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Thread: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

  1. #381
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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The rich will continue to get richer because they send their children to private schools while the poor have their children going to public schools, where loyalty to the Unions comes before loyalty to the children's education.
    Bull****! I went to a public school and it was good enough to get several students into universities that are ranked in the top 50 worldwide. And that is with the teachers being loyal to the union and not the student's education. Lets face it when the majority of the classroom is loud and talks back to the teacher it is not necessarily a good thing for education. But still many students went to university and it was public.

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The rich will continue to get richer because they send their children to private schools while the poor have their children going to public schools, where loyalty to the Unions comes before loyalty to the children's education.
    I would argue this is somewhat correct but its more that the rich people value education more and make certain that their children are well educated (which can mean public schools-some of the best schools in my area are public)



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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray_Fox_86 View Post
    Bull****! I went to a public school and it was good enough to get several students into universities that are ranked in the top 50 worldwide. And that is with the teachers being loyal to the union and not the student's education. Lets face it when the majority of the classroom is loud and talks back to the teacher it is not necessarily a good thing for education. But still many students went to university and it was public.
    I'm quite sure that several students get to University but the odds are greater in private schools than in public.

    Public schools are a mess, and that can't be hidden.

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I'm quite sure that several students get to University but the odds are greater in private schools than in public.

    Public schools are a mess, and that can't be hidden.
    true-my prep school has had 100% college attendance for years

    but I noted an interesting fact at College. The top students invariably came from the very best private schools or the very competitive public schools (like New Trier in Chicago) New Rochelle in NY etc. The kids who made it to the very top of top public schools were generally the best students. For some reason, the kids who went to parochial schools rarely were the top kids.

    I would note that top public schools work well for highly motivated kids. Prep schools work well for them but prep schools often do a far better job for bright kids who have motivational issues or learning disabilities. The kid who was last at my prep school was smart-his boards were around 1250 (back when 600 / 600 was a good score) and he ended up graduating summa cum laude from Vanderbilt.

    He didn't get along with alot of our class and was withdrawn socially but when he got to a big university the tools he got from our prep school allowed him to do very well



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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    So by actually reading the Census report on Income, we find out that the poor are not getting poorer, and that the middle class is moving up the income ladder. [1, page 41 Table A-1]

    So we've established the fact that the rich aren't becoming richer at the expense of the poor or middle class. How are the rich becoming richer? Not because of tax law, but because of greater gains due to trade and globalization. Consider billionaire J.K. Rowling [2]:

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Tabarrok
    Homer, Shakespeare and Tolkien all earned much less. Why? Consider Homer, he told great stories but he could earn no more in a night than say 50 people might pay for an evening's entertainment. Shakespeare did a little better. The Globe theater could hold 3000 and unlike Homer, Shakespeare didn't have to be at the theater to earn. Shakespeare's words were leveraged. ...
    Rowling has the leverage of the book but also the movie, the video game, and the toy. And globalization, both economic and cultural, means that Rowling's words, images, and products are translated, transmitted and transported everywhere - this is the real magic of Ha-li Bo-te. ...
    Rowling's success brings with it inequality. Time is limited and people want to read the same books that their friends are reading so book publishing has a winner-take all component. Thus, greater leverage brings greater inequality. The average writer's income hasn't gone up much in the past thirty years but today, for the first time ever, a handful of writers can be multi-millionaires and even billionaires. The top pulls away from the median.
    Google, Microsoft, Buffet, are other such examples. So yes, the rich are getting richer, perhaps even fantastically rich; but as a general rule no one else is poorer because of it.

    J

    [1] http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/p60-238.pdf
    [2] Marginal Revolution: Harry Potter and the Mystery of Inequality

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Solidus;1059016696]So by actually reading the Census report on Income, we find out that the poor are not getting poorer, and that the middle class is moving up the income ladder. [1, page 41 Table A-1]

    So we've established the fact that the rich aren't becoming richer at the expense of the poor or middle class. How are the rich becoming richer? Not because of tax law, but because of greater gains due to trade and globalization. Consider billionaire J.K. Rowling [2]:
    That's true.

    "The poor" have never been as well off as they are today so saying the gap is widening doesn't really mean a great deal. Wealth isn't a finite amount.

    It's probably more accurate to say that the jealousy factor between the richer and the poorer is rising.

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    That's true.

    "The poor" have never been as well off as they are today so saying the gap is widening doesn't really mean a great deal. Wealth isn't a finite amount.

    It's probably more accurate to say that the jealousy factor between the richer and the poorer is rising.
    the dems gain power playing that up



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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    OMG!!! That's EXACTLY what many of us have been saying!!! If the deficit is such a major concern for Conservatives, what sense does it make to give tax cuts to the wealthiest wage earners if doing so means we have to borrow that money to pay for them which, in turn, will only increase the national debt?
    The deficit and the debt are two different things. Let's not confuse the two.

