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Thread: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

  1. #821
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    Let's address those points one at a time, shall we? Lets begin...

    Yes, the combat mission in Iraq has officially ended. THat was in line with the timel;ine established by Dubbya BEFORE he left office. Obama simple followed through with a decision made by Dubbya. The credit belongs to the man who made the initial decison, not the guy who came along after the fact and simply said 'Yeah, let's do that. Sounds like a plan'.

    An increase in troops in Afghanistan, to 'suppress insurgent activity to a level that can be then maintained by the Afghanis'. Sounds a great deal like the 'surge' in Iraq, which was to do the same thing. You know, the surge that Obama said would not work, and would make matters worse, not better? I'm happy to google the exact quote for you, if you can't do it yourself.

    As for your comment about McCain? Every liberal with an ounce of common sense has already admitted that he was not talking about 'combat operations' with that statement. He was refering to a peace-time military presence like we have in dozens of other countries around the world. You should really join the rest of the liberals on that one.
    First off please try to refrain from melting this debate into a "liberal" vs "conservative" fight. We've already had a civil war and no one wants another one. Lets just be Americans.

    Secondly, the combat mission ending date in Iraq set by GW could have easily been renegotiated and extended and many people believed Mccain would do just that if he felt Iraq wasn't stablized yet. Also, he was very clear about his aggressive stance toward Iran. If he would have taken office we might be in three wars right now rather than one.

    As for Obama's troop surge and his previous quote, personally I believe Obama was trying to make the pro-war guys happy, trying to play the middle line. "We will increase troops now but get out in two years", it was an obvious compromise.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    Did I tell you about that beach front property in Arizona I have for sale? I think you'd be interested in purchasing it. The only man who could have fixed this recession in two years was crucified about 2000 years ago.

    BTW, the combat mission in Iraq has ended. The increase in troops in Afghanistan is to try to suppress insurgent activity to a level that can be then maintained by the Afghanis when we leave in two years. Compare both of these things with John Mccains "We will be in Iraq for 100 years if that's what it takes." I'd take Obama's foreign policy over Mccains neo-con policy any day.

    Furthermore, I never said anything about whether Repubs or Dems caused the recession, you just completely imagined that and started arguing for a point I never made. Take your meds dude. And you claim you are bi-partisan but don't recognize that Repubs are just as guilty for the recession as the dems?

    As for your "pro growth, pro business economic policy", how many times have we seen that strategy lead to bubble economies that eventually bust and dangerous deregulation that leads to things like subprime loans derivatives?
    No, but I can give you the non partisan sites that show actual results of the disaster "your" President is.

    What is different in Iraq than Bush did? Did Obama change the Secretary of Defense when he took office? He did change his hand selected Afghanistan Commander though.

    I did not say that Repubicans weren't in part responsible for the recession only that Obama only inherited what he helped create.

    History shows that the only viable economic model in the world that allows people to create their own individual wealth is pro growth, pro business. It created the greatest economy in the world, one that liberals want to destroy.

    I posted the Obama results which show why Obama's approval ratings are dropping daily and are now between 38-42%. There is a reason that the majority in this country aren't seeing what you see. Wonder who has it right?

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    First off please try to refrain from melting this debate into a "liberal" vs "conservative" fight. We've already had a civil war and no one wants another one. Lets just be Americans.

    Secondly, the combat mission ending date in Iraq set by GW could have easily been renegotiated and extended and many people believed Mccain would do just that if he felt Iraq wasn't stablized yet. Also, he was very clear about his aggressive stance toward Iran. If he would have taken office we might be in three wars right now rather than one.

    As for Obama's troop surge and his previous quote, personally I believe Obama was trying to make the pro-war guys happy, trying to play the middle line. "We will increase troops now but get out in two years", it was an obvious compromise.
    I simply stated a fact. MOST liberals admit the '100 years' comment from McCain was exactly what I said, not what you implied. I can't help it if you're simply wrong and refuse to man up to it like the vast majority of other liberals already have.

    You offer supposition, while I presented fact.

    Again, you offer supposition where I offered fact.

    I think you need to try a little harder.

