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Thread: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

  1. #111
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    Re: Mosque in new york to possibly move!

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    Then you don't support my right to freedom of speech and my right to assemble....... you want to deprive me of my Constitutional rights under the 1st amendment.

    Get my point?

    Edit: Exactly how would I be violating the law?
    No, I haven't. You've had your say. You don't get to camp out in front of my home creating problems for me after I've rid the neighborhood of the problem. I am not the problem; my dog was. And since the dog is gone you don't have a reason to be in front of my home anymore. Your freedom of assembly was granted for two very specific reasons:

    1) to alert the public that a home owner in the neighborhood possessed a domestic animal that was vicious and doing harm to the public; and,

    2) to compel me as the dog's owner to do something to protect the public from this vicious animal, towit, remove it or secure it.

    I choose to remove it. Therefore, you have no reason to remain camped out in front of my house.

    BE GONE!!! Now YOU have become the menace to society because you're disturing the peace. See how that works?

  2. #112
    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: Mosque in new york to possibly move!

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Y
    Though your words in this thread seems to be that you're suggesting that people SHOULDN'T do that, which I gues is you really saying you think free speech should be revoked but you just don't want to say it...by your logic.
    My point was that someone who says "You shouldn't do that" is really saying "You shouldn't have the right to do that". They just don't want to admit it. For example, hypothetically, lets say some politician drafted a bill to tweak the first amendment so that this mosque couldn't be built, by saying something like "Any religious institution or religious entities who are affiliated with a religious institution that is currently backing, supporting or participating in a war against the United States is prohibited from building monuments or places of worship on American soil as a matter of national security." Lets again, VERY hypothetically, say there was a federal referendum for it and every citizen in the United States could vote on this. You, as well as most others on this forum who oppose the mosque, would vote yes on that bill. That is because you don't think they should have the right to do so. But since you are trying to be politically correct and trying to pretend like you actually believe in our constitution, you give the bulls**t responses of "I think they should have the right, but that they shouldn't do it." HAHA! What sense does that make?

  3. #113
    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by GayLibertarian View Post
    this extremely good looking (gay?) gentlemen who was voted to the Presidency.
    Ridiculously good looking

  4. #114
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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    Ridiculously good looking
    I ain't touching that one.

  5. #115
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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    Obviously you didn't read my post because I said "liberals" and "conservatives" not "Democrats" or "Republicans", and obviously you don't know anything about the history of the Democratic and Republican parties, and I don't want to take the time to explain it to you.

    But at least you knew better not to comment on any other of the civil issues I mentioned besides slavery, because you know that conservatives tried prevent all of those changes.
    Wow, wrong, wrong, wrong.

    Conservatives widely supported abolishing slavery and other inequalities. Liberals - especially today - have supported institutionalized racism in the name of equality, such as Affirmative Action and incentivized welfare, in order to gain voting leverage.

    Conservatives are for what is logically the right thing to do. Liberals are for what will create governmental power and dependence among the citizenry.

    The fight to abolish slavery had nothing to do with conservative and liberal thought; it had to do with northern and southern economies. The conscious to do so was thick, as it was in all societies who made that transition over history.

    Every power in the history of the world was built by free labor. Go pick up that history book you were bragging about.

  6. #116
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    Re: Mosque in new york to possibly move!

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    You're not serious are you?

    Are you literally saying ANYTHING that someone has a right to do is unquestionably and universally then something they SHOULD do?

    I have a right to walk around with a Billboard that says Obama = Hitler...do you think I should do that?

    People have a right to think whatever they want as long as they don't act, so people have the right to fantasy continuously about doing a 5 year old while flogging themselves with a prostetic shaped like a dogs ass. Does that mean you think people should be doing it?

    Or hell, lets take this at a better example that's more relevant.

    I have the right to disagree with this Mosque, suggest that its a testimont to extremist muslims victories over the U.S. in their minds, and a purposeful insult to everyone affected by 9/11 and to speak that all over the internet and to everyone I know. I guess you think I should do that.

    Though your words in this thread seems to be that you're suggesting that people SHOULDN'T do that, which I gues is you really saying you think free speech should be revoked but you just don't want to say it...by your logic.
    Difference between moral rights and legal rights.

    Ideally, there is a way of conduct which is superior to any of the alternatives; one that incorporates all the best possible values and practices of human existence. No person or group embodies this standard entirely, but different qualities and actions bring them more or less closer to it.

