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Thread: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

  1. #431
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    how many of the 54% who say they won't buy a gm car are gonna buy its stock?
    Plenty. Besides, you are ignoring (among a great number of things you either do not like or cannot refute) that the majority of stock held in this nation is held by a relatively small percentage of people. It does not matter if that 54% doesn't buy a car because they aren't the large stock purchasers in the first place. Insitutional money far outweights individuals in most mutual funds and hedge funds by leaps and bounds. What matter is future cash flows. And GM looks like it's seeing large positives. That is what matters. Do some thinking for a change rather then swallowing whatever the pundits tell you.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Plenty. Besides, you are ignoring (among a great number of things you either do not like or cannot refute) that the majority of stock held in this nation is held by a relatively small percentage of people. It does not matter if that 54% doesn't buy a car because they aren't the large stock purchasers in the first place. Insitutional money far outweights individuals in most mutual funds and hedge funds by leaps and bounds. What matter is future cash flows. And GM looks like it's seeing large positives. That is what matters. Do some thinking for a change rather then swallowing whatever the pundits tell you.
    I am curious-where do you get off telling someone else to do some thinking? it appears that the poster you attacked has done plenty of that



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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by jkohn51192
    Obnoxious Obama isnt raising taxes on the middle class. He wants to leave the tax cuts for the middle class, and tax the richest top 2% in America. Please, quit spreading lies and get your facts straight.
    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    but wait a minute, wasn't it also Obama and liberals that preached that the Bush tax cuts were "only for the rich"? You can't have it both ways there.

    j-mac
    Sure he can... he's a liberal

  4. #434
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I am curious-where do you get off telling someone else to do some thinking? it appears that the poster you attacked has done plenty of that
    And you got that notion where? He argued that GM sucked because sales were down while ignoring that the same time period showed all major manufactures down. The fact that I cited GM's rising sales numbers as to why prof's argument on the poll was crap and he reciting it does not suggest prof has done much of any thinking. And it frankly doesn't matter if 54% of those who say they wouldn't buy a car from GM (despite rising sales numbers) wouldn't buy the stock. That's not how securities purchase are centered in this market. Basing his argument on the poll while reality does not support his position does not suggest thinking was done. At all. In any way shape or form.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    from the pundits at reuters:

    * Treasury to sell first shares below break-even-sources

    * 61 pct Treasury sale could take several years-sources

    * Taxpayer break-even is around $70 bln GM market value

    By Clare Baldwin, Soyoung Kim and Kevin Krolicki

    NEW YORK/DETROIT, Sept 3 (Reuters) - The U.S. government is likely to take a loss on General Motors Co in the first offering of the automaker's stock, six people familiar with preparations for the landmark IPO said.

    Subsequent offerings of the government's holdings may be profitable depending on how investors trade the newly listed stock, the sources said.

    But the question of whether taxpayers are ultimately made whole on GM's $50 billion bailout could be left open for years, the people said.

    The Obama administration has pledged to exit its investment in GM as quickly as possible while holding out the prospect that taxpayers could ultimately be paid back in full.

    GM in August filed paperwork for an IPO that could potentially be worth as much as $20 billion, making it one of the biggest IPOs of all time.
    UPDATE 2-Taxpayers likely to face initial loss on GM IPO-sources | Reuters

    from the spin meisters at wapo:

    In order for the United States to recoup all of its $50 billion investment in General Motors, it must sell its ownership stake at $134 a share, according to the special inspector general of the government's bailout programs.

    The price needed for a full recovery of the U.S. investment is far higher than shares of the automaker have ever reached, and some analysts and government officials have expressed doubts that the United States will be able to recover the money.
    GM must sell for $134 a share for U.S. to recover investment

    BUY!
    Last edited by The Prof; 10-10-10 at 02:13 AM.

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    who's gonna buy stock in a company he or she knows won't sell to 54%?

    70 billion dollars is a lot of recouping geithner needs from YOU

    get BUYING!

    hurry up and buy MORE!

    do your part, now

  7. #437
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    who's gonna buy stock in a company he or she knows won't sell to 54%?
    Someone who looks at future cash flows and sees profit.

