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Afghans protest U.S. church's plans to torch Koran

Catz Part Deux said:
Actually, it has a history that dates back to the whiskey rebellion, and it is more fun up close.
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Sorry, I was thinking of this...

Nazca_Lines.jpg
 
apdst said:
Well, hell, the Germans thought Hitler was justified, too.
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AT THE TIME, and even then, the ones that did know what was going on did not think it was justified, but they lived in a brutal police state that was intollerant of expression.

Also there's a little something called the German Resistance that attempted on many occasions to kill Hitler.

German resistance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

But, we all know they weren't. Don't we?
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Indeed.

But for such a heinous crime, we do often have to look at WHY they happened, so we can stop it from ever happening again.
 
apdst said:
So, let me guess, the Islamofacists are going to start offing, "moderate", Muslims, because some American dickhead burned a Koran in Florida? Nooooow, you're reaching.
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I think you'll find they've been offing more moderate Muslims than westerners for some time now. You don't participate in the demos and riots against the Koran burning, you're going on the list. Yes, they are going to be more of a target than ever.
 
The real question should be... why does this Priest and his backers hate America and want to put American soldiers at even more risk?
 
PeteEU said:
The real question should be... why does this Priest and his backers hate America and want to put American soldiers at even more risk?
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the reality is that muslims hate us because, to them, we are infidels. they will not hate us any more if this guy burns a quran, they will not hate us any less if he does not.

this guy, however misguided he may be, has just as much right to burn a quran as some radical muslim has to burn a bible or the US flag.
 
OscarB63 said:
the reality is that muslims hate us because, to them, we are infidels. they will not hate us any more if this guy burns a quran, they will not hate us any less if he does not.

this guy, however misguided he may be, has just as much right to burn a quran as some radical muslim has to burn a bible or the US flag.
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I see, so you're cool with US flag and bible burning. Noted. I'm not btw.
 
Andalublue said:
I see, so you're cool with US flag and bible burning. Noted. I'm not btw.
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duh, no. you missed the point. just because I agree that someone has the "right" to do something, does not mean that I agree with them doing it.
 
ric27 said:
The difference would be, if a christian committed terrorist actions, other christians would stand up and say that those jackasses were crackpots who did not represent their religion.

They would be condemning the terrorist actions as well as the people who committed them. I don't see a lot of this comming from the worldwide muslim community.
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Your observations are uniformly biased and wrong, so I'm not surprised.
 
apdst said:
But, but, what about all those moderate Muslims?
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You mean these guys?

r2245201225.jpg


or these?




Or these?



or these guys?



Or these moderate guys?



Im SURE the 'Moderate' Muslims will calm down all the radical extremists and stand in opposition to this kind of ridiculous response to cartoons or book burnings...

good thing there is 'just a few' of those extremists. Man...Id hate to start posting some of the BAD videos...
 
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theangryamerican said:
Granted, I only read the first nine pages, but I'm surprised no one mentioned this sooner...

Dove World Outreach Centre + Burning Korans = Irony?

What kind of outreach is this exactly?
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Doves can be pretty badass sometimes.
 
OscarB63 said:
so I guess since I haven't heard you complain about it, then you too must support child molestation.
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You were the one that said silence implies consent, not me. Remember?
 
OscarB63 said:
so I guess since I haven't heard you complain about it, then you too must support child molestation.
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Ouch! Touche!!! Or animal buggery for that matter.

Maybe if there was an actual problema nd thread to address those topics, the complaint might even be thread appropriate and not just some red herring dodge...

Unless they really LIKE that stuff! :shock:
 
Coronado said:
You were the one that said silence implies consent, not me. Remember?
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Come now Coronada...its kind of a reach...dont you think? This thread wasnt ABOUT Child Molestation. hell if he HAD gone off on a rant about Child Molestation some idiot here would have jumped in on how it isnt in line with the thread...
 
