• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contributions

Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Could you give us a list of the "GOP media" Please?

I'm not going to run down a list of thousands of TV/radio stations, local and national newspapers, wire services, individual programs, and websites, but I will say that Clear Channel and News Corp properties are the most prolific and consistent. The rest are distributed throughout the media oligopoly, and run to the right by default for a number of reasons - first among them that the right is much less interested in substance, and therefore easier to program for. With respect to cable news, Fox News represents far-right Republicans, CNN represents center-right Republicans, and MSNBC represents moderate Republicans and right-leaning Democrats.
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

I'm not going to run down a list of thousands of TV/radio stations, local and national newspapers, wire services, individual programs, and websites, but I will say that Clear Channel and News Corp properties are the most prolific and consistent. The rest are distributed throughout the media oligopoly, and run to the right by default for a number of reasons - first among them that the right is much less interested in substance, and therefore easier to program for. With respect to cable news, Fox News represents far-right Republicans, CNN represents center-right Republicans, and MSNBC represents moderate Republicans and right-leaning Democrats.
I thought you said ALL media outlets were in the GOP's pocket? Backtracking already? Figures.
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

LINK
I don't have any idea whether the overall White House and Dem attack is working or not. But it seems questionable for folks to conclude already that it's a failure, especially since there isn't any empirical evidence to support that claim.

Like there isn't ant empirical evidence to support the Democratic accusations in the first place?:lol:
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

obama cares

It's his job to care. That doesn't mean the MSM is relevant, or that the Chamber of Commerce is American.

he was so clueless he sent THRILLS up their legs

Obviously it wasn't he who was clueless.

you haven't seen last friday's jobs report?

No. A good jobs report isn't going to give me a job, and a bad jobs report isn't going to prevent me from getting one. But I know this - the Chamber of Commerce doesn't care about jobs. From their perspective, a well-paying job with good benefits is an expense.

seeya at the polls, 3 weeks from today

Already voted by mail.
 
Last edited:
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

LINK
Schieffer’s response pretty much sums it all up: “Is that the best you can do?”

It appears that it is, as the attacks will continue until Election Day. Press Secretary Robert Gibbs has promised that the President will not back away from the charge and will repeat the lines about needing to see donors and open up their books to prove they’re who they say they are (a position, as Jake Tapper brilliantly put to Axelrod, that sounds a lot like Birtherism). And the Democratic National Committee, as mentioned, has put out a national ad accusing the Chamber of using foreign money to buy elections, an ad that Baltimore Sun media critic David Zurawik calls the new low in midterm mud and likens to McCarthyism.

These attacks may satisfy some urges among the liberal base, but they are not playing well with the rest of the nation. There are no answers on unemployment, the economy, Iran, uncertainty on health care and taxation – just that the Chamber might be using foreign money to buy commercials. Even if the charge somehow stuck and ended up discrediting the Chamber in some way, how in the world would that change the electoral reality for Democrats and Republicans?

It’s a move of desperation that should quell any talks of a Democratic surge, a bounce that has been largely invisible in the polls. The attacks demonstrate that, instead of pointing to their record of accomplishments, this administration seems to perpetually need a dramatic villain of some kind in order to put forward themselves as a positive alternative. It underlines that those accomplishments are indeed thin, and we ought to be wary of those who would use a branch of government as a political cudgel against those that disagree with them.

Like the man says... 'Is that the best you've got?' :2rofll::2rofll::2rofll::2rofll::2rofll:
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

A good jobs report isn't going to give me a job, and a bad jobs report isn't going to prevent me from getting one.

wow, there are hundreds of thousands of your neighbors who WILL find jobs if and when the reports improve

you really need someone to point this out to you?

the greater significance of the jobs report, in this context, is it's gonna cost ms pelosi HER job

again, this requires clarification?

wow

please continue
 
Last edited:
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Funny thing. they couldn't 'prove it' if it was true. Sad story.
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Fox News represents far-right Republicans, CNN represents center-right Republicans, and MSNBC represents moderate Republicans and right-leaning Democrats.

