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Thread: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

  1. #871
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    zip98053;1059066373]OMG, going to say that the Democrats were guilty of the meltdown because they had been in power for a whole year? And you claim that I'm an ideologue.

    Now for your handy numbers.

    Bush's first year: Jan 2001 - number of unemployed 6.023M
    Bush's second year: Jan 2002 - number of unemployed 8.182M or a 36% increase in the number of unemployed
    Obama's first year: Jan 2009 - number of unemployed 11.919M
    Obama's second year: Jan 2010 - number of unemployed 14.837M or a 24.5% increase in the number of unemployed
    Unbelievable! You vote? This is your argument? Bush didn't spend 862 billion to have unemployment go to this level nor did Bush claim that if you spend that money unemployment wouldn't exceeed 8%

    The real damage was done in the last year of Bush's reign when the number of unemployed jumped by 56% (according to your numbers). And yes, relative numbers make sense (when a loaf of bread cost $1 and you are making $100, it is relatively more expensive than when bread cost $2 and you are making $500).
    Yep, the real damage was people not paying any attention to the fact that Democrats took Congress in January 2007 and the recession began in December 2007. It does appear that you have been brainwashed by an ideology that the majority in this country are rejecting. Obama approval ratings are tanking badly so apparently the people are waking up and don't see it your way. 4.5 trillion increase in GDP is an incredible number with an inherited recession in 2001-2002 and the current recession 2007-2008.

    I asked you and you ignored what exactly was Congress's role and what did they do or propose that Bush rejected that would have prevented the recession but of course you ignored that. Seems that the three equal branches of govt. only exist when a Democrat is in the WH. Democrats were more interested in regaining the WH than they were in keeping the country out of a recession.


    I suppose that since Bush inherited a surplus and, as you say, tax revenue went up, then it is just an affirmation of Bush's (and the Republican Congress') stewardship that the deficit started growing like crazy under Bush? Bush handed Obama a pile of crap and and Republicans are unwilling to accept that they are AT LEAST as culpable for this mess as the Democrats and much more responsible for this mess than is Obama.
    Please explain how the debt went up every year of the Clinton Administration if there was a surplus inherited? All surpluses have to go to paying down the debt and the debt went up. There was no surplus. Clinton along with a Republican Congress came close but did so by taking money from the SS trust fund to show a lower deficit but taking money from SS left a shortfall in the Intergovt. holdings thus moving money from one account to another doesn't equal a surplus.

    That pile of crap that Obama "inherited" was created in part by Obama and Congress. Learn how the govt. works before buying rhetoric and spouting lies.


    BTW, things are bad enough without your exaggerations. Your own numbers show that the current Unemployed+Discouraged is coming down and today is not "over 16M". I'm also not able to see why the Sept 2010 number of 15.976M U+D is higher than, say, the Oct 2009 value of 16.42. Maybe you meant so say "on a month by month basis" and not "each month"
    You really are one brainwashed individual. We don't have October's numbers yet to see if unemployment in October 2010 is higher or lower than October 2009. But every month of 2010 unemployment is higher than the same month in 2009. Of course you ignored that the recession ended in June 2009 so I am waiting for you to show me any other President in U.S. History that had higher unemployment "on a month to month basis" a year after the recession ended?

    Finally, why are you trying to compare Bush's 8 years against the 18 months of Obama? According to budget projections, the the deficit for the next fiscal year will be less of a percentage of GDP than it was during the typical Bush year. Bush started off with everything in good fiscal shape, Obama didn't. If you just look at the start of his administration and at the end, Bush totally screwed it up. And claiming it was all because Democrats were in control of Congress (but not the Senate) for the last two years of Bush's administration is just total bull**** (the fact that Lieberman caucused with the Democrats didn't make him a Democrat as his support of McCain in 2008 proved).
    According to reality the Debt is increasing and will be 100% of GDP by the end of this year and that fact escapes you. Stop buying what you are told and think. The deficit as a percentage of GDP means nothing if you drive the debt about the total GDP. Everything wasn't in good fiscal shape, we were entering a recession. The dot.com and tech bubble had burst and then we had 9/11.

