking and choosing here.
 
Please feel free to point out where I insulted someone as that is an offense on the forums. Please point out where I have been irrational?



I am a sinner and have stated as much. The difference is I try not to live in it like it is correect or OK with God, it's not as I have shown.

The whole holier than thou stuff, doesn't promote rational discussion.

And we are all sinners, and I try to live my life the way God wants me to. And the way God made me, isn't sinful.
 
He has, you seem to think Jesus and God the father are two different people?

What was the point of Christ's death on the cross?
Please point out where I said that?

Sorry, apparently that was Dark Wizard and not you. However, you did say that Christians (all Christians) believe that homosexuality is a sin. Not all Christians believe this.

He did, I have posted it, you pretend not to see it so as to be comfertable. I mean really, no one wants to go to hell.

Christ never said it. You lamely attempted to imply that because it is written in Levitical law (Leviticus) that it came directly from Christ. This is not correct.

Yes, I am. Are you doing the same for the Christians and Mormons you constantly bash?

Clearly. It's not unloving to point out error. Isn't that what you claim to be doing?

You have no room to sit in judgement of anyone.

Strawman. I was asking you honest questions. Nice dodge, though. If only we were playing dodgeball. ;)

Has nothing to do with my statement nor does it apply

Law of Christ, bro.
 
Where did Paul's peers refer to him as a prophet? (they didn't) Where did Paul use this term to describe himself? (he didn't).

I can't believe you are playing this game. And you say you taught Sunday school??? You should know this.

Identifying the profits of God are laid down in the Bible. Anyone can do it. He meets all the criteria according to the Old AND New Testaments.

Only if it involves New Testament folks speaking specifically of Paul as a Prophet and/or Paul referring to himself that way. Prophets weren't needed once the son of God came in the flesh. The prophets testified of Christ's imminent arrival.

Among other things. Jeeesh.

They're two different things, bro.

Yes, but NOT mutually exclusive as I said.

I want to follow Christ's law. You want to be stuck with the Pharisees in the Old Testment. If the law was sufficient, why was Christ's atonement necessary?

By denouncing your faith? By leaving it to the way side? By attacking religions and people of faith at every turn? Could have fooled me.

Christs atonement was so ALL men and not just the Jewish people could attain heaven.

Really? by their fruits ye shall know them.

Yes.

Learn to read. I NEVER said that you (specifically) expressed hatred for gays.

Not at all, you just implied it. :doh

Taking our ball and going home?

Ummm... It was my last post specifically about gay people and not religion and gays.

I don't blame you. The Bible doesn't confirm your positions.

I have shown it does. You have basically offered lip service.

Please stop creating strawmen.

You implied it and are still trying to imply it with your "what have you done for gays lately post.

Please don't be so dishonest, you brought it up.
 
I can't believe you are playing this game. And you say you taught Sunday school??? You should know this.

Identifying the profits of God are laid down in the Bible. Anyone can do it. He meets all the criteria according to the Old AND New Testaments.

Once Christ came in the flesh, the era of prophets was over. We had information directly from the source at that point. Please. Share with us the other prophets that have existed since Paul...


Among other things. Jeeesh.

You want to make this claim, but you can't actually back it up. Even Paul didn't refer to himself as a prophet. A prophet had a different role than an apostle.

Yes, but NOT mutually exclusive as I said.

The era of the prophets ended when Christ came in the flesh. This is also why the curtain between the Holy of Holies in the Jerusalem temple was torn....Christ became our go-between. Because of Christ, we can go directly to the father. In the past, prophets and priests stood between humanity and God. No longer.

I know you WANT desperately for Paul to be a prophet, but the simple fact is that if he wanted this title, he'd have taken it, or it would have been given to him. It wasn't.

By denouncing your faith? By leaving it to the way side? By attacking religions and people of faith at every turn? Could have fooled me.

Gosh. If I didn't know better, I'd think you were attacking me. I mean, you did say:
You are an unbeliever who does not care and want only to corrupt that which is pure.
That sounds a little bit like an attack...

I've never attacked people personally (although this is about your 6th or 7th personal comment directed at my character). I've simply pointed out where they've gotten "off-message." I think that's a legitimate place of discussion.

And, I only do it when Christians use their beliefs as a basis for attacking other people.

Christs atonement was so ALL men and not just the Jewish people could attain heaven.

Why couldn't they attain it on their own merits?

Not at all, you just implied it. :doh

Really. Quote my post and back up this claim or stand down, soldier.

Ummm... It was my last post specifically about gay people and not religion and gays.

You can't resist my powers.

I have shown it does. You have basically offered lip service.

If this was truly significant to Christ, given his limited time on earth and the importance of every word he spoke, I'm quite sure he'd have brought it up. Why didn't he? You've taken verses out of context and tried to twist them into supporting your worldview, rather than being conformed to the word of God.

You implied it and are still trying to imply it with your "what have you done for gays lately post.

Please, feel free to use my words to show this...

Please don't be so dishonest, you brought it up.

You simply misinterpreted my comment. But, now would be a good time to stop doing this.
 
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Even Saint Francis would smack both of you with a ruler about now. Geeze, chill out already. Go play outside for awhile or something. Watch TV. Drink beer. Something. Anything. Just stop talking about it before my frickin' head explodes.





 
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This is a pretty long thread, but has anyone pointed out the irony that while gays can't get married he's a gay who can marry straight couples?

I see no real irony here.
 
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