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Thread: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    Uh Bubba, I've already said Obama is a Christian now. Thanks for once again not reading the thread before making a statement.
    Okay...so I ask you again...

    What's the point of continuing this debate? What point are you trying to prove by upholding Rev. F. Grahams position, "born a Muslim, always a Muslim"? If you're admitting that the President is a Christian, then that would mean you disagree with the Rev's point of view. As such, you agree that the Presidnet has renounced Islam. So, what's the point of continuing this debate? It's foolish!!! By your own admission, you contridict yourself.

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    I've actually been to Dubai...very sandy. There's sand everywhere!! But it's also very modern (as if you couldn't figure that out from all the images of construction taking place there .) Still, the landscape is very appealing; very pretty countryside. I think most Americans would be surprised to learn just how westernized Dubai really is. There are several American-style fast-food restaurants there, luxury hotels, and you should see some of the cars many of the rich young Arab kids drive!! What some rich kid here in the U.S. drives would be put to shame!! U.S. = Lexis, Navigator, Escalaid; Dubai = Mercadies, BMW, Porche!!!

    I think I would have enjoyed my visit there more if I could have gone to other places off the main drag. But Ramadan was around the corner and us Westerners were discouraged from treading off the beaten path for concern we'd interver in local religious customs. (Admittedly, I didn't quite understand it back then, but with age comes maturity and wisdom.)
    The only thing inconvenient about Ramadan for us was finding someplace to eat! Most of the businesses still ran as usual (because capitalism really is the name of the game). I also really enjoyed Dubai far more than Abu Dhabi. Some GREAT cigar shops there...

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    It is not those in opposition that are fomenting this chasm. These are claims of the supporters that no matter how many times, and by how many in opposition say that they are not against all Muslims, or opposed to their rights, it is ignored, and this narrative is attached. Talk about misrepresentation.


    j-mac
    Who's misrepresenting? All you have to do is watch the news or go online and see the "protesters" holding signs with hateful words on them about Muslims. There's a difference between a sign that read, "Insensativity to 9/11 Victims - No Mosque!" and one that reads, "Muslims = Jihad = Terrorist - No Mosque!". I've seen both; the latter is very disturbing.

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    It's not misrepresentation when people are now talking about their objections to implementation of Shariah Law or asking where the money is coming from or speaking out against the Imam and his wife's basic beliefs. The issue started out being about sensativity toward 9/11 victims and their survivors. I can even extend that concern to thos first-responders and volunteers who risked their lives and sacraficed their time and energy during the rescue, recovery and cleanup efforts. I am not so heartless that I don't feel their pain and sorrow in all this. But when you've gone beyond being sympathetic or empathetic for them, when you've gone beyond respecting their basic legal and human rights and you've stepped into their religious freedom and you espouse hate and inject fear into the debate based on this notion that ALL Muslims are evil and are coming here only to subvert our laws and replace them with their own, when you lump ALL Muslims under the same umbrella, when you use snippets of their Holy Book to champion your hate, THAT IS WRONG!!! And as an American AND as an African-American who has experienced racial bias, who recalls events from the Civil Rights era, who can see where treading on the rights of peaceful Muslims here can only have a davastating backlash for our troops and Ambassadors abroad in Middle-Eastern Muslim countries, YES! I stand against the oppressors!!!
    This is my country, too. And I will not sit quietly by on the sidelines and let our President nor American-Muslims be railroaded by people who are clearly blinded by hate and fear. Open your eyes and try to see what I see...
    It's okay to be concerned about what you think may happen, but leave room for honest dialog. Otherwise, your hate will do nothing but lead this country once again down a very dark path.
    In your very 'righteous' indignation you MIGHT want to consider that there are MUSLIMS who have spoken out against the location of THIS mosque. There ARE actually intelligent, free thinking people that can DISAGREE with you and not because they are evil hate mongers. Just...you know...food for thought.

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Vance,

    I understand that, too. I see both sides of this issue and I know there have been some Muslims who either don't like Imam Rauf personally and think that his intensions for building this mosque aren't genuine, or they truly are sensative to the feelings and concerns of the 9/11 victims. I've heard both sides on the matter. But my concern here in and of itself is neither solely for the feelings of the 9/11 victims nor the persecution of innocent Muslims. My overall concern is for this country and abidding by our laws and customs. I just don't think this nation can stomach the hipocrasy that would come from denying this mosque to be built. Therefore, if I could speak to Imam Raul, my suggest would be to allow the worship hall to be non-denominational OR build two separate worshop halls in the Community Center - one strictly Islamic, the other non-demoninational. This way he doesn't lose face on the grounds of being a community/religious uniter while also providing a separate place of worship for Muslims. Our military does this all the time. Even the Pentagon has one place of worship that is "shared" by members of all religious faiths. I think this would solve the problem.

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Vance,

    I understand that, too. I see both sides of this issue and I know there have been some Muslims who either don't like Imam Rauf personally and think that his intensions for building this mosque aren't genuine, or they truly are sensative to the feelings and concerns of the 9/11 victims. I've heard both sides on the matter. But my concern here in and of itself is neither solely for the feelings of the 9/11 victims nor the persecution of innocent Muslims. My overall concern is for this country and abidding by our laws and customs. I just don't think this nation can stomach the hipocrasy that would come from denying this mosque to be built. Therefore, if I could speak to Imam Raul, my suggest would be to allow the worship hall to be non-denominational OR build two separate worshop halls in the Community Center - one strictly Islamic, the other non-demoninational. This way he doesn't lose face on the grounds of being a community/religious uniter while also providing a separate place of worship for Muslims.
    I think that would be totally reasonable. I think Governor Patterson offered a totally reasonable alternative. I think if Imam Rauf is sincere about his intent he could build the center in Kansas and it would have the same intent. I dont know the man so I cant speak to his motives. Personally...I think sometimes there are things that are just wrong and its OK to take a stand, voice an opinion, and then move forward. If approval is finally given and they can come up with the funds, then I imagine the thing will be built.

    I read an article the other day on a mosque that is already there and has been downtown for decades with no problems. I dont think MOST PEOPLE are objecting to Muslims or the Mosque because it is a Muslim house of worship.

    At the end of the day we ARE a nation built on the rule of law. If the approval is given and if they can find workers and suppliers (and financial backing) the mosque will be built.

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Vance,

    Agreed. I just think this entire issue has been clouded in blind hate. I see this nation going backwards as far as social/racial/religious tolerences are concerned and that worries me more than the petty political slants that has been thrown at this issue. We're in a war in an equally divided Muslim held country, barely out of another one and may have to face-down yet another Muslim held country (Iran). I just don't think it's wise to "go there" right now (see my rant about 2 posts above for clarification ) . The stakes are much too high.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 08-24-10 at 12:26 PM.

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    I vote we close this subject for good on the boards. How many more ways can we argue this point?

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    Quote Originally Posted by jambalaya View Post
    I vote we close this subject for good on the boards. How many more ways can we argue this point?
    six...definitely six...

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    Re: The Rev. Franklin Graham Says President Obama was 'Born a Muslim'

    So does the OP have a point other than people need a "sperm-donor" to be born? No? Ok well then thread done.
    "We’re going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that allow some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. In theory, some of those loopholes were understandable, but in practice they sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying ten percent of his salary, and that’s crazy." -Reagan

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