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Thread: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    It's not us trying to paint all Musliims as terrorists it's your side trying to paint all Muslims as peace loving and tolerant when that is clearly not the case with this specific Imam.
    Wrong. In my first post on this thread, I clearly said....
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    .....As Americans, we need to set our hate and fear aside, and make the distinction between the terrorist organization, Al Qaeda who attacked us on 9/11 and a religion that 1.5 billion peaceful Muslims believe in. Otherwise, the 6,537 of our men and women who fought and died along side thousands of Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan for their freedom, and the freedoms our constitution protects for all of us here at home, will be in vain and our prejudice and ignorance over this mosque will just be another victory for the terrorists....."
    See, I'm intelligent enough to make the distinction, just like I make the distinction between a hate organization and the Christian religion. Albeit it is difficult sometimes what with all the pedophila and homophobia, BUT I do nevertheless because I KNOW that not ALL Christians are pedophiles and homophobic. So tell me, do you also paint Christianty with a broad brush, or the Jews, or the Hindus, or the Buddists, or the Mormons? If not, then why just Islam?

    If he wanted to build bridges he would not be building the Mosque.
    Then what should he build that would please you? A YMCA? A Jesus theme park? A Golden Arches? What?

    If he were not an Islamist then he wouldn't have said the U.S. was an accessory to 9-11 and that OBL was made in the USA less than 3 weeks after 9-11, he wouldn't refuse to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization, and he wouldn't be calling for a Sharia compliant US..
    But Americans who are not Islamist have also said that and a lot more. In fact, the internet is littered with American websites and blogs that go into great detail as to why US foreign policy may have played a role in not only inspiring Al Qaeda to attack the US, but helped to create Al Qaeda. Are you denying these facts or just insulted that an Islamist would dare to think and say what everyone knows? Because that would be a double standard that you once again fail to hold yourself and most Americans accountable to.

    Really how is it a fallacy? Would you support building an Orthodox Cathedral in or 2 blocks from the town of Srebrenica? It's a simple question and an accurate parrallel to building this Mosque.
    Yes, I would support an Orthodox Catherdral in the heart of downtown Srebrenica, especially if it had a swimming pool, gymnasium, theatres, spa, yoga classes, hair and nail salon, and a day care. After all, what would an Orthodox Cathedral be without all these wonderful things for the community? So how is your argument NOT a fallacy?
    Last edited by Moot; 08-21-10 at 03:32 AM.

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    Re: Mosque in new york to possibly move!

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Marteau View Post
    It's been nine years since Americans have had any tolerance towards Muslims whatsoever.
    If that laughable statement were true we would see daily attacks on Muslims and Muslim buildings.

    We do not.

    Your statement lacks any proof at all and smacks of wreakless generalization.
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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Wrong. In my first post on this thread, I clearly said....
    See, I'm intelligent enough to make the distinction, just like I make the distinction between a hate organization and the Christian religion. Albeit it is difficult sometimes what with all the pedophila and homophobia, BUT I do nevertheless because I KNOW that not ALL Christians are pedophiles and homophobic. So tell me, do you also paint Christianty with a broad brush, or the Jews, or the Hindus, or the Buddists, or the Mormons? If not, then why just Islam?
    While this man has not been directly linked to terrorist activities it is clear that he is part of the problem with Islam today, he is an Islamist not a secular Muslim.

    Personally I find the Christian religion to be violent and oppressive at its core but the difference is that all five mainstream sects of Islam still call for capital and/or corporal punishment for the non-crimes of homosexuality, apostasy, adultery, and/or premarital sex.

    Those are the only accepted views within mainstream Islam today, can you perhaps name the mainstream Christian or Judaic sect which still calls for such things? And I'm not talking about hundreds of years ago I'm talking about the present day. In fact can you name any major religion outside of Islam that still calls for those things?

