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What makes you think that the NCO corps is endorsing the harassment of gays?
I served. I saw what I saw.
What makes you think that the NCO corps is endorsing the harassment of gays?
Edit: Funny how my comments in this thread always appear in the top of a new page.
Society did this to you huh :lamo:lamo:lamo
Unfortunately, you are proving otherwise. You see, when a person accuses the military of being unproffessional and that "it makes sense," he does maintain a streak of hatred towards it.
You have been given your answers over and over despite asking the same boringly laced questions. Like them or not there they are. The military is professional enough to follow the policy set by civilians. DADT is of White House origin. Eventually, gays will serve openly. The prejudice of an American society is reflected within our military. You can beat on the military over andover fromthe safetly of your keyboard, but in the end, the frustration you see in the mirror comes from our society...not the military aspect of it.
I would tend to think it is unlikely that this is happening. First off the NCO corps is not some unified entity, and secondly, my experience is that most NCO's don't have patients with anything disrupting getting the job done, and that would include harassment of people.
Moderator's Warning: |
Not pointing to any post in particular at the moment, but the namecalling ends now. |
I served. I saw what I saw.
As I said, the first Lebanon war was stretching after 93, and until 2000.
It could also be pointed out that besides the second Intifada, the second Lebanon war and operation Cast Lead in Gaza, the IDF is always involved in warfare operations.
Edit: Funny how my comments in this thread always appear in the top of a new page.
I served. I saw what I saw.
That's exactly right. Therein lies part of the problem. Gays, serving in a combat unit, will create disruptions in getting the job done. It's inevitable.
Sounds like you served with some sub-standard NCO's.
Okay, so in other words (if I may summarize) apdst didn't know what the hell he was talking about?
What do you think it is? Is it prejudice and a lack of professionalism?
If so, what do you propose we do to change that?
The prejudice against gays goes throughout the ranks. It's a prejudice that society has legitimized for a very long time and is enforced through a long standing policy. To suggest that gays are getting their feelings hurt because of senrio non-commissioned officers is not only dishonest, but stupid.
I don't see it, especially not after the first few months. Even 20 years ago, maybe, but the younger generation(ie not us) are much more accepting of gays than your or my generation(assuming they are not the same generation, no idea how old you are, though our service did overlap).
Let me summarize: you misinterpreted my comments.
Perhaps. They were very enthusiastic with non-judicial, non-Article 15, off-the-books motivational in-house punishment. The big ****ing E-5 Samoan was a big problem. He used to jump us and put us in sleeper holds on the line. They gang-raped a squad mate with a broom.
Just think of it as an indication your comments are tops!
You served in the IDF, no? Was it after gays where allowed to serve?
Females have been in the ranks for over 20 years and NCO's in co-ed units are still dealing with sexual harassment, rapes and other improper conduct, rather than training their troops and getting the job done.
Punishment of gays?
I'm asking Apoc for his interpretation of your comments.
He can read, and my hand isn't up his butt.
Of course, I'm in my 20's.
To an extent yes, but it is not a large problem in the military. Unit cohesion is still strong. We have had blacks serving in mixed units for much longer than that, and yet there are still racial issues at times. It's just not that bad.
There's enough concern over the issue, that it's one of the reasons that females aren't allowed to serve in combat arms units.
Obviously, he misunderstood what I said, too.
Let me say it again, the IDF hasn't been in a pitched battle, since the gay ban was lifted in 1993. Certainly nothing like the '67 war, The Yom Kippur War, or the War in Lebanon during the 80's.