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Thread: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

  1. #721
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    That "common wealth" supports all of us, not just the rich. This is an argument for a flat tax, not a progressive tax. The "common wealth" helps the rich proportionally to how much it helps the poor.
    The rich benefit more from it. Progressive tax is the most fair.


    "Progressive vs. Regressive Tax Structure". Faded.org - It is appallingly unfair because the rich are the ones who benefit the most from government. How do they benefit more? In almost every way. On the most basic level the government creates and enforces the laws that protect their property. The government invests in the nations infrastructure for things such as national defense, public education, transportation, energy. Without this infrastructure in place *and maintained*, the rich would not have been able to become rich, or be able to maintain it. I read too many comments from people who think that the rich made their money in a vacuum. The welfare of their workers, and the welfare of their society depend on these taxes.

    We're not talking about putting the rich into the poor house. We're talking about 4.3% (no slippery slope arguments here please.) With the rich disproportionately benefiting from what government and society in general are providing, it only makes sense that a progressive tax system is proportional and fair. You can argue all day long that our government is wasteful, and needs reform. On those arguments I'll likely be right beside you (depending of course on what you're considering wasteful). However, you can not ignore the functions that government, and taxes do provide.


    Argument: Wealthy benefit more from system, so owe a greater tax debt - Debatepedia



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
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  2. #722
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Ah poor libs, so much envy, so little rational thought

    I don't have a duty to provide you rent or transportation. If you are not valuable, then you have no right to expect that others should give you money
    Ah, poor conservatives and their myths.

    Did it ever occur to you that Red States pay less taxes and yet receive more from the Federal Government than they pay in, yet the Blue states pay more and receive less. So much for your assumptions!

    Curtis S. Dubay
    Economist
    Tax Foundation Introduction
    The Tax Foundationís annual federal tax burden and expenditure study clarifies the
    geographical patterns of income redistribution that federal tax and spending policies cause each year. The results of the study have been controversial for years because they show that the nation is not only redistributing income from the prosperous to the poor, but from the middle-income residents of high-cost states to the middle-income residents of low-cost states. Thanks to a steeply progressive federal income tax, states with higher incomes pay vastly higher federal taxes, payments that are unlikely ever to be matched by federal spending directed to those states. Ironically, most of these high-paying states are the so-called blue states that have generally elected politicians who support a more steeply progressive tax system even though their own constituents bear a greater share of the burden as the code gets more progressive. All categories of federal taxes, including income taxes on individuals and businesses, social insurance taxes, excise taxes, estate and gift taxes, customs duties and all other taxes, are tabulated and the total tax burden of each state is determined. This figure is compared to the flow of federal funds back to each state, bringing the two sides of federal fiscal operations together. West Virginia, Mississippi and North Dakota received substantially more from the federal government than they paid in taxes, while New Jersey, Connecticut, New Hampshire, Minnesota and Illinois paid much more in taxes than they received in spending.
    Tax burdens for fiscal year (FY) 2004, which starts October 1, 2003 and ends Sep- tember 30, 2004, are used in this study because the most recent state-level federal expenditure data released by the Census Bureau, to which the tax burdens are compared, is for FY 2004.
    The Tax Foundation - Federal Tax Burdens and Expenditures by State



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
    --Adlai Stevenson, Politician





  3. #723
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    The rich benefit more from it. Progressive tax is the most fair.


    "Progressive vs. Regressive Tax Structure". Faded.org - It is appallingly unfair because the rich are the ones who benefit the most from government. How do they benefit more? In almost every way. On the most basic level the government creates and enforces the laws that protect their property. The government invests in the nations infrastructure for things such as national defense, public education, transportation, energy. Without this infrastructure in place *and maintained*, the rich would not have been able to become rich, or be able to maintain it. I read too many comments from people who think that the rich made their money in a vacuum. The welfare of their workers, and the welfare of their society depend on these taxes.

    We're not talking about putting the rich into the poor house. We're talking about 4.3% (no slippery slope arguments here please.) With the rich disproportionately benefiting from what government and society in general are providing, it only makes sense that a progressive tax system is proportional and fair. You can argue all day long that our government is wasteful, and needs reform. On those arguments I'll likely be right beside you (depending of course on what you're considering wasteful). However, you can not ignore the functions that government, and taxes do provide.


    Argument: Wealthy benefit more from system, so owe a greater tax debt - Debatepedia
    you income redistributionists keep making that claim yet there is absolutely no proof of it

    Direct aid to the poor and middle class is much higher than to the rich

    your crap and yes its steaming crap-that the rich benefit more from the government is nonsense.