    Then what should he build that would please you? A YMCA? A Jesus theme park? A Golden Arches? What?
    It would have been nice if he built an actual community center one which offered religious services for all members of the community and held a Jewish synagogue, a Christian church, Buddhist temple, and a Hindu Shrine. If he really wanted to build bridges and not a victory Mosque he could have built a memorial for the victims of 9-11 which would have actually engendered good will for the Muslim-American community rather than animosity, but only a fool wouldn't have known the backlash building this Mosque would create so to me it's clear what his true motivations are IE giving the proverbial **** you to America.
    But Americans who are not Islamist have also said that and a lot more.
    Which non-Islamists have called for a Sharia compliant U.S.?

    In fact, the internet is littered with American websites and blogs that go into great detail as to why US foreign policy may have played a role in not only inspiring Al Qaeda to attack the US, but helped to create Al Qaeda. Are you denying these facts or just insulted that an Islamist would dare to think and say what everyone knows?
    I'm not denying that people say those things, but I am denying that they are facts, because they are not facts they are blame the victim propaganda utilized by the radical left and Islamists. The facts are another matter altogether, we did not create or help to create AQ, AQ was created as a network of front charities and companies financed by wealthy Arabs not the CIA. Likewise I deny that U.S. foreign policy was related to 9-11, it was in fact the Islamist foreign policy of offensive Jihad which was the motivation for 9-11.

    Because that would be a double standard that you once again fail to hold yourself and most Americans accountable to.
    If non-Islamists who blame the U.S. for 9-11 and refuse to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization wanted to build a shrine to Islam at ground zero I would most certainly reject it and question their motivations behind such a project.

    Yes, I would support an Orthodox Catherdral in the heart of downtown Srebrenica, especially if it had a swimming pool, gymnasium, theatres, spa, yoga classes, hair and nail salon, and a day care. After all, what would an Orthodox Cathedral be without all these wonderful things for the community? So how is your argument NOT a fallacy?
    Well then you are lacking a little emotion we humans call empathy if you don't see why building an Orthodox Cathedral on the site where Orthodox Christians murdered several thousand innocent Muslim men, women, and children would be offensive and innappropriate.
    Last edited by Agent Ferris; 08-21-10 at 04:28 AM.

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Marteau View Post
    Oh, good, a crazy neocon libertarian thinks the world's second largest religion is only a stone's throw from pure evil, as opposed to standing in its doorway?


    It's good to know there are intelligent people like you out there.
    While not "pure evil" mainstream Islam is certainly violent and oppressive. It's in fact moderates who are on the fringe; such as, the Sufi's who are seen as heretics by the rest of the major Islamic sects.

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    While this man has not been directly linked to terrorist activities it is clear that he is part of the problem with Islam today, he is an Islamist not a secular Muslim.
    It's not clear at all or the Imam would be sitting in Gitmo instead of on a State Department funded trip to the Middle East to discuss the dangers of radicalism in both the West and Islam with Islamic leaders.

    Personally I find the Christian religion to be violent and oppressive at its core but the difference is that all five mainstream sects of Islam still call for capital and/or corporal punishment for the non-crimes of homosexuality, apostasy, adultery, and/or premarital sex.
    Personally, I find the way some Christians think a woman deserves to be raped if she dresses provocatively and calling for the death penalty for homosexuals, and the murder of abortion doctors very oppressive. If not for our separation of church and state, how long do you think it would take for Christians in this country to prescribe corporal punishment for the non-crimes of homosexuality, adultery, and/or premarital sex? Because it's happend before in this country and there is every indication that's where Christians are heading again were it not for our secular laws acting as a protective barrier.

    Those are the only accepted views within mainstream Islam today, can you perhaps name the mainstream Christian or Judaic sect which still calls for such things? And I'm not talking about hundreds of years ago I'm talking about the present day. In fact can you name any major religion outside of Islam that still calls for those things?
    They are not the only accepted views within mainstream Islam today, because there is no such thing as mainstream Islam. There is no single figure head or leader for Islam like a Pope or a Dali Lama. The Koran can be interpreted many ways and yes, there are those who selectively interpret it to hold power over the uneducated and ignorant believers or to fit their agenda. Just as there are Christian fundamentalists who selectively interpret the bible to fit their agenda in our country.

