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Thread: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    It's called fiscal responsibility (I've answered this before). And I haven't divirted from anything jr.
    LOL, so your idea of fiscal responsibility at the Federal Level is taking money from the private sector and those that produce? Fiscal Responsibility means controlling spending and matching spending with revenue received, not running deficits.

    Interesting that liberal definition of fiscal responsibility only focuses on what others pay in taxes.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    LOL, so your idea of fiscal responsibility at the Federal Level is taking money from the private sector and those that produce? Fiscal Responsibility means controlling spending and matching spending with revenue received, not running deficits.

    Interesting that liberal definition of fiscal responsibility only focuses on what others pay in taxes.
    We pay taxes to pay for services. That's how it works. You can't say I want my medicare and not pay taxes. Yo9u can't say I want us to fight two needless wars and not be taxed. That's how it works.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    We pay taxes to pay for services. That's how it works. You can't say I want my medicare and not pay taxes. Yo9u can't say I want us to fight two needless wars and not be taxed. That's how it works.
    47% of the people in this country don't pay Federal Income taxes.

    I have no problem with use taxes but I do have a problem with class warfare which liberals promote. You seem to have a problem understanding exactly what taxes you pay and for what. We had a 3.8 trillion dollar budget last year and the war in Iraq/Afghanistan cost a small percentage of that yet the deficit was 1.3 trillion dollars so you can divert, distort, and hide from reality but the facts trump your feelings. The Iraq/Afghanistan war didn't cost 1.3 trillion last year nor did those wars cause 16 million Americans from being unemployed. Your President created both the deficit and the increase in unemployment.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    47% of the people in this country don't pay Federal Income taxes.

    I have no problem with use taxes but I do have a problem with class warfare which liberals promote. You seem to have a problem understanding exactly what taxes you pay and for what. We had a 3.8 trillion dollar budget last year and the war in Iraq/Afghanistan cost a small percentage of that yet the deficit was 1.3 trillion dollars so you can divert, distort, and hide from reality but the facts trump your feelings. The Iraq/Afghanistan war didn't cost 1.3 trillion last year nor did those wars cause 16 million Americans from being unemployed. Your President created both the deficit and the increase in unemployment.
    Those who don't pay don't have much to pay with. Again, I have no problem with this. Nor with a progressive tax. I pay more than some and some pay more than me. I see no problem with this.

    And no, the deficit has been here a long time:

    The United States has had public debt since its inception. Debts incurred during the American Revolutionary War and under the Articles of Confederation led to the first yearly reported value of $75,463,476.52 on January 1, 1791. Over the following 45 years, the debt grew, briefly contracted to zero on January 8, 1835 under President Andrew Jackson but then quickly grew into the millions again.[7]

    The first dramatic growth spurt of the debt occurred because of the Civil War. The debt was just $65 million in 1860, but passed $1 billion in 1863 and had reached $2.7 billion following the war. The debt slowly fluctuated for the rest of the century, finally growing steadily in the 1910s and early 1920s to roughly $22 billion as the country paid for involvement in World War I.[7]

    The buildup and involvement in World War II plus social programs during the F.D. Roosevelt and Truman presidencies in the 1930s and '40s caused a sixteenfold increase in the gross debt from $16 billion in 1930 to $260 billion in 1950.

    After this period, the growth of the gross debt closely matched the rate of inflation where it tripled in size from $260 billion in 1950 to around $909 billion in 1980. Gross debt in nominal dollars quadrupled during the Reagan and Bush presidencies from 1980 to 1992. The Public debt quintupled in nominal terms.

    In nominal dollars the public debt rose and then fell between 1992 and 2000 from $3T in 1992 to $3.4T in 2000. During the administration of President George W. Bush, the gross debt increased from $5.6 trillion in January 2001 to $10.7 trillion by December 2008,[8] rising from 58% of GDP to 70.2% of GDP. During March 2009, the Congressional Budget Office estimated that gross debt will rise from 70.2% of GDP in 2008 to 100.6% in 2012.

    United States public debt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Those who don't pay don't have much to pay with. Again, I have no problem with this. Nor with a progressive tax. I pay more than some and some pay more than me. I see no problem with this.