  4. #724
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    Ah, poor conservatives and their myths.

    Did it ever occur to you that Red States pay less taxes and yet receive more from the Federal Government than they pay in, yet the Blue states pay more and receive less. So much for your assumptions!

    Curtis S. Dubay
    Economist
    Tax Foundation Introduction
    The Tax Foundation’s annual federal tax burden and expenditure study clarifies the
    geographical patterns of income redistribution that federal tax and spending policies cause each year. The results of the study have been controversial for years because they show that the nation is not only redistributing income from the prosperous to the poor, but from the middle-income residents of high-cost states to the middle-income residents of low-cost states. Thanks to a steeply progressive federal income tax, states with higher incomes pay vastly higher federal taxes, payments that are unlikely ever to be matched by federal spending directed to those states. Ironically, most of these high-paying states are the so-called blue states that have generally elected politicians who support a more steeply progressive tax system even though their own constituents bear a greater share of the burden as the code gets more progressive. All categories of federal taxes, including income taxes on individuals and businesses, social insurance taxes, excise taxes, estate and gift taxes, customs duties and all other taxes, are tabulated and the total tax burden of each state is determined. This figure is compared to the flow of federal funds back to each state, bringing the two sides of federal fiscal operations together. West Virginia, Mississippi and North Dakota received substantially more from the federal government than they paid in taxes, while New Jersey, Connecticut, New Hampshire, Minnesota and Illinois paid much more in taxes than they received in spending.
    Tax burdens for fiscal year (FY) 2004, which starts October 1, 2003 and ends Sep- tember 30, 2004, are used in this study because the most recent state-level federal expenditure data released by the Census Bureau, to which the tax burdens are compared, is for FY 2004.
    The Tax Foundation - Federal Tax Burdens and Expenditures by State
    did it ever occur to you that red state blue state is a moronic issue given states like mine go back and forth and that the rich pay far more than they use and the bottom 47% pay no income taxes but certainly use lots of the services the income tax pays for

    West Virginia-two dem senators LOL including the king of pork and most of illinois is tax producers-its Chicago that makes it blue



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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Pardon me-the king of pork recently croaked but when was the last time WVa had republican senators?



  6. #726
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you income redistributionists keep making that claim yet there is absolutely no proof of it
    Our laws that protect ideas, patents, contracts, and everything else involved in Capitalism are more beneficial to the rich company owners than the measly amount a poor family gets on welfare.
    Direct aid to the poor and middle class is much higher than to the rich
    That is too funny! Since when do the rich get direct "aid" from the government?
    What they get is not aid, they get benefits, tax breaks, tax cuts, not too mention all the many different ways the government protects their ideas, contracts, patents, etc., which far outdo what the poor get.

    your crap and yes its steaming crap-that the rich benefit more from the government is nonsense.
    Oh, because you say so? You haven't produced an ounce of information to back up your moronic assumptions, but we are to believe that because you say so!



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
    --Adlai Stevenson, Politician





  7. #727
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    Our laws that protect ideas, patents, contracts, and everything else involved in Capitalism are more beneficial to the rich company owners than the measly amount a poor family gets on welfare.


    That is too funny! Since when do the rich get direct "aid" from the government?
    What they get is not aid, they get benefits, tax breaks, tax cuts, not too mention all the many different ways the government protects their ideas, contracts, patents, etc., which far outdo what the poor get.


    Oh, because you say so? You haven't produced an ounce of information to back up your moronic assumptions, but we are to believe that because you say so!
    I don't see any proof and if you are smart enough to call my assumptions moronic why is it that you are the one who needs a socialist government and I don't.

    you lie out of your six with the crap that the rich "benefit more" In reality the government benefits from the rich not the other way around. its the poor who benefit from the government from the stuff the rich have taken by the government.

    only a COMPLETE MORON would claim that tax cuts are gifts to the rich by the government



  8. #728
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Let's try to be a little original. We don't have a socialist government and there is no call for one.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Let's try to be a little original. We don't have a socialist government and there is no call for one.
    we have a government that is infected to its very core with socialist germs and this place crawls with people who want that disease to spread



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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    we have a government that is infected to its very core with socialist germs and this place crawls with people who want that disease to spread
    Hyperbolic nonsense doesn't equal fact. Sorry. But no one who uses thie tired old tactic has any credibility.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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