    Nobody has any moral right to do anything that is not moral, and there are no rights above moral rights (unless they are speicifically given by God). However, morally, there is also a duty to abide -- to let people do as they will provided they are respecting the will and freedom of other people to the minimum extent necessary to maintain peaceful discourse within society.

    Legal rights are created so that the collective can observe that duty -- even though what a person does isn't always moral, it usually isn't quite immoral enough to merit employing force to prevent them.

    Thus, when we protest against a person doing something, we are protesting against their moral right; in the deepest sense of the word, we don't believe they have the right to perform the action they have undertaken, but force cannot be employed to prevent them because of the legal rights which compel us to uphold our duty to abide. Morally or legally, duties are always more of an imperative than rights.

    Since each side perceives (falsely or truly) that the other is out of their moral bounds, deep down each does believe the other doesn't really have the right to do what they are doing, even if it is just speaking (you don't have any moral right to say anything which is not virtuous).
    Last edited by Morality Games; 08-18-10 at 02:26 PM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  7. #117
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    Re: Mosque in new york to possibly move!

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    No, I haven't. You've had your say. You don't get to camp out in front of my home creating problems for me after I've rid the neighborhood of the problem. I am not the problem; my dog was. And since the dog is gone you don't have a reason to be in front of my home anymore. Your freedom of assembly was granted for two very specific reasons:

    1) to alert the public that a home owner in the neighborhood possessed a domestic animal that was vicious and doing harm to the public; and,

    2) to compel me as the dog's owner to do something to protect the public from this vicious animal, towit, remove it or secure it.

    I choose to remove it. Therefore, you have no reason to remain camped out in front of my house.

    BE GONE!!! Now YOU have become the menace to society because you're disturing the peace. See how that works?
    I have the right to protest on public property in front of your house for as long as I want to even if it disturbs you.... that is my 1st amendment right, and it appears to me that you want to take that right from me..... Why?

    I have the right but you don't support me. The Imam has the right and you do support him. Totally illogical.
    There is no such thing as a “Natural Born Dual-Citizen“.

    Originally Posted by PogueMoran
    I didnt have to read the article to tell you that you cant read.

  8. #118
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    Re: Mosque in new york to possibly move!

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    My point was that someone who says "You shouldn't do that" is really saying "You shouldn't have the right to do that".
    I totally disagree with that. I personally think that there are many things that shouldn't be done, but that it should legal to do them.

    You, as well as most others on this forum who oppose the mosque, would vote yes on that bill.
    I highly doubt that Zyph (as well as a good proportion of the opponents to this mosque) would support that bill. I'm sure that some people would, but I don't see people like Zyph or MrVicchio supporting that kind of legislation.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  9. #119
    Student Johnny DooWop's Avatar
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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Wow, wrong, wrong, wrong.

    Conservatives widely supported abolishing slavery and other inequalities.
    Why don't you pick up that history book I was bragging about and give me some sources. What staunch conservatives supported the civil rights movement? And remember, not "Republicans" but conservatives. Before the 1960s southern democrats had the most conservative ideologies out of anyone in America. When the northern dems became increasingly liberal and started backing the civil rights movement, the southern dems jumped ship and infiltrated the Republican party, which is why you have this ironic and contradictory ideologies of social conservatism and economic liberalism in the Republican party.

    America was built on liberalism. The idea that everyone is equal was not a traditional conservative value in Europe. Conservatives, who were originally British Loyalist who opposed the American Revolution, have been trying to resist the changes of equality ever since, but true liberals, like Abe Lincoln and JFK have pushed through that resistance to bring true equality to all Americans.

  10. #120
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    Re: Ground Zero Mosque On The Move?

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny DooWop View Post
    Why don't you pick up that history book I was bragging about and give me some sources. What staunch conservatives supported the civil rights movement? And remember, not "Republicans" but conservatives. Before the 1960s southern democrats had the most conservative ideologies out of anyone in America. When the northern dems became increasingly liberal and started backing the civil rights movement, the southern dems jumped ship and infiltrated the Republican party, which is why you have this ironic and contradictory ideologies of social conservatism and economic liberalism in the Republican party.

    America was built on liberalism. The idea that everyone is equal was not a traditional conservative value in Europe. Conservatives, who were originally British Loyalist who opposed the American Revolution, have been trying to resist the changes of equality ever since, but true liberals, like Abe Lincoln and JFK have pushed through that resistance to bring true equality to all Americans.
    You are obviously a product of today's wonderful public education system....

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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