    It would have been nice if he built an actual community center one which offered religious services for all members of the community and held a Jewish synagogue, a Christian church, Buddhist temple, and a Hindu Shrine.
    Yeah, that would be great, especially if you demanded the same from the Jewish, Christian, Buddist, and Hindu community centers as well. But you aren't, instead you only demand of the Imam's community center while trying to deny him the right to practice his own religion on his own property, as well.

    If he really wanted to build bridges and not a victory Mosque he could have built a memorial for the victims of 9-11 which would have actually engendered good will for the Muslim-American community rather than animosity, but only a fool wouldn't have known the backlash building this Mosque would create so to me it's clear what his true motivations are IE giving the proverbial **** you to America.
    Which non-Islamists have called for a Sharia compliant U.S.?
    Well, if Americans believe Ground Zero to be so sacred, then how come they haven't a built a memorial there. Like, it's only been nine years and it's still a big gaping hole, that few ever visit except out of morbid curiosity. So where is America's 9/11 memorial, huh? Hell, they don't even want to help the firemen and volunteers pay for their medical bills let alone build a memorial. So sorry, but your concern and compassion for Ground Zero has a very shallow ring.

    I'm not denying that people say those things, but I am denying that they are facts, because they are not facts they are blame the victim propaganda utilized by the radical left and Islamists. The facts are another matter altogether, we did not create or help to create AQ, AQ was created as a network of front charities and companies financed by wealthy Arabs not the CIA. Likewise I deny that U.S. foreign policy was related to 9-11, it was in fact the Islamist foreign policy of offensive Jihad which was the motivation for 9-11.
    Well, you know the old saying, you are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own set of facts. There is plenty of evidence that proves the CIA had a hand in creating and funding Al Qaeda and the reason they attacked the US was because of US influence in the Middle East, especially Saudi Arabia. Them's the facts....
    1986-1992: CIA and British Recruit and Train Militants Worldwide to Help Fight Afghan War

    If non-Islamists who blame the U.S. for 9-11 and refuse to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization wanted to build a shrine to Islam at ground zero I would most certainly reject it and question their motivations behind such a project.
    Hamas? What has Hamas ever done to us and they certainly had nothing to do with 9/11 that the Imam would need to condemn them for.

    Well then you are lacking a little emotion we humans call empathy if you don't see why building an Orthodox Cathedral on the site where Orthodox Christians murdered several thousand innocent Muslim men, women, and children would be offensive and innappropriate.
    Oh I have plenty of empathy alright, just not for fools and their hate filled fallacious arguments.
    Last edited by Moot; 08-21-10 at 07:16 AM.

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    It's not clear at all or the Imam would be sitting in Gitmo instead of on a State Department funded trip to the Middle East to discuss the dangers of radicalism in both the West and Islam with Islamic leaders.
    It couldn't be more clear, he wants a Sharia compliant U.S., it is not illegal to call for Sharia, but he is not a secular Muslim he is an Islamist he is part of the problem. And I really don't give a **** what the DOS of a POTUS who just had the head of an organization listed as unindicted terrorist co-conspirators over for dinner does. This man calls for Sharia he is an Islamist and part of the problem.

    Personally, I find the way some Christians think a woman deserves to be raped if she dresses provocatively and calling for the death penalty for homosexuals, and the murder of abortion doctors very oppressive. If not for our separation of church and state, how long do you think it would take for Christians in this country to prescribe corporal punishment for the non-crimes of homosexuality, adultery, and/or premarital sex? Because it's happend before in this country and there is every indication that's where Christians are heading again were it not for our secular laws acting as a protective barrier.
    You are an out and out liar, apostasy, homosexuality, pre-marital sex, and apostasy have never been capital or corporal offenses in this country. And I don't deal in what if's, the fact is not a single mainsream Christian sect calls for any of that, but within mainstream Islam today those are the only accepted views. Those are the facts, something which you apparently don't have a lot of experience with.