    But, by your logic, you also support doing away with the earned income credit, as well. Yes?

    You just said, "If you don't have the money to spend, then don't borrow it so you can." Well, our government does not have $700 billion dollars to pay for the largest tax cuts to go to the smallest number of people. It just doesn't make good financial sense to give tax cuts to those who really don't need them. If the government doesn't borrow the money, they'll be forced to print it with no way to actually pay for it other than eventually increasing taxes or cutting alot of programs. I know the latter is what many Conservatives would rather have happen, but if any of you have been paying close attention to what's happening in many European countries right now, the U.S. is bound to face the exact same problems if Republicans regain control of Congress.
    Of course the largest tax cuts will go to the rich, because they're the ones that actually pay taxes.

    If we are to turn our economic situation around, some tough decisions will have to be made in regards to government spending. This we all can agree on. But the bigger issue for the here and now is how best to spur economic growth. I think the President has this country moving in the right direction. By enacting legislation that provide small business loans through those financial institutions who can reach small businesses faster (small, local banks and credit unions), capital will begin to flow again to get our economic engine moving again. Providing tax cuts to the middle-class should give consumers some financial breathing room so that they (and by "they" I mean those of us who make up the middle-class) can buy goods and services, thus, spurring consumer demand. Once demand increases, productivity is bound to follow. As productivity increases, so should business revenue. Where revenue increases, businesses should have the working capital to add to their payrolls which means they'll be able to hire more.
    Businesses aren't borrowing money in this economy. It's idiotic to think that allowing them borrow money, easier is going to fix anything. Goes back to the, "if you don't have it to spend, then you don't borrow it so you can".

    But, don't take my word for it. You'll see in a couple of years when the economy is still in the ****ter.

    The wealthy don't need tax cuts, not for their personal income. They need it for the very businesses they create and manage. Therefore, it makes more sense to give those tax breaks (cuts) to small businesses themselves rather then focusing same towards the personal income of the rich. Let's face it, the truth is the wealthy won't use their pre-tax dollars to invest in small business ventures. They'll place their pre-tax dollar in tax shelters (i.e., 401K, ETF, mutual funds, etc.) to increase their networth. Granted, these investments do help major corporations generate revenues (i.e., sell of stocks, bonds, T-Bills, etc.) and that's what many people think of when the discussion of tax cuts to the wealthy comes about, but these such investments commonly don't benefit the typical "small business", i.e., the day care center, lawn care service, barbar shop, auto mechanic, small bouteque, the hair salon, the small independent book seller, the TV/copier repair service, the small restuarant owner, the corner coffee shop (that's not Starbucks), your cleaner or tailor, etc., etc...the vast number of small businesses that do the majority of the hiring across the country. These are the businesses who need the economic help the most because they hire more people from within their communities!
    Too bad that ain't gonna happen. Small businesses aren't receiving tax cuts.


    So, if you (Republicans) really want to help move this nation's economy forward either get behind legislation that will help move this country forward or get the hell outta the way!
    More taxes will move the country forward? How do you figure that? I can't wait to hear this.
    Last edited by apdst; 10-02-10 at 01:13 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    I will pay whatever taxes the govt asks of me, always have. Think of it as dues paid for the priviledge of living in such a nice country, with real opportunities for anyone willing to do their share of the work on the road to success.
    Stop your incessant whining, and just pay your taxes.
    That almost sounds like something that Karl Maex would say. Nevermind all that crapola about, "inalienable rights". All that bull**** about, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", don't mean anything. We have to pay for the privilege.

    Well, some folks aren't paying their fair share and you don't seem to mind at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Census finds record gap between rich and poor

    Quote Originally Posted by Solidus View Post
    So by actually reading the Census report on Income, we find out that the poor are not getting poorer, and that the middle class is moving up the income ladder. [1, page 41 Table A-1]

    So we've established the fact that the rich aren't becoming richer at the expense of the poor or middle class. How are the rich becoming richer? Not because of tax law, but because of greater gains due to trade and globalization. Consider billionaire J.K. Rowling [2]:



    Google, Microsoft, Buffet, are other such examples. So yes, the rich are getting richer, perhaps even fantastically rich; but as a general rule no one else is poorer because of it.

    J

    [1] http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/p60-238.pdf
    [2] Marginal Revolution: Harry Potter and the Mystery of Inequality
    I think the census said the median income of the middle class and poor was not significantly different in 2009 than it was in 2008 but it had gone down in some income brackets by a percentage point or two. But then the median income over the last ten years hasn't signifigantly changed either, which suggests the poor and middle class are stagnating.

    So if the income of the poor and middle class is stagnating while the rich are getting richer, doesn't that suggest there is a widening gap between the rich and poor? And if 96% of the wealth in this country is concentrated at the top 1% of the population, then doesn't that also suggest a widening gap between the rich and poor? With such an unequal distribution of wealth even the most laisse fair economist has called it a cause for concern for the stability and security of the country.

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