OscarB63 said:
duh, no. you missed the point. just because I agree that someone has the "right" to do something, does not mean that I agree with them doing it.
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So, you disagree with the Koran burning, but judge that it's their right to do it, despite the increased risk to US troops, the added bloodshed and the further polarisation of the political/cultural divide. Am I not right in saying that the absolute right to freedom of speech has been limited on numerous occasions in the interests of national security, in time of war etc? Either it is an absolute right or it isn't. If it is, then the occasions when it has been suspended make a mockery of that constitutional right. If it isn't, what makes the right of this particular bunch of fundamentalist nutcases special?
 
Andalublue said:
So, you disagree with the Koran burning, but judge that it's their right to do it, despite the increased risk to US troops, the added bloodshed and the further polarisation of the political/cultural divide. Am I not right in saying that the absolute right to freedom of speech has been limited on numerous occasions in the interests of national security, in time of war etc? Either it is an absolute right or it isn't. If it is, then the occasions when it has been suspended make a mockery of that constitutional right. If it isn't, what makes the right of this particular bunch of fundamentalist nutcases special?
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as I said, muslims hate us for who we are, fundamentally. this action will neither increase nor decrease that hatred. funny that I never see "you people" crying about further polarisation of the political/cultural divide when it is a muslim doing something stupid.

tolerance must be a two way street or it is worthless pandering. free speech has to work both ways or it really isn't free.
 
Andalublue said:
So, you disagree with the Koran burning, but judge that it's their right to do it, despite the increased risk to US troops, the added bloodshed and the further polarisation of the political/cultural divide. Am I not right in saying that the absolute right to freedom of speech has been limited on numerous occasions in the interests of national security, in time of war etc? Either it is an absolute right or it isn't. If it is, then the occasions when it has been suspended make a mockery of that constitutional right. If it isn't, what makes the right of this particular bunch of fundamentalist nutcases special?
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You either have free speech or you don't.

If you are going to allow Muslims to dictate what you can or cannot say then your speech is obviously not free..

Others before us have died for the right for us to speak freely, no matter that we might all disagree, and more might die now.

But that doesn't men we should give it up.

The risk is not against the troops, by the way. History has shown that it will be innocent civilians who will be attacked, not those who are prepared to defend themselves..
 
Jetboogieman said:
Wanna prove that?

All I hear is.

"THEY WON'T CONDEMN IT AT ALL"

*evidence is presented that they have*

"THEY WON'T CONDEMN THE MOTIVATION!!!!"

Are you sure that when they talk about the motivation, they're explaining WHY it happens?
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Ugh oh... back to... it is our fault.
???

All you hear is "they won't condemn"... and it's true... they don't. That is pathetic... and it should be repeated until there is some action by their own... until then... they consent.
They're silent... until cartoons or films are made... then heads fly and people die or are threatened with death.
I guess it's a tolerant religion... until someone burns their book... or draws a cartoon... then they're vocal.

So let's see... we have on guy who has created a "Burn a Koran Day", and the world is outraged... yet... terrorists commit heinous acts in the name of religion... and they are QUIET!!! Strange isn't it. I say it's farking bizarre... and their defenders even more so.
 
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zimmer said:
Ugh oh... back to... it is our fault.
???

All you hear is "they won't condemn"... and it's true... they don't. That is pathetic... and it should be repeated until there is some action by their own... until then... they consent.
They're silent... until cartoons or films are made... then heads fly and people die or are threatened with death.
I guess it's a tolerant religion... until someone burns their book... or draws a cartoon... then they're vocal.

So let's see... we have on guy who has created a "Burn a Koran Day", and the world is outraged... yet... terrorists commit heinous acts in the name of religion... and they are QUIET!!! Strange isn't it. I say it's farking bizarre... and their defenders even more so.
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The amount of times me and others have posted Muslims condemnation of Islamic terror, and it's ignored...