LOL!

such an offhand declaration, so cavalierly tossed, such a neat little formula

keith olberman, rachel maddow, shrill and thrilled chrissy matthews and mister ed schultz represent right leaners, all of em still bemoaning the precious surrender of their prized public option

deputy press secty bill burton last week:

“If you’re on the left, if you’re somebody like Keith Olbermann or Rachel Maddow or one of the folks who helps to keep our government honest and pushes and prods to make sure that folks are true to progressive values, then [the president] thinks that those folks provide an invaluable service.”

White House Praises MSNBC's Olbermann & Maddow: 'Invaluable'
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

president obama, what are you gonna do about the bush tax cuts which expire in 75 days, we need to know, we have to make plans for next year?

well, uhhh, i'm gonna, uhhh, make sure that no foreign money is used to advertise for their extension

that's what i'm gonna do

LOL!
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Bad Dems, bad Dems
Whatcha gonna do, whatcha gonna do
When they don't vote for you
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

If the FEC were to initiate an investigation... and it concluded that nothing illegal was being done by the CofC, the Dem's would simply find some other unimportant issue to bitch about.

They have no results to stand on, they're getting hammered in the polls, they will most likely lose their majority in the House and possibly the Senate as well, unemployment is high, the vast majority want Obamacare overturned...

To quote my daughter... 'The Dems ain't got no pancake mix!!!'
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

If the FEC were to initiate an investigation... and it concluded that nothing illegal was being done by the CofC, the Dem's would simply find some other unimportant issue to bitch about.



:shrug:

It'd be sweet to find them practically guilty of treason.
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Why don't they just reveal their friendly financial structure in goodwill. (yeah right)

the same reason moveon, the alf-cio, the sierra club and the nra won't

hello
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

the white house has finally taken the advice of those members of the professional left it earlier this summer insisted needed drug testing

when you're on the ropes, just pick someone, anyone, for any reason, and ACCUSE

At one point, Ackerman suggested that fellow members of the listserv should fight the way the right is fueling the Rev. Jeremiah Wright story by choosing one of Obama’s conservative critics, “Fred Barnes, Karl Rove, who cares — and call them racists.”

Unlike David Weigel, Spencer Ackerman keeps job - Keach Hagey - POLITICO.com

president obama, what are you gonna do about jobs, unemployment has exceeded 9.5% for 14 months, we've suffered 4 straight months of net job loss, you've been so extremely active legislatively but nothing seems to be working?

what are you gonna do to fix our problems, you're the president?

well, uhhh, i'm gonna pick some political opponent of mine, say, the CHAMBER OF COMMERCE, who cares, and i'm gonna ACCUSE em of trying to STEAL OUR DEMOCRACY

LOL!

THAT's what i'm gonna do
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Same rules of evidence applies across the board.

Well, no apparently they don't. This is why I don't read you denouncing the administrations latest claim against the C o C. Or are you doing that now?


j-mac
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

You're actually claiming that the majority of mass media has a conservative bias?

Not only a bias, but an obvious one. Of course, it doesn't necessarily follow that having a conservative bias means that the people doing it are conservatives - it can be a secondary consequence of institutional factors. For instance, the greater emphasis on profits in the newsroom over quality journalism means that facts are glossed over, ignored, unverified, or even fabricated. Since reality has a liberal bias, this overwhelmingly benefits conservatives and Republicans. There is also the fact that it's cheaper to just pretend both sides of an argument are equally legitimate even when one side is clearly insane, and allows the media to run on perpetual conflict rather than discussion. If a Republican came on Fox News saying 2 + 2 = 5, the headline would be "Are liberals trying to shortchange arithmetic?"

You think that 100% of the mass media was against Obama during the 2008 elections?

No. I think the general tenor of the coverage was against him, and that this tone was unjustified by any objective analysis. It was simply an attempt to prop up John McCain - perhaps in some cases due to purely partisan bias, but in most I would say to keep the election competitive and viewers tuning in. Of course, when it's the other way around, they don't give such consideration to Democrats, so it's pretty hard to pretend there isn't a massive partisan bias in favor of the GOP.

