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Thread: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbbtx View Post
    This only stops federal funding of embryonic research. Besides more strides have been made with adult stem cells than embryonic ones. Less chance of rejection etc.
    Actually this is not entirely true. There is no evidence that adult stem cells are any more likely to be rejected by the host body than their embryonic counterparts. More strides have been made with adult stem cells simply because they've been funded longer, but the potential for embryonic stem cells is very exciting. Adult stem cells are also a pretty big pain to keep around from what I understand (I never personally worked with the adult model, so you'd have to ask someone more familiar with them than myself). Embryonic stem cells are pretty simple to keep up in my experience.
    Last edited by Singularity; 08-23-10 at 10:01 PM.

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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    I've always been curious about these types of responses. Do you feel this way because you think the embryos are forcibly removed from a woman for research purposes, or do you realize that the embryos destroyed were headed into the dumpster anyway? If you realize that the latter is the truth, are you equally opposed to fertilization procedures that millions of Americans will attempt in order to make a baby this year alone?

    It seems that the only way one can be opposed to embryonic stem cell research is to simultaneously oppose IVF, which pretty much kills the "I have more regard for human life than you do argument". I'm not making fun of your argument by any means, but I am understandably curious.
    As you appear to be one who has some knowledge of this type of science, I have a question for you.

    Is there a difference between adult and embryonic stem cell research? As in, is there a noticeable difference between the stem cells from different sources, potentially offering different results/rewards?

    Personally, I think the main disagreement most people have with embryonic stem cell research is that those embryonic stem cells have/had? the potential to become a human (through the correct process, obviously).

    Most of them probably object to the majority of abortions for similar reasons, and the issues are tied together (for them, at least).

    I can see that, if you believe embryo = human (or the potential to be human?), or something similar/related, how you might have an issue.
    Last edited by The Mark; 08-23-10 at 10:07 PM.
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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Is there a difference between adult and embryonic stem cell research? As in, is there a noticeable difference between the stem cells from different sources, potentially offering different results/rewards?
    To be honest, I have never worked with somatic stem cells (or "adult" stem cells as they are called in the news), so my knowledge of that type of research is very limited. I can tell you a little about them, but nothing more than what you already know. On and off for the last thirteen years, i've worked with universities performing embryonic research, although the lack of funding was a huge problem for many labs, so more projects remained "on the drawing table" than those that actually got off.

    Speaking from a lab perspective, I can tell you my experiences with embryonic stem cells. First off, they are incredibly easy to isolate. You get an embryo, you extract the stem cells. Put them in culture and incubate them, and they grow like wildfire. Once they are confluent, we'll do our studies and then ship them back to the university along with our data, where I imagine they'll do their own projects.

    From a research perspective, folks like embryonic stem cells for their - $10 word incoming - pluripotency, which is just a fancy-shmancy way of saying these cells will develop into whatever you want them to develop into given the right stimulation. This makes research pretty easy, and you don't have to put up with a lot of extra equipment and drawn-out processes to work with them. From what I understand, somatic stem cells are a pain that way, in addition to them suddenly springing up tumor-lines out of the blue and being prone to contamination. However, I have no firsthand knowledge of this, as I never worked with them. A geneticist who has worked with both would be much more knowledgable than myself on the matter.


    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Personally, I think the main disagreement most people have with embryonic stem cell research is that those embryonic stem cells have/had? the potential to become a human (through the correct process, obviously).

    Most of them probably object to the majority of abortions for similar reasons, and the issues are tied together (for them, at least).

    I can see that, if you believe embryo = human (or the potential to be human?), or something similar/related, how you might have an issue.
    Ahhh. Well, the way I look at it is that most of those embryos were on the way into the biohazard flames as they were approaching unviability. I think there is a tendency to lump an embryo in with a baby among a lot of folks, and probably assume that these embryos were on their way to becoming an actually baby before the process of stem cell research interrupted all that. To be honest, I just do the research, and I don't dwell on the potentiality of it all. I know it's a big deal among many folks, but i'd be curious to see if that would change if many folks realize that it's no different than IV fertilization, when it comes right down to it.

    Good points, brutha.

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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    I've always been curious about these types of responses. Do you feel this way because you think the embryos are forcibly removed from a woman for research purposes, or do you realize that the embryos destroyed were headed into the dumpster anyway? If you realize that the latter is the truth, are you equally opposed to fertilization procedures that millions of Americans will attempt in order to make a baby this year alone?

    It seems that the only way one can be opposed to embryonic stem cell research is to simultaneously oppose IVF, which pretty much kills the "I have more regard for human life than you do" argument. I'm not making fun of your argument by any means, but I am understandably curious.
    It seems that you create logic boxes that demand I accept your pre-conceived conclusion or admit I'm an uneducated hypocritical dolt.

    I realize the source of the eggs, the source of the cells. The issue isn't the source, but the moral and ethical grounding for taking what would be an otherwise viable human and using it for research.

    If the Embryonic Stem Cell research is as potentially productive as the claims would have it, then private funding can have it. Federal Funds should not have anything to do with it.
    Last edited by Renae; 08-23-10 at 11:49 PM.
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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Maybe there is still one drop of sanity and law within the courts. The government should fund research that requires the purposeful death of a human life.
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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I realize the source of the eggs, the source of the cells. The issue isn't the source, but the moral and ethical grounding for taking what would be an otherwise viable human and using it for research.

    If the Embryonic Stem Cell research is as potentially productive as the claims would have it, then private funding can have it. Federal Funds should not have anything to do with it.
    There is your hypocrisy right there. If it is so immoral to perform research on this particular type of cell, then why are you ok with private funding for it? Or am I just putting you in another pesky "logic box?" That whole "logic" thing can be pretty annoying, huh?

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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    The lawsuit is not about human life it is a battle over money:
    Tax payer money. Lots of pro-lifers don't want to see life created just to be destroyed. Adult stem cells are much more promising. Lets not take from that research to fund something that is less promising and so many are against.

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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    It's not illegal nor is it banned for private companies to invest in embryonic stem cell research. They just divert their funding to other areas because it is more promising. My grandfather survived cancer due to new stem cell therapies, and those therapies included his stem cells. Plus, we are making more gains in de-differentiating living human tissue into forms of stem cells. We can already turn skin into a more advanced form of partially differentiated stem cell.
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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    We absolutely need to fund stem cell research some more, this stuff is fascinating and could really pave the way for future health care.
    I use a lot of satire and sarcasm so keep that in mind when reading my posts.

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    Re: U.S. court rules against Obama's stem cell policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbbtx View Post
    Tax payer money. Lots of pro-lifers don't want to see life created just to be destroyed. Adult stem cells are much more promising. Lets not take from that research to fund something that is less promising and so many are against.
    Actually, adult stem cells are not any more promising than embryonic research. While I have not worked with somatic lines, I can tell you from firsthand experience that embryonic research is very exciting stuff.

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