    And no, the deficit has been here a long time:

    The United States has had public debt since its inception. Debts incurred during the American Revolutionary War and under the Articles of Confederation led to the first yearly reported value of $75,463,476.52 on January 1, 1791. Over the following 45 years, the debt grew, briefly contracted to zero on January 8, 1835 under President Andrew Jackson but then quickly grew into the millions again.[7]

    The first dramatic growth spurt of the debt occurred because of the Civil War. The debt was just $65 million in 1860, but passed $1 billion in 1863 and had reached $2.7 billion following the war. The debt slowly fluctuated for the rest of the century, finally growing steadily in the 1910s and early 1920s to roughly $22 billion as the country paid for involvement in World War I.[7]

    The buildup and involvement in World War II plus social programs during the F.D. Roosevelt and Truman presidencies in the 1930s and '40s caused a sixteenfold increase in the gross debt from $16 billion in 1930 to $260 billion in 1950.

    After this period, the growth of the gross debt closely matched the rate of inflation where it tripled in size from $260 billion in 1950 to around $909 billion in 1980. Gross debt in nominal dollars quadrupled during the Reagan and Bush presidencies from 1980 to 1992. The Public debt quintupled in nominal terms.

    In nominal dollars the public debt rose and then fell between 1992 and 2000 from $3T in 1992 to $3.4T in 2000. During the administration of President George W. Bush, the gross debt increased from $5.6 trillion in January 2001 to $10.7 trillion by December 2008,[8] rising from 58% of GDP to 70.2% of GDP. During March 2009, the Congressional Budget Office estimated that gross debt will rise from 70.2% of GDP in 2008 to 100.6% in 2012.

    United States public debt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Please, someone wake me when Boo actually addresses the issues raised and the thread topic. Does anyone here actually understand the role of the Federal Govt. and how Federal taxes affect state revenue?

    Obama has added 3 trillion dollars to the debt in 2 years and what do we get here, more Reagan and Bush bashing? That is nothing more than diversion. Can someone here tell me where the repayment of TARP loans went? Also note that the debt in 2012, by Boo's own numbers goes to over 100% in 2012 and the question is why? Why would anyone support that massive growth in the size of the Federal Govt. and further abdicate state and local responsibility?

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Please, someone wake me when Boo actually addresses the issues raised and the thread topic. Does anyone here actually understand the role of the Federal Govt. and how Federal taxes affect state revenue?

    Obama has added 3 trillion dollars to the debt in 2 years and what do we get here, more Reagan and Bush bashing? That is nothing more than diversion. Can someone here tell me where the repayment of TARP loans went? Also note that the debt in 2012, by Boo's own numbers goes to over 100% in 2012 and the question is why? Why would anyone support that massive growth in the size of the Federal Govt. and further abdicate state and local responsibility?
    And he's not alone. I keep telling you, if you're seriously concerned about the debt, call for cutting spending and raising taxes. if you don't, you're not serious.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    And he's not alone. I keep telling you, if you're seriously concerned about the debt, call for cutting spending and raising taxes. if you don't, you're not serious.
    Why would I support taking more money from the American people something that has always generated more taxpayers? Cutting spending is great but raising taxes will not put 16 million Americans back to work unless of course the American people spend more money when they have less take home pay.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Why would I support taking more money from the American people something that has always generated more taxpayers? Cutting spending is great but raising taxes will not put 16 million Americans back to work unless of course the American people spend more money when they have less take home pay.
    I'm sorry, but you've failed to support that claim. We are at this moment under the tax cuts, and we don't have more tax payers. And if you look thoughout history, we clearly see that taxes have played no significant role on the economy or job creation. Again, we've been through this.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I'm sorry, but you've failed to support that claim. We are at this moment under the tax cuts, and we don't have more tax payers. And if you look thoughout history, we clearly see that taxes have played no significant role on the economy or job creation. Again, we've been through this.
    We are indeed a moment of tax cuts that are offset by the uncertainty as to the cost of the Obama agenda that will be forthcoming. As an expert business person would you hire more people not knowing what your taxes are going to be January 1, 2011? How much are employers going to have to pay for Obamacare for their employees? Apparently you don't have a problem since you are a wage slave instead of an entreprenuer! 16 million people unemployed, how are you going to put them back to work, raising taxes?

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    We are indeed a moment of tax cuts that are offset by the uncertainty as to the cost of the Obama agenda that will be forthcoming. As an expert business person would you hire more people not knowing what your taxes are going to be January 1, 2011? How much are employers going to have to pay for Obamacare for their employees? Apparently you don't have a problem since you are a wage slave instead of an entreprenuer! 16 million people unemployed, how are you going to put them back to work, raising taxes?
    While I think you're wrong here is well, you actually support my point, just as you have in the past. Other things effect the economy. Taxes can't override other factors. And there is no evidence that taxes destroy the economy or create jobs and bring about Nirvana.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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