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Thread: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That's one army. And, again, that's a different culture. The IDF also has an 8% casualty rate, during training, because they're training is ultra realistic. Should we replicate that, too?
    So first you dismiss the results in a number of different countries because of how long its been since they've seen a "real" war, then you dismiss the IDF because their culture is different.

    In other words, the IDF is more professional than we are when it comes to personal feelings on gays, so we couldn't possibly handle it as well as they do.

    Got it.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Why are you folks having such a hard time seeing the big picture? Is it a lack of military experience? You're just being obtuse? What?
    I'm not having a hard time seeing the big picture. I'm trying to get one of you to admit that the ONLY reason letting gays serve openly would affect unit cohesion is that we have a military that isn't professional enough to set aside personal prejudice in the name of serving their country.

    You guys keep sorta hinting at that. I just want you to come out and say it.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Would you like an army study? I have one.
    So, you're going to take these studies, done by who knows, who and ptu that up against decades of combined experience of combat soldiers that are telling you something completely opposite? We've been there and done that, but we're all full of ****?

    Listen to yourself!
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    I'm not having a hard time seeing the big picture. I'm trying to get one of you to admit that the ONLY reason letting gays serve openly would affect unit cohesion is that we have a military that isn't professional enough to set aside personal prejudice in the name of serving their country.

    You guys keep sorta hinting at that. I just want you to come out and say it.
    What unit did you serve in?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    What unit did you serve in?
    Oh, I get it. You don't want to answer the question -- is the reason that unit cohesion would be impacted by gays serving openly the fact that our military isn't professional enough to set aside personal prejudice in the name of serving their country -- so you try to assault my credibility.

    That's not going to work, because I'm not claiming to be an expert, or to have experience.

    I'm just asking a question.

    I can't seem to get a straight answer.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Why are you folks having such a hard time seeing the big picture? Is it a lack of military experience? You're just being obtuse? What?
    There just wouldn't be a problem with gays serving openly, if it wasn't for the prejudice of the senior NCOs.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    So, you're going to take these studies, done by who knows, who and ptu that up against decades of combined experience of combat soldiers that are telling you something completely opposite? We've been there and done that, but we're all full of ****?

    Listen to yourself!
    Well you are full of it that much is for sure.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    How about the IDF? That was the subject of the report he linked to earlier.
    There's no way to tell. The IDF hasn't been in a prolonged conflict like the 6-Day War, or the '67 War, since they lifted the ban on gays in 1993.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    Oh, I get it. You don't want to answer the question -- is the reason that unit cohesion would be impacted by gays serving openly the fact that our military isn't professional enough to set aside personal prejudice in the name of serving their country -- so you try to assault my credibility.

    That's not going to work, because I'm not claiming to be an expert, or to have experience.

    I'm just asking a question.

    I can't seem to get a straight answer.
    Then, why are you calling the people that do have the experience that we disagree with you, because we're just a buncha homophobes?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Dont ask Dont tell Policy Ruled Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    There's no way to tell. The IDF hasn't been in a prolonged conflict like the 6-Day War, or the '67 War, since they lifted the ban on gays in 1993.
    Are you kidding me?

    Would anybody from Israel who has served in the IDF care to weigh in and agree with apdst, that the IDF hasn't seen "real" combat since the war in 1967?
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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