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Thread: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contributions

  1. #141
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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Same rules of evidence applies across the board.
    Well, no apparently they don't. This is why I don't read you denouncing the administrations latest claim against the C o C. Or are you doing that now?


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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    You're actually claiming that the majority of mass media has a conservative bias?
    Not only a bias, but an obvious one. Of course, it doesn't necessarily follow that having a conservative bias means that the people doing it are conservatives - it can be a secondary consequence of institutional factors. For instance, the greater emphasis on profits in the newsroom over quality journalism means that facts are glossed over, ignored, unverified, or even fabricated. Since reality has a liberal bias, this overwhelmingly benefits conservatives and Republicans. There is also the fact that it's cheaper to just pretend both sides of an argument are equally legitimate even when one side is clearly insane, and allows the media to run on perpetual conflict rather than discussion. If a Republican came on Fox News saying 2 + 2 = 5, the headline would be "Are liberals trying to shortchange arithmetic?"

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    You think that 100% of the mass media was against Obama during the 2008 elections?
    No. I think the general tenor of the coverage was against him, and that this tone was unjustified by any objective analysis. It was simply an attempt to prop up John McCain - perhaps in some cases due to purely partisan bias, but in most I would say to keep the election competitive and viewers tuning in. Of course, when it's the other way around, they don't give such consideration to Democrats, so it's pretty hard to pretend there isn't a massive partisan bias in favor of the GOP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    No way this guy is for real.
    Who are you talking to?

    [QUOTE=Strucky;1059036760]So what do you think of the secret donations given to the Obama campaign in 2008?

    I think (a)they weren't a secret, (b)they were acknowledged, and (c)the campaign chose for financial reasons to return improper contributions rather than preemptively screening for them. I also think this is completely irrelevant to the Chamber of Commerce trying to run game on American democracy with funding it refuses to disclose.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    And you have what as proof, besides your own personal opinion? Please share your evidence.
    As I've now said several times, it's not illegal for the Chamber of Commerce to accept foreign funds, it has no reason to refuse them, it has every reason to solicit and accept them, it refuses to deny using such funds being used in its political ad campaigns (it only denies their going directly into the campaigns), and its response (and yours) has been exclusively to try to change the subject. That's more than sufficient to treat it as a high likelihood.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    They've publicly denied the accusations, not hid from the issue.
    No, they haven't. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    How exactly are they 'scared'?
    That the money they've spent trying to manipulate American democracy will be wasted.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    Again, as no one has offered proof, it is hardly factual.
    "Corporations anonymously ganging up on American democracy." The Chamber of Commerce represents corporations, its funding is largely anonymous, the donors behind it are acting in concert through its auspices, and it ad campaigns are intended to influence the outcome of the election. In other words, what I just said - corporations anonymously ganging up on American democracy. It is factually correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    In fact, I'm not sure you've made a factual statement since you began posting here.
    That's between you and your dictionary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    Every word you utter proves more and more how much a complete partisan hack you are.
    If you can't argue substantively, then concede or explain your objections in detail. Otherwise you're just debasing yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    That, like most of your other posts, makes no sense what so ever.
    It does if you actually read it and think about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    the entire board.
    You're the elected representative of the entire board?

  3. #143
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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour View Post
    Of course, it doesn't necessarily follow that having a conservative bias means that the people doing it are conservatives - it can be a secondary consequence of institutional factors.
    sure, olberman, ed, maddow, BECK---their shows are all the same

    LOL!

    Since reality has a liberal bias...
    YouTube - Twilight Zone Opening THEME MUSIC 1962 Rod Serling

    If a Republican came on Fox News saying 2 + 2 = 5, the headline would be "Are liberals trying to shortchange arithmetic?"
    link?

    would olberman say the same?

    I think the general tenor of the coverage was against him
    oh, absolutely, barack hussein won the white house IN SPITE OF the conservative bias dominating the msm

    he entered the presidential campaign with such an impressive resume of accomplishments and abilities

    why, mere months after invesco field he won THE NOBEL

    LOL!

    As I've now said several times, it's not illegal for the Chamber of Commerce to accept foreign funds, it has no reason to refuse them, it has every reason to solicit and accept them, it refuses to deny using such funds being used in its political ad campaigns (it only denies their going directly into the campaigns), and its response (and yours) has been exclusively to try to change the subject. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.
    the coc operates in the exact same way and under the exact same rules of disclosure as moveon and the afl-cio

    i wonder why the white house, with its doj and irs, hasn't ACCUSED, on the basis of "it appears" and "i can assert anything i want, bob," the activists and unionists of criminal activity

    it must be because moveon is even more right wing than olberman

    please continue
    Last edited by The Prof; 10-13-10 at 08:13 AM.

  4. #144
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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour
    As I've now said several times, it's not illegal for the Chamber of Commerce to accept foreign funds, it has no reason to refuse them, it has every reason to solicit and accept them, it refuses to deny using such funds being used in its political ad campaigns (it only denies their going directly into the campaigns), and its response (and yours) has been exclusively to try to change the subject. That's more than sufficient to treat it as a high likelihood.
    You mean foreign corporations like BP?