    They are not the only accepted views within mainstream Islam today, because there is no such thing as mainstream Islam. There is no single figure head or leader for Islam like a Pope or a Dali Lama.
    Try the Ulama.

    The Koran can be interpreted many ways and yes, there are those who selectively interpret it to hold power over the uneducated and ignorant believers or to fit their agenda. Just as there are Christian fundamentalists who selectively interpret the bible to fit their agenda in our country.
    You simply have no clue whatosever about what you're talking about, in all five schools of Islamic Fiqh (Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i, Hanbali, and Ja'fari) the Ijma (consensus decision) of the Ulama is that apostasy, sodomy, homosexuality, and/or premarital sex are capital and/or corporal offenses. These are the only accepted views within mainstream Islam today. This is not radical Islam, or fundamentalist Islam, or Islamism, it is mainstream Islam, there is no other Islam today save for Sufism which is seen as heretical by the rest of Islam.

    Yeah, that would be great, especially if you demanded the same from the Jewish, Christian, Buddist, and Hindu community centers as well.
    Only on sites in which their shared ideological adherents kill 3,000 people.

    [quuote] But you aren't, instead you only demand of the Imam's community center while trying to deny him the right to practice his own religion on his own property, as well.
    [/quote]

    It's not a Community Center, it will not be offering religious services to other members of the community therefore it is a victory Mosque built to celebrate the successful 9-11 attacks and the oppressive ideololgy which is Islam.

    Well, if Americans believe Ground Zero to be so sacred, then how come they haven't a built a memorial there. Like, it's only been nine years and it's still a big gaping hole, that few ever visit except out of morbid curiosity. So where is America's 9/11 memorial, huh? Hell, they don't even want to help the firemen and volunteers pay for their medical bills let alone build a memorial.
    lol, what? Do you know how much the injured firemen and the families of those firemen who were killed got in financial compensation? Obviously not.

    So sorry, but your concern and compassion for Ground Zero has a very shallow ring.
    They don't need to build anything, the fact that they chose to build a victory Mosque is disgusting. They don't want to build bridges they want to burn them.

    Well, you know the old saying, you are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own set of facts. There is plenty of evidence that proves the CIA had a hand in creating and funding Al Qaeda and the reason they attacked the US was because of US influence in the Middle East, especially Saudi Arabia. Them's the facts....
    1986-1992: CIA and British Recruit and Train Militants Worldwide to Help Fight Afghan War

    A) Your article claims that the U.S. funded the foreign Jihadists and not just the indiginioius Afghan mujahadeen but offers absolutely nothing in the way of evidence for this assertion, provide evidence or it didn't happen.

    B) If you actually believe that defending the Kingdom from Iraq was Casus Belli for the 9-11 attacks then you have serious issues. What you don't understand is that OBL is a Qutbist and a Wahhabist and wishes to replace all world governments with theocratic Islamic governments based on puritannical Islam with the Koran as the Constitution through offensive jihad in order to fight the spread of jahiliyya.

    Hamas? What has Hamas ever done to us and they certainly had nothing to do with 9/11 that the Imam would need to condemn them for.
    They have killed several Americans in their terrorist attacks against Israel, are you trying to assert that Hamas shouldn't be condemned as a terrorist organization? This man was asked several times in a radio interview if Hamas was a terrorist organization and refused to answer in the affirmative.

    Oh I have plenty of empathy alright, just not for fools and their hate filled fallacious arguments.
    If you had a shred of empathy you would not support building an Orthodox Cathedral at Srebrenica or a Mosque at Ground Zero.
    Last edited by Agent Ferris; 08-21-10 at 11:05 AM.