    I noticed you didn't bother to research anything recently:

    General Motors sales jump 22 percent; company sells 516 Chevrolet Cruzes; Ford and Chrysler sales skyrocket | cleveland.com

    CLEVELAND, Ohio -- General Motors sales jumped 22 percent in September for the company's four remaining brands, driven primarily by big increases in sales of mid-sized crossovers such as the Chevrolet Equinox.
    GM Gets Better Rating From S&P Than Ford on Cash Flow - Bloomberg

    GM has good prospects for generating cash from its operations in China and Brazil and has an improved balance sheet after emerging from bankruptcy in July 2009, he said.
    Future capacity to generate profits suggests you are (as usual) wrong.

    70 billion dollars is a lot of recouping geithner needs from YOU

    get BUYING!

    hurry up and buy MORE!

    do your part, now
    If it nets me a decent return, why not? Try analyze things on something other then your partisan bias for a change.

    Btw, do your research. Look up GM's position in Asia.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  8. #438
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Someone who looks at future cash flows and sees profit.
    you mean like the analysts and govt officials who "expressed doubts that the us will be able to recover" the 70B necessary to make the taxpayer whole?

    If it nets me a decent return, why not?
    don't tell me, don't tell the pundits at reuters and wapo

    BUY!

  9. #439
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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    you mean like the analysts and govt officials who "expressed doubts that the us will be able to recover" the 70B necessary to make the taxpayer whole?
    Your over the top partisan behavior is becoming tiring. You do not even bother to think or analyze. Nor do you even try to hide the fact you didn't think about the subject. The government is likely to face a loss on the bailout because it is trying to get out as fast as possible. They are doing what YOU want them to do.

    Other investors however, particularly institutions do not have the same time frame. Long term cash flows suggest that GM over time does offer fairly decent returns. Investment grade if you will. The fact they got a better rating on cash flow then Ford suggests that they will have money to make improvements and generate dividends and capital gains to investors.

    don't tell me, don't tell the pundits at reuters and wapo

    BUY!
    Well, capital markets are suggesting you (as usual) are wrong.

    Taxpayers may profit on GM bailout, despite weak IPO market - Sep. 27, 2010

    I see you failed to look up GM's position in Asia.

    Just repeat the Partisan Vomit from pundits. You don't need to think.

    Put some effort into your posts for a once in your posting career here.

    Let's recap.
    GM made a sizable 2nd Q profit
    GM is seeing significant jumps in sales
    GM has a strong position in Asia and South America
    GM just shed huge amounts of debt and large amounts of Union crap
    GM revamped its production processes and streamlined design

    What made GM total crap in the past is largely gone. And you think it's still a loser. Tell me, how did Ford's stock price do? Because it has more problems then GM.
    Last edited by obvious Child; 10-10-10 at 02:53 AM.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: More Democrats break with Obama on tax cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    The government is likely to face a loss on the bailout because it is trying to get out as fast as possible.
    reuters:

    The Obama administration has pledged to exit its investment in GM as quickly as possible while holding out the prospect that taxpayers could ultimately be paid back in full.

    It could take more than three years for the Treasury to sell down its remaining stake in GM after the IPO, one person said. That would push a final accounting into the next presidential term.

    A decision to price the initial GM shares below the cost to taxpayers would follow the usual Wall Street practice of giving the first investors in a new stock a discount, but it could also help allay investor concern in the face of the slow recovery of the U.S. economy and flat auto sales.
    holding out the prospect, huh?

    that taxpayers could be ultimately paid back in full?

    well, i'm glad the president didn't slam shut THAT door

    aren't you?

    but that investor concern, hmm...

    and those flat auto sales...

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    They are doing what YOU want them to do.
    i've expressed no preferences, i've merely quoted the pundits (LOL!) from reuters and the post

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Long term cash flows suggest that GM over time does offer fairly decent returns. Investment grade if you will.
    bloomberg, your link (thanks):

    The credit service today said it assigned Detroit-based GM a BB- rating with a stable outlook. It had previously given Ford a B+ rating with a positive outlook. GMs rating is three levels below investment grade.
    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    GM just shed huge amounts of debt and large amounts of Union crap.
    reuters:

    At the same time, GM will have to confront a pension shortfall that remains a liability from its pre-bankruptcy operations.

    GM eliminated about $40 billion in unsecured debt and other obligations in bankruptcy, but the automaker still needs to address a pension shortfall estimated at about $26 billion.
    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    What made GM total crap in the past is largely gone. And you think it's still a loser.
    not as much as those analysts and govt officials and pundits (LOL!) at wapo, bloomberg and reuters

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Tell me, how did Ford's stock price do?
    nowhere near well enough to recoup 70B

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Because it has more problems than GM.
    not enough reason for most to invest

    but, by all means, don't let that stop YOU

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