No way this guy is for real.

Who are you talking to?

So what do you think of the secret donations given to the Obama campaign in 2008?

I think (a)they weren't a secret, (b)they were acknowledged, and (c)the campaign chose for financial reasons to return improper contributions rather than preemptively screening for them. I also think this is completely irrelevant to the Chamber of Commerce trying to run game on American democracy with funding it refuses to disclose.

And you have what as proof, besides your own personal opinion? Please share your evidence.

As I've now said several times, it's not illegal for the Chamber of Commerce to accept foreign funds, it has no reason to refuse them, it has every reason to solicit and accept them, it refuses to deny using such funds being used in its political ad campaigns (it only denies their going directly into the campaigns), and its response (and yours) has been exclusively to try to change the subject. That's more than sufficient to treat it as a high likelihood.

They've publicly denied the accusations, not hid from the issue.

No, they haven't. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.

How exactly are they 'scared'?

That the money they've spent trying to manipulate American democracy will be wasted.

Again, as no one has offered proof, it is hardly factual.

"Corporations anonymously ganging up on American democracy." The Chamber of Commerce represents corporations, its funding is largely anonymous, the donors behind it are acting in concert through its auspices, and it ad campaigns are intended to influence the outcome of the election. In other words, what I just said - corporations anonymously ganging up on American democracy. It is factually correct.

In fact, I'm not sure you've made a factual statement since you began posting here.

That's between you and your dictionary.

Every word you utter proves more and more how much a complete partisan hack you are.

If you can't argue substantively, then concede or explain your objections in detail. Otherwise you're just debasing yourself.

That, like most of your other posts, makes no sense what so ever.

It does if you actually read it and think about it.

the entire board.

You're the elected representative of the entire board?
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Of course, it doesn't necessarily follow that having a conservative bias means that the people doing it are conservatives - it can be a secondary consequence of institutional factors.

sure, olberman, ed, maddow, BECK---their shows are all the same

LOL!

Since reality has a liberal bias...

YouTube - Twilight Zone Opening THEME MUSIC 1962 Rod Serling

If a Republican came on Fox News saying 2 + 2 = 5, the headline would be "Are liberals trying to shortchange arithmetic?"

link?

would olberman say the same?

I think the general tenor of the coverage was against him

oh, absolutely, barack hussein won the white house IN SPITE OF the conservative bias dominating the msm

he entered the presidential campaign with such an impressive resume of accomplishments and abilities

why, mere months after invesco field he won THE NOBEL

LOL!

As I've now said several times, it's not illegal for the Chamber of Commerce to accept foreign funds, it has no reason to refuse them, it has every reason to solicit and accept them, it refuses to deny using such funds being used in its political ad campaigns (it only denies their going directly into the campaigns), and its response (and yours) has been exclusively to try to change the subject. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.

the coc operates in the exact same way and under the exact same rules of disclosure as moveon and the afl-cio

i wonder why the white house, with its doj and irs, hasn't ACCUSED, on the basis of "it appears" and "i can assert anything i want, bob," the activists and unionists of criminal activity

it must be because moveon is even more right wing than olberman

please continue
 
Last edited:
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Troubadour said:
As I've now said several times, it's not illegal for the Chamber of Commerce to accept foreign funds, it has no reason to refuse them, it has every reason to solicit and accept them, it refuses to deny using such funds being used in its political ad campaigns (it only denies their going directly into the campaigns), and its response (and yours) has been exclusively to try to change the subject. That's more than sufficient to treat it as a high likelihood.

You mean foreign corporations like BP?

During his time in the Senate and while running for president, Obama received a total of $77,051 from the oil giant and is the top recipient of BP PAC and individual money over the past 20 years, according to financial disclosure records.
Obama biggest recipient of BP cash | Reuters

Troubadour said:
No, they haven't. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.