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Well, you know the old saying, you are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own set of facts. There is plenty of evidence that proves the CIA had a hand in creating and funding Al Qaeda and the reason they attacked the US was because of US influence in the Middle East, especially Saudi Arabia. Them's the facts....
    1986-1992: CIA and British Recruit and Train Militants Worldwide to Help Fight Afghan War

    Nonsense, these aren't facts, but rather far left conspiracy.


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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    I'm not denying that people say those things, but I am denying that they are facts, because they are not facts they are blame the victim propaganda utilized by the radical left and Islamists. The facts are another matter altogether.
    Are you kidding me? Are you freaking kidding me!?! Have you ever heard of Iran-Contra? The USSR-Afghan War? Charlie Wilson's War? How about the following History Channel/National Geographic documentaries, "Inside Afghanistan", "Inside Al-Quaida", "Inside Iraq" or "Charlie Wilson's War: The Documentary"? Every one of those documentaries outline in full detail our nation's involvement in shaping foreign policy, recruitment, training, or supplying of "parties of foreign interest" with money or arms who we thought would best serve our foreign policy interest in the Middle-East, as well as, in Isreal. Anyone who thinks we've just been sitting on the sidelines twittling our thumbs looking like altar boys is in desperate need of a frontal labotomy!!! I would highly recommend you look for any of those documentaries and watch them very carefully!

    We did not create or help to create AQ. AQ was created as a network of front charities and companies financed by wealthy Arabs not the CIA. Likewise I deny that U.S. foreign policy was related to 9-11, it was in fact the Islamist foreign policy of offensive Jihad which was the motivation for 9-11.
    No, the U.S. didn't create Al-Quaida. That was Osama Bin Laden's doing. But we've been interferring in Isreali/Middle-East/Arab affairs since the Nixon administration (atleast since 1973). Still, I ask you how is it that these radical Muslims came to be so pissed off at us in the first place? I mean, think about it...

    Until the first bombing of the World Trade Center, the Muslim world left us well enough alone. Why did they start getting so pissed off at us all of a sudden? What changed their attitudes? And saying they've always been mad at us doesn't count. In the 50's, 60's and 70's, the U.S. was afraid of the spread of Communism. We didn't give a damn about this so-called "big threat of Islam spreading across the world". But now it's suppose to be this big threat that's been resting on the fringes for centuries like some tyrannical sleeping giant. Well, guess what...some have said the same thing about the spread of Christianity. Oh, wait...this nation did get it's start with it's discovery by Christopher Columbus, and part of his mandate was to spread Christianity to the natives from the Spanish Queen. Hmmm...

    And when did Middle-Eastern/Arab Muslims become so envious of the liberties we hold so dear? It's good to listen to the 10 O'Clock evening news, but don't believe everything you hear in mainstream media or talk radio.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 08-21-10 at 07:26 PM.

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Are you kidding me? Are you freaking kidding me!?! Have you ever heard of Iran-Contra? The USSR-Afghan War? Charlie Wilson's War? How about the following History Channel/National Geographic documentaries, "Inside Afghanistan", "Inside Al-Quaida", "Inside Iraq" or "Charlie Wilson's War: The Documentary"? Every one of those documentaries outline in full detail our nation's involvement in shaping foreign policy, recruitment, training, or supplying of "parties of foreign interest" with money or arms who we thought would best serve our foreign policy interest in the Middle-East, as well as, in Isreal. Anyone who thinks we've just been sitting on the sidelines twittling our thumbs looking like altar boys is in desperate need of a frontal labotomy!!! I would highly recommend you look for any of those documentaries and watch them very carefully!
    Seriously, you don't have a clue what you're talking about, the U.S. supported the indiginious Afghan Mujahadeen, not the foreign Jihadists that would go on to become AQ, the foreign Jihadists had their own sources of funding. Now the ISI may have taken U.S. dollars and transfered them to the foreign Mujahadeen but that in no way proves U.S. knowledge, or approval. The U.S. did not directly fund the foreign jihadists nor did knowingly fund or arm them indirectly and there is 0 evidence that it did.

