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Thread: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Thank you.
    Thats what Ive been trying to point out, that he is using it all wrong.
    You, Gunny... err.. sorry, Massa Saarge, and myself have all pointed that out to him now.

    And Gunney is a real tight ass about military procedure usually.....

    err... Massa sarge...sorry.
    I keep wanting to call him Master Chief....
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham
    Iíve always believed that America is an idea, not defined by its people but by its ideals. - Lindsey Graham

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I keep wanting to call him Master Chief....
    that reminded me of a conversation I had with my brother about inter service relationships.

    My bro worked a fuel depot overseas where they fueled all sorts of ****, including upon occassion Marine Corps helicopters and ****, and worked at a base at one point where there was a Marine unit based there.

    These Army folks, a small team of them running this depot detached from their main unit, mostly stuck to themselves, but upon this one occassion he still remembers, he had to deal with a Marine Staff Sergeant who, I would hope at that point, understood how the Army works as far as E-5 through E-7 being called "sergeant', yet the guy still got all up in arms about being called Sergeant by a Specialist who is obviously following his training and what has become 2nd nature to him.

    I always think its funny how Marine NCOs feel the need to correct Army folks on this, even though it goes against our training and what would by this point be 2nd nature to us based upon the Army culture.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Yes, but he is using Fraternization all wrong. There is nothing to stop any officer from attending any wedding of another service member. Hell, there is nothing stopping officers from, on occasion, partying with enlisted members. My going away party when I got out had several officers present, including our skipper. His 12 years of service has not made him right.
    Ya'll definitely need to learn more about how fraternization is defined. You should also learn how fraternization is defined, in relationship to chain of command.

    AR 600-20:

    (1) Compromise, or appear to compromise, the integrity of supervisory authority or the chain of command.

    (2) Cause actual or perceived partiality or unfairness.

    (3) Involve, or appear to involve, the improper use of rank or position for personal gain.

    (4) Are, or are perceived to be, exploitative or coercive in nature.

    (5) Create an actual or clearly predictable adverse impact on discipline, authority, morale, or the ability of the command to accomplish its mission.

    http://usmilitary.about.com/od/army/...ation.-u3q.htm
    Last edited by apdst; 09-13-10 at 09:33 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    So there is absolutely no evidence this woman, whom you called a slut, did this but you are ready to take someone's word as evidence. Guess you don't think witch hunts have to end when it's going after the certain people.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    I see the regulation, and what Redress said does not appear to compromise that list.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Where they get you on fraternization is with the "perceived" or "appears to" bull****. All it takes is for one whiney arsed, pansy, piece of crap to complain and holy**** batman...you've got perception and/or appearance of impropriety. Doesn't matter whether there is anything wrong going on or not...bastards

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    Where they get you on fraternization is with the "perceived" or "appears to" bull****. All it takes is for one whiney arsed, pansy, piece of crap to complain and holy**** batman...you've got perception and/or appearance of impropriety. Doesn't matter whether there is anything wrong going on or not...bastards
    That's exactly right.

    PFC Joe gets married on saturday and invites his company commander, Captain Bob. Monday morning, PFC Joe is promoted to Specialist. PFC Frank is pissed, because either he doesn't like Joe, he doesn't like Bob, felt like HE should have been promoted, or is just a whiney little asshole and marches his ass right up to the battalion commander's office and starts a whole truckload of ****.

    This is why officers do not put themselves in these types of situations.
    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    So there is absolutely no evidence this woman, whom you called a slut, did this but you are ready to take someone's word as evidence. Guess you don't think witch hunts have to end when it's going after the certain people.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I see the regulation, and what Redress said does not appear to compromise that list.
    Officers partying with enlisted men doesn't comprimise the regulations? You're just being obtuse, now. What about officers and enlisted men gambling?
    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    So there is absolutely no evidence this woman, whom you called a slut, did this but you are ready to take someone's word as evidence. Guess you don't think witch hunts have to end when it's going after the certain people.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That's exactly right.

    PFC Joe gets married on saturday and invites his company commander, Captain Bob. Monday morning, PFC Joe is promoted to Specialist. PFC Frank is pissed, because either he doesn't like Joe, he doesn't like Bob, felt like HE should have been promoted, or is just a whiney little asshole and marches his ass right up to the battalion commander's office and starts a whole truckload of ****.

    This is why officers do not put themselves in these types of situations.
    Then they shut his stupid ass up when they remind him that Specialist promotion usually comes at the 24 month mark reguardless, unless you've been punished under UCMJ.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Then they shut his stupid ass up when they remind him that Specialist promotion usually comes at the 24 month mark reguardless, unless you've been punished under UCMJ.
    true. the point is, if you are an officer you have to make damned sure that you don't allow yourself to get into situations where your actions can be questioned.

    I see nothing wrong with officers attending social gatherings with enlisted. Where the problems come in is when the Company CO starts hanging out at Joe Snuffy's house on the weekend and going on fisihing trips with him.

    Attending weddings, parties, etc should pose no problems and in most cases are beneficial to morale.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Then they shut his stupid ass up when they remind him that Specialist promotion usually comes at the 24 month mark reguardless, unless you've been punished under UCMJ.
    Or, most probably, the battalion commander asks Captain Bob, what the hell he was doing associating with his enlisted men and reminds him of how that can very easily be, "perceived" as, or, "appear" to be, fraternization.
    Quote Originally Posted by americanwoman View Post
    So there is absolutely no evidence this woman, whom you called a slut, did this but you are ready to take someone's word as evidence. Guess you don't think witch hunts have to end when it's going after the certain people.

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