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    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    History shows that the only viable economic model in the world that allows people to create their own individual wealth is pro growth, pro business. It created the greatest economy in the world, one that liberals want to destroy.
    Haha, this country was founded by liberals, it was liberals who established that idea of free market economy. You think it was conservatives who believed every man should be treated equal, have representation in his government, and have the rights to profit off of his labor? The revolutionaries were liberals (the conservatives were loyal to the crown), Abe Lincoln was a liberal (yes, I KNOW HE WAS A REPUBLICAN, PLEASE DON"T BRING UP THAT MUTE POINT. DEMOCRATS WERE CONSERVATIVES BACK THEN AND ONLY RECENTLY DID THOSE CONSERVATIVES SWITCH OVER TO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY), and the civil rights movement was led by liberals. Liberals are the foundation of this country and responsible for every significant event that has shaped us in a better way. Hell, when compared to Saudia Arabia, North Korea, China, we are ALL liberals! Liberalism is a good thing and when you bash liberalism you bash America.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    Haha, this country was founded by liberals, it was liberals who established that idea of free market economy. You think it was conservatives who believed every man should be treated equal, have representation in his government, and have the rights to profit off of his labor? The revolutionaries were liberals (the conservatives were loyal to the crown), Abe Lincoln was a liberal (yes, I KNOW HE WAS A REPUBLICAN, PLEASE DON"T BRING UP THAT MUTE POINT. DEMOCRATS WERE CONSERVATIVES BACK THEN AND ONLY RECENTLY DID THOSE CONSERVATIVES SWITCH OVER TO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY), and the civil rights movement was led by liberals. Liberals are the foundation of this country and responsible for every significant event that has shaped us in a better way. Hell, when compared to Saudia Arabia, North Korea, China, we are ALL liberals! Liberalism is a good thing and when you bash liberalism you bash America.
    Is this what you are learning in school? This country wasn't founded by liberals, it was founded by small govt, free market, personal responsibility individuals who believed in individual wealth creation and did not trust a large central govt. Not sure what history book you are reading but our Founders are turning over in their graves seeing the current 3.8 trillion dollar massive bureaucracy we have as a federal govt.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Is this what you are learning in school? This country wasn't founded by liberals, it was founded by small govt, free market, personal responsibility individuals who believed in individual wealth creation and did not trust a large central govt. Not sure what history book you are reading but our Founders are turning over in their graves seeing the current 3.8 trillion dollar massive bureaucracy we have as a federal govt.
    I don't think he realizes that 'liberals' in the 1700's were the 'conservatives' of today, and that 'conservatives' in the 1700's were the 'liberals' of today.

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    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    I simply stated a fact. MOST liberals admit the '100 years' comment from McCain was exactly what I said, not what you implied. I can't help it if you're simply wrong and refuse to man up to it like the vast majority of other liberals already have.

    You offer supposition, while I presented fact.

    Again, you offer supposition where I offered fact.

    I think you need to try a little harder.
    Most EVERYONE admits he was talking about military presence, why just say liberal? Because you're a liberal basher. His comment, even though talking about military presence, clearly dictated his pro-Iraq war views and those don't align with my views. If Colin Powell could have proved that there was actually a connection between Saddam and Alqaeda or if Bush could prove their was WMDs in Iraq still, I'd feel different. But neither of these were true. We were lied to and because of that 600,000 Iraqis have died and about 5,000 Americans have died and we've spent almost a trillion dollars. GTFO of Iraq is all I want to hear from a politician.

  8. #828
    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    I don't think he realizes that 'liberals' in the 1700's were the 'conservatives' of today, and that 'conservatives' in the 1700's were the 'liberals' of today.
    That's what you guys don't realize. You are liberals and you don't even know it.

  9. #829
    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Is this what you are learning in school? This country wasn't founded by liberals, it was founded by small govt, free market, personal responsibility individuals who believed in individual wealth creation and did not trust a large central govt. Not sure what history book you are reading but our Founders are turning over in their graves seeing the current 3.8 trillion dollar massive bureaucracy we have as a federal govt.
    Did you even go to college? Look up John Locke and let me know when your foot is out of your mouth.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You don't put much effort in to responding to facts either. Noticed how you ran from the bea and bls data and continue to run from explaining human behavior and how behavior affects economic activity.
    If by ran you mean explaining how it doesn't answer the question or do what you say it does, yeah. I did that.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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