    No, the U.S. didn't create Al-Quaida. That was Osama Bin Laden's doing. But we've been interferring in Isreali/Middle-East/Arab affairs since the Nixon administration (atleast since 1973).
    Um what does that ADL article have to do with anything?

    And by interfere do you mean finding, developing, and purchasing their oil?

    Still, I ask you how is it that these radical Muslims came to be so pissed off at us in the first place? I mean, think about it...
    We're infidels who are an impedement to their reestablishment of the Caliphate. Qutbist's support the destruction of all world governments and their replacement with Islamic theocracies in order to combat the spread of Jahiliyya.

    Until the first bombing of the World Trade Center, the Muslim world left us well enough alone.
    That's a lie, the Muslim world has been attacking the U.S. nearly since the Founding during the Barbary Wars, try again.

    Why did they start getting so pissed off at us all of a sudden?
    Muslims have been attacking non-Muslims for being non-Muslims since Mohammad.

    What changed their attitudes?
    There attittude hasn't changed, it was the same all the way back in the Barbary Wars and before that

    And saying they've always been mad at us doesn't count.
    What do you mean it doesn't count? It's a fact.

    In the 50's, 60's and 70's, the U.S. was afraid of the spread of Communism. We didn't give a damn about this so-called "big threat of Islam spreading across the world".
    The modern Islamist movement was overshadowed by the Arab nationalist movement during that time.

    But now it's suppose to be this big threat that's been resting on the fringes for centuries like some tyrannical sleeping giant. Well, guess what...some have said the same thing about the spread of Christianity. Oh, wait...this nation did get it's start with it's discovery by Christopher Columbus, and part of his mandate was to spread Christianity to the natives from the Spanish Queen. Hmmm...
    Arab nationalism was more prevalent than Islamism during that time, now it's Arab nationalism which has taken the back seat to Islamism.

    And when did Middle-Eastern/Arab Muslims become so envious of the liberties we hold so dear?
    They aren't envious, Islamists hate liberty plane and simple, they support the establishment of puritanical theocracies in the place of all world governments. Liberty and Islamism are mutually exclusive concepts.

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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    It couldn't be more clear, he wants a Sharia compliant U.S., it is not illegal to call for Sharia, but he is not a secular Muslim he is an Islamist he is part of the problem.
    No religion is secular. Duh. The Imam isn't the problem, Newt Gingrich and the radical right are the problem.

    And I really don't give a **** what the DOS of a POTUS who just had the head of an organization listed as unindicted terrorist co-conspirators over for dinner does. This man calls for Sharia he is an Islamist and part of the problem.
    You're more radical than the Imam, so that makes you part of the problem.

    You are an out and out liar, apostasy, homosexuality, pre-marital sex, and apostasy have never been capital or corporal offenses in this country. And I don't deal in what if's, the fact is not a single mainsream Christian sect calls for any of that, but within mainstream Islam today those are the only accepted views. Those are the facts, something which you apparently don't have a lot of experience with.
    LOL By the looks of it, you deal more in radical right wing hypocricy and denile, than you do in factual evidence....

    "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death." This verse was "adopted into legislation and enforced by the colonies of Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Connecticut."
    Laws criminalizing homosexual behavior: 1860 to the 1960s

    Sodomy laws were still on the books in many states clear up until 2003....
    Sodomy law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    And yet the Christians are still trying to impose the death penalty for homosexuals whenever and where ever they can....

    Joe. My. God.: CHRISTIAN LOVE: Family Research Council Lobbied Congress Against Resolution Denouncing Uganda's Kill Gays Bill

    The proposed legislation in Uganda, however, has been noted by several news agencies to be inspired by American evangelical Christians.
    Uganda Anti-Homosexuality Bill - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    Try the Ulama.
    So name an Ulama that is the head honcho of all Islam?