The chamber adamantly denies that foreign funds are used in its U.S. election efforts, accusing Democrats of orchestrating a speculative smear campaign during a desperate political year.
washingtonpost.com

You either don't keep up with the topic or you've drank too much Kool-Aid.
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Well, no apparently they don't. This is why I don't read you denouncing the administrations latest claim against the C o C. Or are you doing that now?


j-mac

Would you disagree with me? if not, where's the debate?

However, let's look at the clips Stewart provides on this:

Jon Stewart talks dirty politics, Karl Rove foreign money allegations

From a group who are always throwing up aspurtions about where the money comes from, I find this hypocracy humorous, which is why Stewart's joke resonates. However, any thinking person who is considering accepting the claim should stop and ask for evidence. The rules apply across the board, even with the silly hypocracy on your side. ;)
 
Re: Guilty until proven innocent... according to the White House

Obama and the Democrats are looking more and more like desparate losers every day.
 
Re: Guilty until proven innocent... according to the White House

did you see this?

rove's and gillespie's crossroads gps raised THIRTEEN MILLION dollars in only ONE WEEK since oblvious, obtuse, obnoxious obama began his groundless ACCUSATIONS based on nothing more than "i can assert whatever i want, bob"

Rove-backed group raised $13M since attacks from Obama - The Hill's Blog Briefing Room

LOL!

this administration is---demonstrably---over its head, isolated, insular, arrogant and clueless

whatcha gonna do, now, mr president?

sic the irs and doj on us?

you better hurry up, you've already lost congressional backing

and after november...
 
Re: Guilty until proven innocent... according to the White House

well, what else is there to talk about

affable, gaffe-able, laughable joe biden, who is able to campaign for democrats in 100 districts the presidential putz can't appear without hurting someone, lays it out

we can't campaign on our leviathan list of legislative accomplishments, avers the veep, because "it's just too hard to explain"

Biden, Obama's Traveling Salesman, Makes Hard Sell to Voters - Bloomberg

the stimulus, obamacare, reg reform, cap and trade...

political insiders can only sympathize

seeya at the polls, pals

SUE ME, president obama, ATTACK MY SOURCES, i too could use a BUMP

LOL!
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Whovian said:
They've publicly denied the accusations, not hid from the issue.
No, they haven't. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.

Every time you speak, you prove my point.

BTW...
LINK
The U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the conservative business lobbying group that has vowed to spend $75 million to influence the midterm elections, is denying a report from a liberal group that it is using money from foreign corporations on campaign ads.

"These accusations are completely erroneous," Tita Freeman, vice president of communications for the Chamber, said in a statement. "... No foreign money is used to fund political activities."
 
Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

Think Progress » GRAPHIC: How The Chamber Gets Its Foreign Money

1) How many foreign sources of funding does the Chamber have? The Washington Post’s Greg Sargent received this statement from a Chamber spokeswoman: “[Of] the Chamber’s 300,000 members, a relative handful are non-U.S. based companies.” How many is a “relatively handful,” and how much do they contribute?

2) Are the foreign funds being directed into the same general account that is used to pay for partisan attack ads? Again, the Post’s Greg Sargent pressed on this point. The Chamber, which is running more than $10 million in political advertising just this week (the largest expenditure in one week by an outside group), said, “We are not obligated to discuss our internal accounting procedures.”

As David Donnelly, national campaigns director for Public Campaign Action Fund, told Politico: “They basically say, ‘trust us’ when there’s mounting evidence they’re outsourcing the funding of their political attacks ads? Yeah, right.” Apparently, the New York Times and the Washington Post were just fine with trusting the Chamber.

First it's outrageous to allege that foreign funds are collected and used. Then it's not so much money is collected and used. Then it's the Dems do it too.

Dunno how you can actually run around as much as you do with the goalposts protruding from your back.

Regards from Rosie

LINK
1 & 2) The chamber has denied that foreign members’ payments—which chamber officials say total less than 1% of its $200 million budget—are used for political activities. The chamber is not legally required to disclose its donors.

Where is all this 'mounting evidence' I hear of? None has been presented. And David Axlerod himself said he doesn't need to provide any.

NEXT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom