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What are you talking about?
What are the people on the left supposed to admit to?
What are you talking about?
Why is it you conservatives can manage to make a 40 page thread about if Obama is really Christian or not (not to mention probably another 5 threads like this one) but not one damn thread about the economy?
Yep...Governor Patterson waded in to resolve this a week ago. Better land...better deal (from what i understand).
It really is insufferable, I was forced to listen to men of his ilk when I was small.I don't understand how anybody actually listens to people like him.
He has all the symptoms of someone who doesn't believe and hasn't for a long time, if ever.
It really is insufferable, I was forced to listen to men of his ilk when I was small.
I agree with the wingnut types that Obama isn't a Christian, however, I think his lack of belief is rather clear. I'm of the firm opinion we've elected an atheist president. He has all the symptoms of someone who doesn't believe and hasn't for a long time, if ever.
In a sense, when conservatives ramble about people trying to covertly destroy traditional America, I agree with them. You couldn't be a liberal in power here unless you're a wolf in sheep's clothing.
It might just be the read I get off of him, but whenever he talks about faith, it always has that slightly hollow, insipid tone to it. It's so preprogrammed, so rehearsed, and so trite that I can just tell he has no idea what it means to speak about faith from the heart.Such as, pray tell?
Personally, I think it's very much to do with religion. Your New York and Berkeley types may not care, but I think the large majority of people in, to pick a state at random, Alabama are seriously concerned about whether or not the President genuflects or bows towards Mecca.I hardly see his lack of belief as a problem, though. I was under the impression that even Americans were astute enough to realise that religion has no place in politics -- Americans don't really care that he is pious, as long as he calls himself a Christian, right? I mean, the whole Christian/Muslim debate is POLITICAL posturing, it has nothing to do with actual religion!
Athiest is what Ann coulter thinks too. I think it's worth a thought.
Simply put: I can't find a Christian thing about the man, and just as well.
Dumbledore is definitely more powerful than Gandalf.
are you kidding, Dumbledore is a mere mortal, Gandalf is a Maia, and was under the tutelage of Manwë before he went to Middle Earth, as well as wielding Narya, the Ring of Fire, Gandalf could kick Dumbledores arse with one toe.
And what did he do with that amazng power? He cast a stupid light spell at the dragons in return of the king. Like...wow.
The underlying truth in all of this - 42 pages into this thread - is that people simply do not trust Obama at this point, and they have no idea who he even is.
Notice how we are seeing less and less of him as time passes.
He doesn't even seem that interested in being President anymore.
The underlying truth in all of this - 42 pages into this thread - is that people simply do not trust Obama at this point, and they have no idea who he even is.
Notice how we are seeing less and less of him as time passes.
He doesn't even seem that interested in being President anymore.
why would someone pass up a better deal?
Athiest is what Ann coulter thinks too. I think it's worth a thought.
I apologize if this has already been stated.
Since religion is based on faith and submission to a higher power how can someone that doesn't know about or practice the religion (like a newborn) be follower of the religion?
Read the OP quote and you will see your position agrees with reverand Graham.
I think the president's problem is that he was born a Muslim, his father was a Muslim. The seed of Islam is passed through the father like the seed of Judaism is passed through the mother. He was born a Muslim, his father gave him an Islamic name," Graham told CNN's John King in a televised interview that aired Thursday night.
"Now it's obvious that the president has renounced the prophet Mohammed, and he has renounced Islam, and he has accepted Jesus Christ. That's what he says he has done. I cannot say that he hasn't. So I just have to believe that the president is what he has said," Graham continued, adding that "the Islamic world sees the president as one of theirs."
Graham appears to be saying the exact opposite of what I just said. Graham stated that Obama was born Muslim and later renounced the religion and then doubtfully suggests Obama is a Christian.
I am saying specifically that no one can be born religious. Religion is a learned ideal, not an instinct.
Graham was stating what some people...muslims and non muslims alike...perceive as a fact. Whether it is or isnt to you or me is immaterial. Some people believe that an infant doused during a catholic baptism is then catholic. Are they?
Holy crap...
Obama was never a Muslim to begin with to denounce his "Muslim faith". He never had the faith to begin with, I don't recall him ever mentioning he prayed or fasted or gave zakhat!
If tomorrow I left Islam and converted to Christianity then yes I denounced my "Muslim faith" because prior to that, I followed the pillars of Islam
He just converted to Christianity.
So NO Muslims believe you are born into your fathers faith?
I think it has been pretty well established...not ALL muslim sects, like not all Christian sects...view things the same way. Because you or I personally disagree with it doesnt make it real to others. Nor does it necessarily make it real to Obama...lets accept that as well. I dont think thats what Graham was saying.
I think the president's problem is that he was born a Muslim, his father was a Muslim. The seed of Islam is passed through the father like the seed of Judaism is passed through the mother. He was born a Muslim, his father gave him an Islamic name."
"the Islamic world sees the president as one of theirs..."
"Now it's obvious that the president has renounced the prophet Mohammed, and he has renounced Islam, and he has accepted Jesus Christ....
That's what he says he has done. I cannot say that he hasn't. So I just have to believe that the president is what he has said..."
President Obama is a Christian in the holy eyes of God and our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ...
I think the president's problem is that he was born a Muslim. Under the tennants of Islam, his father was a Muslim, the seed of Islam is passed through the father like the seed of Judaism is passed through the mother. As such under Islam, the President was born a Muslim [and,] his father gave him an Islamic name," Graham told CNN's John King in a televised interview that aired Thursday night.
"Now it's obvious that the president has renounced the prophet Mohammed, and he has renounced Islam, and he has accepted Jesus Christ. Therefore, the President is a Christian in the holy eyes of God through the saving grace of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior," Graham continued, adding that "although the Islamic world sees the president as one of theirs because of the traditions of Islam, he is a Christain."
Towit:
I've pulled these posts together in the hopes of ending this entire debate.
I understand what Rev. F. Graham was saying, essentially, that according to the Muslim faith, Pres. Obama inherited his father's Muslim religious heritage because according to the Islam, (male) children born to Muslim fathers are Muslims. I think the problem with what he said is the way he said it.
Rev. Graham leads his commentary giving the impression that the President's religious birth-right heritage is set in stone, and he cements that with his closing statement.
Read in this manner, Rev. Graham plants the seed in many people's minds, "born a Muslim, always a Muslim," and that there's no getting away from it......edit....
Had he said words to that affect as editted above, this entire issue would have been put to rest that night (...except for conspiracy theorist, birthers, truthers...you know...the people you just can't convince one way or the other no matter what is said to the contrary or what proof you place before their eyes).
Again, it's not that what Rev. Graham said was inaccurate; it's just that he left the seed of doubt lingering there.
We don't like liars. He says he is christian.I hardly see his lack of belief as a problem, though. I was under the impression that even Americans were astute enough to realise that religion has no place in politics -- Americans don't really care that he is pious, as long as he calls himself a Christian, right? I mean, the whole Christian/Muslim debate is POLITICAL posturing, it has nothing to do with actual religion!