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Thread: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

  1. #101
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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Oooook. I don't think you really understand how our Constitutional Republic works. In our system, the courts interpret the Constitution to determine what does and does not constitute a right that is protected by that Constitution. In the case of marriage, the Supreme Court determined it was a right because of the Due Process clause of the Constitution. In other words, the Supreme Court, as part of the state, recognized that marriage is a right protected by the Constitution.
    I'm sorry that you do not understand the fundamental difference between a right and a privilege granted by the state - but your lack of critical thought is on you, not me, and your appeal to authority does nothing to reduce my position.

    The state can eliminate marriage as a legal institution simply my repealing the laws that created it. That, alone, proves that marriage is a privilege, not a right.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 09-07-10 at 01:15 PM.

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    While many Constitutions are volumes in length, the US Constitution is short, and concise. This is because it takes a reverse approach to law, specifying what government is NOT allowed to do, instead of what it can do.
    Have you read Articles I-V, as well as Amendments 13-16, 18-19, 21, 23-24, and 26?
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    I'm sorry that you do not understand the fundamental difference between a right and a privilege granted by the state - but your lack of critical thought is on you, not me, and your appeal to authority does nothing to reduce my position.

    The state can eliminate marriage as a legal institution simply my repealing the laws that created it. That, alone, proves that marriage is a privilege, not a right.
    Its irrelevant whether it is a "PRIVILEGE" or a "RIGHT". Equal Protection applies to both.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Its irrelevant whether it is a "PRIVILEGE" or a "RIGHT". Equal Protection applies to both.
    It -is- relevant when someone asks you the question as to if it is a privilege or a right.

    And, as we all know, not every person is entitlted to every privilege offered by a state.

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Aside from the fact that no one's ever successfully articulated the specific thing that's being "unequally protected" about all this.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  6. #106
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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    If I were against gay marriage, I would do everything in my power to keep this from going to the Supreme Court, because it's pretty much a guarantee that Prop 8 would be struck down given the nature of this case. Literally, the 14th Amendment states:

    "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws".

    There is no way to twist the meaning of that section. No state can enforce any law which abridges the privileges of U.S citizens, and since most gay marriage opponents believe marriage to be a privilege and not a right, then there you have it.

    Seems pretty open and shut to me.

    There is more gray area in the equal protection clause and 14th Amendment than you think. If you would listen to opponents of Prop 8 you would think that all they have to do is want something and equal protection means they get it. One important issue is equivalency. Is being gay equivalent to being black? Do two women who want to get married have to prove they are actually gay? What is the test that proves it? Sexuality is a much more fluent trait than race. It is not equivalent to being male or female. Somebody has to rule on that point.

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws".

    There is no way to twist the meaning of that section. No state can enforce any law which abridges the privileges of U.S citizens...
    If this prohibition is absolute, as you suggest, explain why 15-yr olds cannot drive.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 09-07-10 at 02:15 PM.

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    [QUOTE=Goobieman;1058968836]
    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws".

    There is no way to twist the meaning of that section. No state can enforce any law which abridges the privileges of U.S citizens...
    [/quotw]
    If this prohibition is absolute, as you suggest, explain why 15-yr olds cannot drive.
    Because they are under 18 and can not vote.

    26th Amendment.

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Because they are under 18 and can not vote.
    26th Amendment.
    You clearly are not paying attention - never mind the fact that the 26th doesnt mean that 15 yr-olds cannot vote, nor explain why not letting them vote doesnt violate the 14th.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 09-07-10 at 02:28 PM.

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    Re: Court won't force state to defend Prop. 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    You clearly are not paying attention.
    To the Constitution? Yeah I am.

    BTW 15 year olds can drive, I did.

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