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Thread: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

  1. #51
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    The US government was responsible for the actions, and the US government is a representative of the US people. It does mean that the US people share the responsibility for the actions the US government has taken.
    not when you're in opposition

    john boehner, the orange dude, is not responsible for obamacare, for example

    obama is, and pelosi and reid and jerry mcnerney, debbie halvorson, baron hill, travis childers, ann kirkpatrick, patrick murphy, ed perlmutter, gary peters, john salazar, tom perriello...

    I do and so do all Canadians have the indirect blame for those actions taken by the Canadian government
    i don't recognize your concept of indirect blame

    speak for yourself
    Last edited by The Prof; 10-02-10 at 01:53 PM.

  2. #52
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    If the I am supposedly responsible for stuff I had no idea about, then so are the Guatemalan people.



    Complete bull ****.

    None of us knew about it and if we did, most would have been appalled by such things.

    Using your logic, the human experiments in the Manhattan project were innocent victims and responsible for the government injecting them with radioactive material.
    That's garbage.
    The Guatemalan people did not have a choice in who was in their government, they could not hold their government to task for anything the government did, legal or illegal. As such they do not have the direct or indirect blame for what their government did at the time

    It is the American people who elect the government, it is the American people who can demand their government does not hold secrects like the above actions, it is the American people who do hold indirect responsibility for the actions taken by the US government. The direct responsibility of course would lay with the people taking the actions.

    I do not blame the victims for the actions of the US government, (americans injected with radioactive material, or in the case of native canadians having childern kidnapped and put into residential schools) as they did not have the ability to stop it. I do blame the American and Canadian governments, and the people of those countries for not demanding a more open and transparent government. Where things like this could take place
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  3. #53
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    It wasn't me either. I wasn't even born yet.

    The blame lies squarely on those in government at the time who conceived it, approved it, participated in it, and covered it up.

    Don't misunderstand. The US government finally owning up to this and apologizing are the right things for the US government to do.

    But casting a collective guilt-net over every American 60 years later is also a dishonesty.
    No need for Americans to feel guilty over it, but they should accept the fact that compensation should be paid to the victims of those actions, and that they will be the ones who will have to pay for the actions of the US government.
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  4. #54
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    The Guatemalan people did not have a choice in who was in their government, they could not hold their government to task for anything the government did, legal or illegal. As such they do not have the direct or indirect blame for what their government did at the time

    It is the American people who elect the government, it is the American people who can demand their government does not hold secrects like the above actions, it is the American people who do hold indirect responsibility for the actions taken by the US government. The direct responsibility of course would lay with the people taking the actions.

    I do not blame the victims for the actions of the US government, (americans injected with radioactive material, or in the case of native canadians having childern kidnapped and put into residential schools) as they did not have the ability to stop it. I do blame the American and Canadian governments, and the people of those countries for not demanding a more open and transparent government. Where things like this could take place
    We can demand all we want but it doesn't change the fact that we can be just as helpless as the Guatemalans.
    Government has the guns, if they want to experiment on people in secret, they can and probably still do.
    The fact that it is done in secret, makes it near impossible for the American people to discover and hold those who participated accountable.

    The same is true for me though.

    1. I don't see any proof that Congress or the President knew anything about it.
    2. I was not in control of the agencies involved.
    3. I was not born.
    Last edited by Harry Guerrilla; 10-02-10 at 01:51 PM.
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    We can demand all we want but it doesn't change the fact that we can be just as helpless as the Guatemalans.
    Government has the guns, if they want to experiment on people in secret, they can and probably still do.
    The fact that it is done in secret, makes it near impossible for the American people to discover and hold those who participated accountable.

    The same is true for me though.

    1. I don't see any proof that Congress or the President knew anything about it.
    2. I was not in control of the agencies involved.
    3. I was not born.
    You cant change what has happened, you do have the power to try to ensure stuff like that does not occur again
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    No need for Americans to feel guilty over it, but they should accept the fact that compensation should be paid to the victims of those actions, and that they will be the ones who will have to pay for the actions of the US government.
    I have little problem with a monetary compensation.

    But I do have a major problem about being blamed for it, either directly or indirectly.

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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    No need for Americans to feel guilty over it, but they should accept the fact that compensation should be paid to the victims of those actions, and that they will be the ones who will have to pay for the actions of the US government.
    Paying compensation is different from saying everyone is responsible.

    I'm fine with that in fact, they should go after the estates of those who participated, not just squeeze the government for cash.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    You cant change what has happened, you do have the power to try to ensure stuff like that does not occur again
    That opportunity is gone.
    It's unfortunate but I can squarely lay the blame on those who want a federal government that is all encompassing.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    I have little problem with a monetary compensation.

    But I do have a major problem about being blamed for it, either directly or indirectly.
    The blame is placed on the government, in a democracy the government represents the will of the people. As such the actions taken by the government good or bad with or or without public knowledge is done on behalf of the people
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    Re: U.S. to apologize for STD experiments in Guatemala

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Paying compensation is different from saying everyone is responsible.

    I'm fine with that in fact, they should go after the estates of those who participated, not just squeeze the government for cash.
    Why would you pay compensation for something you are not responsible for
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