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Thread: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

  1. #171
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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    The Fed is not the Treasury.

    So are you now saying that it wouldn't cause inflation because it's the FED?


    j-mac
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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So are you now saying that it wouldn't cause inflation because it's the FED?


    j-mac
    Yes. The Fed (not congress or the president) controls the money supply.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Goldenboy219;1059000642]Your point?
    Pretty easy, there would be enough money from excise taxes to build bridges, roads, and other infrastructure projects had the Congress not put that money on budget and spent it. Just another example of waste, fraud, and abuse by the Federal govt. that you seem to ignore. We don't need more taxes to fund the ineffecient govt. so allow the people to keep it and they then need less of that so called govt. help.


    How so? I was simply quoting nobel prize winning economist Milton Friedman.
    Too many economists keep their noses buried in books versus getting out into the real world to see how it works. Amazing to me how those nobel prize economists seem to ignore non partisan sites that offer actual results. I wouldn't put much faith in the Nobel Prize any more since Obama won the prize simply with his rhetoric. Looks to me like you need to spend more time in the real world as well.

    All you have stated was sheer drivel.

    You haven't proven to have any credibility on judging someone else's posts.


    Do you have a source to back such a ridiculus claim?
    Prove that the govt. doesn't print money? That the govt. competing against private sector for capital doesn't get the capital? You are kidding?



    Wow, i actually feel like i lost intelligence from reading this post. I mean.... wow.
    Cannot lose what you do not have.


    I use theory to analyze reality where as you simply make things up to suit your ideology.

    It's sad really.
    You are right, bea.gov, bls.gov, and the U.S. Treasury sites all offer theory, LOL. Like a typical liberal, your arrogance is showing as is your lack of logic, common sense, and facts.

  4. #174
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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    But the analysis lacks any explanation of capital markets and how inflation affects them.
    That is because there is no need to explain the effects of inflation within credit markets.

    If people believe that they have more purchasing power than they actually have, won't it cause more speculation than they otherwise would have done? Isn't that a great example then over over-speculation?
    No. While one can speculate about relative purchasing power (as you often do), changes in purchasing power do not cause speculation. Irrational profit expectations fuel speculation.

    It doesn't change if a large proportion of money is saved (we can't go to the extreme example of everything being saved because it's not realistic). There are two possible scenarios: that money sits stagnant in a bank or it is lent.
    Of course it does. Less money being spent (or a greater demand for money) naturally means less of a demand of goods (fixed supply or not).

    If it sits stagnant in a bank, then the money is pretty much dead. Businesses operate under the conditions that they perceive and what they perceive is money in circulation. So if money is in the bank, then it is, for price levels, deflationary. This is the money under the mattress scenario. Prices will generally fall, but people will keep producing because they are confident in the value of all of the money that they have. The only problem that would arise is if people took all of their money out of savings and spent it all immediately, but I don't see that happening.
    This is false. People produce because they believe they will be able to sell their goods at a price that is greater than their cost. In fact, people will hold onto their dollars if they believe the value of them will continue to increase relative to what is being produced.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Yes. The Fed (not congress or the president) controls the money supply.
    Ok, but who appoints the Fed chairman? Isn't that the President, and Congress approves them?

    And regardless of which entity is buying our own debt doesn't the threat of hyper inflation exist with the Fed buying our own debt?

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You are right, bea.gov, bls.gov, and the U.S. Treasury sites all offer theory, LOL.
    Care to show where i said the raw data sites offer theory? Another case of conservative making things up.

    Like a typical liberal, your arrogance is showing as is your lack of logic, common sense, and facts.
    You have been demolished in every one of my responses. It's getting boring squashing the intellectually ill-equipped.

    You may get the last word (because that is all that you have left).
    Last edited by Kushinator; 09-22-10 at 05:45 PM.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Ok, but who appoints the Fed chairman? Isn't that the President, and Congress approves them?

    And regardless of which entity is buying our own debt doesn't the threat of hyper inflation exist with the Fed buying our own debt?

    j-mac
    No.

    The Fed purchases government debt from private entities via open market operations. It does not purchase it directly from the treasury.

    The board of governers are appointed for 14 year terms, thereby eliminating political motive (the reason the Fed was created).
    Last edited by Kushinator; 09-22-10 at 05:47 PM.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Nope! If a particular credit market is running short on liquidity, it will require greater rates of interest to induce investors.
    And pumping liquidity into their won't lower those interest rates?

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Care to show where i said the raw data sites offer theory? Another case of conservative making things up.



    You have been demolished in every one of my responses. It's getting boring squashing the intellectually ill-equipped.

    You may get the last word (because that is all that you have left).
    What really is quite telling is that you are the only one claiming intellectual superiority whereas I call that individual insecurity. Normally insecure individuals always tell others how great they are. You seem to get tired of anyone that refutes your rhetoric with actual facts, logic, and common sense. Giving me the comments of a Nobel Prize winning economists doesn't make you look smarter but it does making you look very gullible.

    Those so called intellectual economists seem to ignore actual results and that was the point. Their theory seems to trump reality in your world and theirs.
    Last edited by Conservative; 09-22-10 at 05:57 PM.

  10. #180
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    Re: Stimulus Boosted Jobs in 2nd Quarter, CBO Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    That is because there is no need to explain the effects of inflation within credit markets.
    How can you claim such a bold assertion? Why would there be no need to explain that?

    No. While one can speculate about relative purchasing power (as you often do), changes in purchasing power do not cause speculation. Irrational profit expectations fuel speculation.
    So if I have $10 saved in the bank, and the bank lends out $7 against that, there are multiple claims to the same $7. The $10 that person 1 has and the $7 that person 2 has cannot both be true with the dollar at its current level. So won't both believe that they have more purchasing power than they actually believe (at least one has to have less that he expects), and won't both act in accordance with that? And so once people realize that they have less than they expected, won't that cause problems? Expecially for person 1 who must now save because he has less purchasing power saved than he thought before. Won't that cause over-speculation because demand will necessarily contract while people get the security back that they once thought they had?

    Of course it does. Less money being spent (or a greater demand for money) naturally means less of a demand of goods (fixed supply or not).
    Until prices adjust to the level where people have the savings/security that they want. Once the prices adjust (because that money is basically out of circulation), you don't have a problem.

    This is false. People produce because they believe they will be able to sell their goods at a price that is greater than their cost. In fact, people will hold onto their dollars if they believe the value of them will continue to increase relative to what is being produced.
    That's not true at all. Why do people then buy computers knowing that they will become better and the price stay relatively stable in a very short span of time? They don't hold onto their money waiting for the technology to improve, they buy now knowing that their technology will be obsolete in just a few years.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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