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Thread: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

  1. #71
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by Redbeard View Post
    What you see as "sucking at guerrilla warfare", many see as "political interference" not allowing the military to fight in a way as a situation may dictate.
    Okay, so then I guess you can tell us in what way the military could fight, if political interference was removed, that would improve the situation.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  2. #72
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    Okay, so then I guess you can tell us in what way the military could fight, if political interference was removed, that would improve the situation.
    LOL...you're dodging the meat the conversation...big time!

    But, I'll answer your grade school query and say that, a lack of political interferance would allow our military to execute an extreme amount of violence upon the enemy, thereby destroying the enemy's will/ability to wage war, more quickly.

    IOW, if there were fewer Libbo politicos worrying about what rules we were breaking and more of them worrying about how many of the enemy we were killing and how fast we were killing them, everyone would be alot better off.
    Last edited by apdst; 10-18-10 at 11:48 PM.
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    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  3. #73
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Because we are unable to engage tens, or even hundreds of thousands of the enemy at one time. In past wars--pre-Vietnam--the start to finish time was shorter; not only did we hit the enemy with the maximum amount of violence, but we were able to project that level of violence upon thousands of the enemy, at once.

    In Iraq, we engaged a dozen--plus or minus--of the enemy, at any given time. That being the case, it's obviously going to take longer to subdue the enemy's will/ability to wage war. You're confusing results with a time frame. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that if we had killed 100,000 insurgents in the first six months, the war in Iraq would have already been decided. However, that's not the case. It took us 6 years to kill 100,000 insurgents. We killed 100,000 insurgents and the insurgents killed less than 4,000 Coalition troops. That's a 25:1 kill ratio, in favor of the coalition. 25 insurgent KIA to 1 Coalition KIA. That can only indicate that the insurgents suck donkey balls at waging unconventional warfare. Not us! The insurgents have launched approximately 80,000 IED's and all told scored under 4,000 KIA's. That's not exactly a huge sign of success.

    So, again, how are you guaging the suck factor of American troops, when engaging assymetrical forces?
    You essentially said we're having a hard time because this enemy isn't fighting like our enemies of the past.

    In other words, you just said we're having a hard time fighting a guerrilla war.



    Oh, brother.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That has to be the most idiotic statement I've ever heard. The Swiss are good at what, exactly? Guerilla warfare? The Swiss army hasn't been in a war in centuries--literally!
    Okay, so you know absolutely nothing about the Swiss military. That's cool. I just happen to have a special interest in what happens in Switzerland is all.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  4. #74
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    No matter how you define the enemy, a political solution isn't the answer. Wars are won on the battlefield, not the political arena.
    Thats just not true at all. Its false enough that I won't give you the precedent against that in history. And when you're fighting an insurgency, it automatically becomes a political question, a question of willpower, and a question as to the intents of (in Iraq and Afghanistan's case) established governments.

    Furthermore, as I've stated before, an insurgency is sustained by ignorance, and until you start fighting that ignorance, you're only addressing the symptoms, not the source.
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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  5. #75
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Thats not true at all, in fact, the United States Military is the pre-eminent anti-insurgency group in the world. Ever since Vietname, we've been developing protocol, and tactics for dealing with guerilla fighters, and we're pretty freaking good at it. The problem is military strength can only control an insurgency, it can't wipe it out. Our soliders have kicked insurgent ass, but a final solution to this type of problem is a political solution, and in such a religiously polarized environment, it takes generations to fight the ignorance that is the source of this insurgency.
    You essentially did what I just caught apdst doing.

    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  6. #76
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    You essentially said we're having a hard time because this enemy isn't fighting like our enemies of the past.

    In other words, you just said we're having a hard time fighting a guerrilla war.



    Oh, brother.



    Okay, so you know absolutely nothing about the Swiss military. That's cool. I just happen to have a special interest in what happens in Switzerland is all.
    You still need to explain, explicitly, why you think the US Armed Forces sucks at fighting guerilla warfare.
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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    The Only Thing to Fear is Fear Itself.
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  7. #77
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    LOL...you're dodging the meat the conversation...big time!
    LOL...that made no sense...big time!
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  8. #78
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    You still need to explain, explicitly, why you think the US Armed Forces sucks at fighting guerilla warfare.
    Because we're not winning against a ragtag bunch of loosely allied fighters.

    I've said this before.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  9. #79
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    You essentially did what I just caught apdst doing.

    Eh, no. As I pointed out, since Vietname, we've been preparing for additional guerilla conflicts, and we are better than any other army in the world at combating it. What I went on to say was that this type of enemy needs to be fought long-term if you want to truly defeat them.
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
    -Gaius Julius Caesar
    The Only Thing to Fear is Fear Itself.
    -Franklin Delano Roosevelt

  10. #80
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    Re: Iraqi Sunnis Trained by U.S. Return to al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Eh, no. As I pointed out, since Vietname, we've been preparing for additional guerilla conflicts, and we are better than any other army in the world at combating it. What I went on to say was that this type of enemy needs to be fought long-term if you want to truly defeat them.
    How can we possibly be better than any army in the world at fighting guerrilla wars when we haven't won one?
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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