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Thread: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

  1. #61
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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I never mentioned anything about "evicting" Muslims. I said no more should be let into the country.

    Why should any Muslims be allowed in? Do you have a good reason?
    Not really, but you are the one that wants to keep them out which would require making a law saying so. So, do you have a good reason?

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Sure, but I said those born in the country.

    If it was up to me I'd disallow Muslim immigration immediately.
    Let's see, there are 1.57 billion Muslims worldwide. So far about thirty have attempted (either successfully or not) to carry out attacks in the United States. If my math is correct, that is about 0.000001%. What sort of sense does it make to judge a group based upon that small a percentage of bad actors?

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    Not really, but you are the one that wants to keep them out which would require making a law saying so. So, do you have a good reason?
    Yes, I do. It's because some of them, although few in number, are terrorists. Their presence is simply not worth the risk involved.

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Yes, I do. It's because some of them, although few in number, are terrorists. Their presence is simply not worth the risk involved.
    Sorry your fear isn't a good reason to not let an entire group come to this country.

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coronado View Post
    Let's see, there are 1.57 billion Muslims worldwide. So far about thirty have attempted (either successfully or not) to carry out attacks in the United States. If my math is correct, that is about 0.000001%. What sort of sense does it make to judge a group based upon that small a percentage of bad actors?
    But why take any risk at all? Why should any group of people be under constant surveilance? Are they really worth the hassle involved?

    Can you give me a good reason why they should be allowed entry?

    In fact there is none..

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    But why take any risk at all? Why should any group of people be under constant surveilance? Are they really worth the hassle involved?

    Can you give me a good reason why they should be allowed entry?

    In fact there is none..
    That's not how it works though, you need good reasons to NOT allow them to enter. There's good reason why you should not not allow them though.

    One, precedence. Once you allow the banning of a particular religion from immigration policy you set legal precedence to then begin denying entry into the country for other teir one discriminatory type status's such as race, ethnicity, etc. Should our law be able to say that no Jews may immigrate in, or no Japanese? By doing this law in the name of "protection" you're opening up the legal likelihood of these things being able to be done.

    Two, persecution of a religion that is held by citizens. An American Muslims marrying a foreigner whose a muslim is going to be denied his spouse entering the country based on religious beliefs. People attempting to have family members immigrate into the country are having it denied due to religious beliefs. While you may be allowing those IN the U.S. to remain you're essentially having the U.S. government take a stance that MUSLIMS as a whole are dangerous and thus must not be allowed into the country, creating an antagonistic atmosphere towards a religion from a federal level.

    Inefficiency and huge governmnent waste. How is one going to verify that someone is muslim? If the policy is known why would they not just claim to be a different religion? You'll spend all the time passing the law, changing the paperwork, changing protocols, for something that can easily be gotten around.

    Denying immigration ability to Muslims just isn't intelligent to do.

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    But why take any risk at all? Why should any group of people be under constant surveilance? Are they really worth the hassle involved?

    Can you give me a good reason why they should be allowed entry?

    In fact there is none..
    By that logic, in order to eliminate all risk we should not let anyone in at all ever again. Do you find that acceptable?

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Why should any Muslims be allowed in? Do you have a good reason?
    To piss of religious bigots like you.

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Why is it that those who are so busy commenting on "religious bigots" never seem to get around to voicing any disapproval for those whose religious bigotry is burning so fiercely that they seek to murder people en masse because of it?

    You know -- like the subject of this thread?
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: VA. Man Arrested For Plotting DC Attacks.

    Zyphlin

    That's not how it works though, you need good reasons to NOT allow them to enter. There's good reason why you should not not allow them though.
    No, you don't. Many countries have certain criteria before allowing entry. Perhaps the best known, in fact, are the Muslim countries themselves. You can't even wear symbols that represent any other religion than Islam.

    One, precedence. Once you allow the banning of a particular religion from immigration policy you set legal precedence to then begin denying entry into the country for other teir one discriminatory type status's such as race, ethnicity, etc.
    S

    Religion is a set of beliefs taught in a book. It is not a race. No one is advocating the disallowing of entry because of race, but of beliefs. And some of the Islami beliefs are obviously contradictory to a free society.

    Should our law be able to say that no Jews may immigrate in, or no Japanese? By doing this law in the name of "protection" you're opening up the legal likelihood of these things being able to be done.
    If Jews or Japanese were the source of terror than you might have an argument, but they are not.

    Two, persecution of a religion that is held by citizens. An American Muslims marrying a foreigner whose a muslim is going to be denied his spouse entering the country based on religious beliefs.
    I have no problem dealing with any anti Social belief system, whether it is racism, anti women, or any other anti social behaviour. To claim religious freedom for anti social beliefs and beaviour is a concept that should have disappeared long ago.
    People attempting to have family members immigrate into the country are having it denied due to religious beliefs.
    Right.

    While you may be allowing those IN the U.S. to remain you're essentially having the U.S. government take a stance that MUSLIMS as a whole are dangerous and thus must not be allowed into the country, creating an antagonistic atmosphere towards a religion from a federal level.
    No, it is admitting that there are a sufficient number of Muslims out there who could be a danger to the well being of the general public. This is clearly true, and there are not enough 'moderate' Muslims taking on those who would be supportive of terrorism, or other anti social behaviour.

    Inefficiency and huge governmnent waste. How is one going to verify that someone is muslim?
    That shuldn't be too difficult.

    If the policy is known why would they not just claim to be a different religion? You'll spend all the time passing the law, changing the paperwork, changing protocols, for something that can easily be gotten around.
    Certainly they can lie, in fact lying is a part of their religion, but we needn't concern ourselves with that at the moment.
    Denying immigration ability to Muslims just isn't intelligent to do.
    Perhaps a vote should be taken. I don't think Muslims add too much to any community that others couldn't fill more peacefully.

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