There's a word for what you do here Zimmer. It's called

"Willful Ignorance"


And what's up with the "It's our fault" ****? Did I say that?
 
Would these guys be considered 'moderate' Muslims?



I mean...this is day to day life for several MILLION Wahhabi Muslims...and they cant be all bad if they are being defended by the likes of Noam Chomsky...right?

Maybe it is the subject for another thread...but just do people mean when they say 'Moderate' Muslims? I would bet the protestors that were rioting in Denmark and throughout Europe following cartoongate would probably be described as 'moderate'...right?
 
Andalublue said:
So, you disagree with the Koran burning, but judge that it's their right to do it, despite the increased risk to US troops, the added bloodshed and the further polarisation of the political/cultural divide.
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Yes. The alternative is for elected or appointed officials to decide when it's "safe" for us to have free speech, and I'm not in favor of putting that power into their hands unless the circumstances are so dire as to be unimaginable. It would undermine our constitution and bill of rights, and that's not something I'm willing to do.

Hey, being an American is challenging sometimes. :shrug:

I think this is a great video clip to explain how Americans think about this stuff to non-Americans.



And yes, I support the right of someone to protest outside a funeral, even though I find it abhorrent, and for a mosque to be built near a tragedy caused by extremist muslims, and I support the right of someone to burn an American flag or a Bible or call someone a racial or gender slur, even though I think racists are the most despicable creatures on the planet.

I might find their actions stupid, or even vile, but I will still defend their RIGHT to engage in that act of free speech.
 
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VanceMack said:
Would these guys be considered 'moderate' Muslims?



I mean...this is day to day life for several MILLION Wahhabi Muslims...and they cant be all bad if they are being defended by the likes of Noam Chomsky...right?

Maybe it is the subject for another thread...but just do people mean when they say 'Moderate' Muslims? I would bet the protestors that were rioting in Denmark and throughout Europe following cartoongate would probably be described as 'moderate'...right?
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How long will it take before someone points out that this barbarity isn't a reflection on ALL Muslims?
 
Grant said:
How long will it take before someone points out that this barbarity isn't a reflection on ALL Muslims?
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And surely they would be right...but there is a LOT of them that DO follow this...that advocate the beating of wives (as long as you dont...you know...knock out teeth or leave bruises that show outside of the Burka...etc...).

I think it is a legit question ...what is a 'moderate' Muslim? how many of those 1.5 billion (wives kids, male followers) enjoy the relative safety that say...the US laws and constitutions provide and how many live under the "there is no authority but islam and there is no law but Sharia" mentality.

I watch the news reports and stories out now and see an awful lot of 'moderates' in pregame mode waiting for the video of that assclown in Florida to burn a mosque and ready to chant death to America over the actions of one lone whackjob...so...really...how many 'moderate' Muslims are out there?
 
VanceMack said:
And surely they would be right...but there is a LOT of them that DO follow this...that advocate the beating of wives (as long as you dont...you know...knock out teeth or leave bruises that show outside of the Burka...etc...).

I think it is a legit question ...what is a 'moderate' Muslim? how many of those 1.5 billion (wives kids, male followers) enjoy the relative safety that say...the US laws and constitutions provide and how many live under the "there is no authority but islam and there is no law but Sharia" mentality.

I watch the news reports and stories out now and see an awful lot of 'moderates' in pregame mode waiting for the video of that assclown in Florida to burn a mosque and ready to chant death to America over the actions of one lone whackjob...so...really...how many 'moderate' Muslims are out there?
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There are probably millions of "moderate" Muslims, i.e. those who don't participate in honor killings, the stoning of women, the hanging of homosexuals, the murder of innocents, etc. but they are irrelevant. These 'moderates" have had plenty of time to speak out but few have. And many of those who have survived are now living under 24 hour security.

Because Islam is a belief system those who believe in this system can thus be condemned for their silence, just as much as those who are actually carrying out their crimes against humanity..
 
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