    You simply have no clue whatosever about what you're talking about.
    It's true, I don't claim or pretend to be an Ulama like you do.

    ...in all five schools of Islamic Fiqh (Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i, Hanbali, and Ja'fari) the Ijma (consensus decision) of the Ulama is that apostasy, sodomy, homosexuality, and/or premarital sex are capital and/or corporal offenses. These are the only accepted views within mainstream Islam today. This is not radical Islam, or fundamentalist Islam, or Islamism, it is mainstream Islam, there is no other Islam today save for Sufism which is seen as heretical by the rest of Islam.
    Hmm, so tell me Mullah Ferris, what is the difference between Islamism and Islam?

    Only on sites in which their shared ideological adherents kill 3,000 people.
    Well, if we use your logic then we should blame Conservatives for the Oklahoma City bombing since they share the same anti-government ideology as Timothy McVeigh.

    It's not a Community Center, it will not be offering religious services to other members of the community therefore it is a victory Mosque built to celebrate the successful 9-11 attacks and the oppressive ideololgy which is Islam.
    Well, you must live in a very oppressed society if you think a swimming pool and a gymnasium and theatres are celebrations of oppression.

    lol, what? Do you know how much the injured firemen and the families of those firemen who were killed got in financial compensation? Obviously not.
    LOL Obviously you don't know either, or you would have said how much financial compensation they got. But you didn't, did you? .......

    Lung Function of 9/11 Rescuers Fell, Study Finds
    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/08/nyregion/08lung.html

    You didn't answer my question....

    "...if Americans believe Ground Zero to be so sacred, then how come they haven't a built a memorial there. Like, it's only been nine years and it's still a big gaping hole, that few ever visit except out of morbid curiosity. So where is America's 9/11 memorial, huh? HUH? HUH???


    They don't need to build anything, the fact that they chose to build a victory Mosque is disgusting. They don't want to build bridges they want to burn them.
    Whats so disgusting about building a swimming pool and a gymnasium and theaters? And how does that burn bridges? I really don't understand your thinking.


    A) Your article claims that the U.S. funded the foreign Jihadists and not just the indiginioius Afghan mujahadeen but offers absolutely nothing in the way of evidence for this assertion, provide evidence or it didn't happen.
    <sigh> Yes, it did. The article was very well sourced. If you disagree with the evidence, then show me your evidence that disproves it.

    B) If you actually believe that defending the Kingdom from Iraq was Casus Belli for the 9-11 attacks then you have serious issues.
    WTF, are you talking about now? I didn't say anything about Iraq, so apparently you have a serious reading comprehension disorder.

    What you don't understand is that OBL is a Qutbist and a Wahhabist and wishes to replace all world governments with theocratic Islamic governments based on puritannical Islam with the Koran as the Constitution through offensive jihad in order to fight the spread of jahiliyya.
    Oh, so finally you are admitting that OBL isn't a mainstream Islamic and you admit there is a distinction between OBL, the jihadist and Imam Rahn, who only wants to build a community center. Gawd, it took long enough.

    They have killed several Americans in their terrorist attacks against Israel, are you trying to assert that Hamas shouldn't be condemned as a terrorist organization? This man was asked several times in a radio interview if Hamas was a terrorist organization and refused to answer in the affirmative.
    Hamas has never done anything to the US, so why should the Imam have to condemn them? I think you're just looking for excuses to hate someone because you're too cowardly to admit you hate yourself.

    If you had a shred of empathy you would not support building an Orthodox Cathedral at Srebrenica or a Mosque at Ground Zero.
    Thats right, I have no empathy for your antedotal fallacy. But if you had a shred of empathy you would stop your hateful nonsense against an innocent man who has done nothing to you or this country except try to do good.
    Last edited by Moot; 08-22-10 at 08:24 AM.

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