    During his time in the Senate and while running for president, Obama received a total of $77,051 from the oil giant and is the top recipient of BP PAC and individual money over the past 20 years, according to financial disclosure records.
    Obama biggest recipient of BP cash | Reuters

    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour
    No, they haven't. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.
    The chamber adamantly denies that foreign funds are used in its U.S. election efforts, accusing Democrats of orchestrating a speculative smear campaign during a desperate political year.
    washingtonpost.com

    You either don't keep up with the topic or you've drank too much Kool-Aid.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





  5. #145
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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Well, no apparently they don't. This is why I don't read you denouncing the administrations latest claim against the C o C. Or are you doing that now?


    j-mac
    Would you disagree with me? if not, where's the debate?

    However, let's look at the clips Stewart provides on this:

    Jon Stewart talks dirty politics, Karl Rove foreign money allegations

    From a group who are always throwing up aspurtions about where the money comes from, I find this hypocracy humorous, which is why Stewart's joke resonates. However, any thinking person who is considering accepting the claim should stop and ask for evidence. The rules apply across the board, even with the silly hypocracy on your side.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  6. #146
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    Re: Guilty until proven innocent... according to the White House

    Obama and the Democrats are looking more and more like desparate losers every day.

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    Re: Guilty until proven innocent... according to the White House

    did you see this?

    rove's and gillespie's crossroads gps raised THIRTEEN MILLION dollars in only ONE WEEK since oblvious, obtuse, obnoxious obama began his groundless ACCUSATIONS based on nothing more than "i can assert whatever i want, bob"

    Rove-backed group raised $13M since attacks from Obama - The Hill's Blog Briefing Room

    LOL!

    this administration is---demonstrably---over its head, isolated, insular, arrogant and clueless

    whatcha gonna do, now, mr president?

    sic the irs and doj on us?

    you better hurry up, you've already lost congressional backing

    and after november...

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    Re: Guilty until proven innocent... according to the White House

    well, what else is there to talk about

    affable, gaffe-able, laughable joe biden, who is able to campaign for democrats in 100 districts the presidential putz can't appear without hurting someone, lays it out

    we can't campaign on our leviathan list of legislative accomplishments, avers the veep, because "it's just too hard to explain"

    Biden, Obama's Traveling Salesman, Makes Hard Sell to Voters - Bloomberg

    the stimulus, obamacare, reg reform, cap and trade...

    political insiders can only sympathize

    seeya at the polls, pals

    SUE ME, president obama, ATTACK MY SOURCES, i too could use a BUMP

    LOL!

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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian
    They've publicly denied the accusations, not hid from the issue.
    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour View Post
    No, they haven't. They just attacked their accusers, like you're doing, and said that foreign money isn't going directly to ad campaigns. What they refuse to deny is that foreign money is going into the general fund that is being used for the ad campaigns.
    Every time you speak, you prove my point.

    BTW...
    LINK
    The U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the conservative business lobbying group that has vowed to spend $75 million to influence the midterm elections, is denying a report from a liberal group that it is using money from foreign corporations on campaign ads.

    "These accusations are completely erroneous," Tita Freeman, vice president of communications for the Chamber, said in a statement. "... No foreign money is used to fund political activities."

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    Re: Rove, Gillespie Slam Obama for Spreading 'Baseless Lie' Over Foreign Contribution

    Quote Originally Posted by RosieS View Post
    Think Progress GRAPHIC: How The Chamber Gets Its Foreign Money

    1) How many foreign sources of funding does the Chamber have? The Washington Post’s Greg Sargent received this statement from a Chamber spokeswoman: “[Of] the Chamber’s 300,000 members, a relative handful are non-U.S. based companies.” How many is a “relatively handful,” and how much do they contribute?

    2) Are the foreign funds being directed into the same general account that is used to pay for partisan attack ads? Again, the Post’s Greg Sargent pressed on this point. The Chamber, which is running more than $10 million in political advertising just this week (the largest expenditure in one week by an outside group), said, “We are not obligated to discuss our internal accounting procedures.”

    As David Donnelly, national campaigns director for Public Campaign Action Fund, told Politico: “They basically say, ‘trust us’ when there’s mounting evidence they’re outsourcing the funding of their political attacks ads? Yeah, right.” Apparently, the New York Times and the Washington Post were just fine with trusting the Chamber.

    First it's outrageous to allege that foreign funds are collected and used. Then it's not so much money is collected and used. Then it's the Dems do it too.

    Dunno how you can actually run around as much as you do with the goalposts protruding from your back.

    Regards from Rosie
    LINK
    1 & 2) The chamber has denied that foreign members’ payments—which chamber officials say total less than 1% of its $200 million budget—are used for political activities. The chamber is not legally required to disclose its donors.

    Where is all this 'mounting evidence' I hear of? None has been presented. And David Axlerod himself said he doesn't need to provide any.

    NEXT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by Whovian; 10-13-10 at 04:32 PM.

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