    But of course this really isn't about Bush, this is about "your" President who is performing up to his resume. Doesn't really matter what I say or what facts I post because you are going to divert back to Bush. The American people are waking up to the mistake they made. Eventually I have faith that you will to. Problem is with you it will be too late. Not sure where you get your information but unfortunately there are still a lot of people like you.

    Democrats had TOTAL Control of the Congress from January 2007 to the present unless of course Republicans made Harry Reid Senate Majority Leader so what is total bull**** is your argument.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    No but I will question you and zip on his line that the deficit as a % of GDP for 2010-2011 will be lower than the average during Bush's years.
    Remains to be seen. But what will your respons ebe if it is?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Unbelievable! You vote? This is your argument? Bush didn't spend 862 billion to have unemployment go to this level nor did Bush claim that if you spend that money unemployment wouldn't exceeed 8%
    Did I call it or what?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    it's all about you

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Did I call it or what?
    Boo, seems you have a problem with anyone that presents verifiable, non partisan actual facts, not predictions or rhetoric. How you can support Obama with the results he has generated is quite telling. Keep buying the liberal rhetoric about how bad Bush was while ignoring that the change promised is worse.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Remains to be seen. But what will your respons ebe if it is?
    then I will say zip is correct. Currently I am very skeptical

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    then I will say zip is correct. Currently I am very skeptical
    Right now the debt is 13.67 trillion dollars and our GDP is 14.5 trillion to we should have total debt at 100% of GDP at the end of fiscal year 2011. Obama has added 3 trillion to the debt in two years, Bush added 5 trillion in 8 and Reagan added 1.7 trillion in 8.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Boo, seems you have a problem with anyone that presents verifiable, non partisan actual facts, not predictions or rhetoric. How you can support Obama with the results he has generated is quite telling. Keep buying the liberal rhetoric about how bad Bush was while ignoring that the change promised is worse.
    No, I have a problem with someone name calling and being silly, and not addressing the explination as to why what you present doesn't do what you claim it does.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, I have a problem with someone name calling and being silly, and not addressing the explination as to why what you present doesn't do what you claim it does.
    Name calling? Been paying any attention to the names I have been called here? What explanation haven't I addresssed? I cannot help it if some do not understand that we have three equal branches of govt. I cannot help it if people do not recognize that the legislative branch of the govt. was controlled by Democrats beginning January 2007. I cannot help it if the results today represent the efforts of that Democrat Congress and Democrat executive branch.

    The numbers I presented are actual facts, they are actual results, not predictions or projections. They show what happened not what someone hoped would happen. You always point to the forward looking statements of the CBO while not recognizing the role of the CBO which is to take Congressional assumptions and come up with a conclusion.

    I would be more than willing to give Obama a chance if his agenda was pro business, pro private sector, pro free enterprise but it isn't and the results are there for all to see. So to compare Obama to Reagan at the same time in his tenure is quite a stretch when Reagan and Obama are at the opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to economic policy.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Name calling? Been paying any attention to the names I have been called here? What explanation haven't I addresssed? I cannot help it if some do not understand that we have three equal branches of govt. I cannot help it if people do not recognize that the legislative branch of the govt. was controlled by Democrats beginning January 2007. I cannot help it if the results today represent the efforts of that Democrat Congress and Democrat executive branch.

    The numbers I presented are actual facts, they are actual results, not predictions or projections. They show what happened not what someone hoped would happen. You always point to the forward looking statements of the CBO while not recognizing the role of the CBO which is to take Congressional assumptions and come up with a conclusion.

    I would be more than willing to give Obama a chance if his agenda was pro business, pro private sector, pro free enterprise but it isn't and the results are there for all to see. So to compare Obama to Reagan at the same time in his tenure is quite a stretch when Reagan and Obama are at the opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to economic policy.
    Yes, I have. And I would complain about that if you weren't so willing to resort to the same tactic everyone time some one disputes you. The numbers you post don't speak to the issue. We've been over this, and you have never addressed that as best I can recall. Just posting numbers are meaningless unless you can show they speak to the issue, and that no other factors are involved. you've failed to that.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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