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Thread: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

  1. #91
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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    My point is that while we in the U.S. can have the luxury of sitting back to see what happens, the margin for error in Israel is far smaller. Even if Iran had the theoretical capability of hitting the U.S. with one or two atomic bombs, the damage would be devastating but nowhere near existential. For Israel, one or two atomic bombs would all but mean anihilation. Hence, from that perspective, especially if one considers the Jewish historical narrative, Israel is not going to have a high tolerance for waiting to see if Mr. Ahmadinejad's rhetoric is little more than bluster.
    Just think I should say it would take more than one or two nukes to annihilate Israel. Also, any attack that didn't disable Israel's own nuclear arsenal would be suicidal. Israel is widely reported to have hundreds of nukes, enough to destroy every major population center and military base in Iran, while still having enough left to ward off any other eager beavers.

    It would take a lot more than a couple nukes, and they would have to much higher yield than Iran is likely to start with, in order to annihilate Israel. Certainly the Israeli government knows it is unlikely Iran will use any nukes it might develop and even if it did that this would not really be an existential threat.

    However, as it stands Israel's unchallenged position would quickly become challenge-able and thus there is no desire to see Iran get a nuclear weapon.

    That's why I believe time is of the essence. Crippling sanctions need to be agreed
    Yeah, just look at the wonders it did with North Korea.

    As noted previously, I favor pursuing those other issues on their own merit. I'm just not convinced of the linkage. Since the 1970s, international policy makers in the U.S. and Europe have overestimated the linkages. The breakthrough that led to Egyptian-Israeli peace was supposed to create a dramatically new dynamic. The rollback of Saddam Hussein's forces for Kuwait was supposed to create a new environment. Jordan-Israel peace was supposed to open the door to Israeli-Palestinian peace. Concrete results fell far short of the almost euphoric expectations.
    I would say these did create new dynamics with regards to Egypt and Jordan. As it stands right now if Israel were able to persuade Syria to accept a peace agreement this could really position things well. I believe Hamas and Hezbollah can definitely be reasoned with and getting Syria and Iran to change their position towards Israel would be beneficial in this regard.

    I agree that ultimately Iran will need to be part of an agreement if regionwide peace is to be achieved. Achieving such an outcome won't be easy with a revolutionary government that is far from sold on maintaining the current Middle East order (Arab-Israeli/Sunni-Shia dimensions, among others).
    Who says that order needs to be maintained in order for peace to be achieved? If Iran ceased its antagonism and was embraced by the West then it would give them all the better opportunity to extend their influence.
    "For what is Evil but Good-tortured by its own hunger and thirst?"
    - Khalil Gibran

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Israel is not going to attack Iran. John Bolton is, as usual, a complete moron.

    The fact that Iran's reactor is going to go live is really not that big of a deal. In fact, back in 2007 President Bush supported the Russia-Iran nuclear deal because it, along with the design of the reactor, would make it essentially impossible for Iran to further enrich spent fuel to weapons grade without being noticed. This is in fact a safer deal than the alternatives provided (of course by safer I mean the chance of Iran developing nuclear weapons due to this are much smaller).

    Moreover, an Israeli air strike would be beyond stupid. Ignoring for the moment the destabilizing influence it would have in the region (which would probably lead to the destruction of Israel by themselves), the bombing of the Osirak reactor showed that this is a completely idiotic position; the bombing of Osirak actually caused Iraq to implement a crash program to develop nuclear weaponry, whereas previously it was a deal similar between France/Iraq to this current deal between Russia/Iran.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    I strongly agree with this assessment and feel that it is the only logical purpose to invading Iraq. All reports from inspectors prior to the invasion suggested that Iraq's WMD program was in shambles at best, and non-existent in all reality. However, the possibility indeed presented the best route to gaining a ME stronghold and potential ally in the region.
    In otherwords the war was started based on a lie just like the Vietnam War was in the Gulf of Tonkin.

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Just curious but if they're giving back nuclear waste to Russia how will they transport it? Wouldn't overland transport be falling right into the hands of those that want this material for terrorist purposes? Seems to me overland transport is precarious at best in this part of the world with it's IED's and rebels.

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    They'll probably ship it by truck. Check this article out for more information.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by ricksfolly View Post
    Here's one reason it's one sided... Israel has hundreds of lobbyists in DC, Iran and all of the other gulf nations, none.

    Who knows how much of the billions we give Israel pays for good and bad publicity...

    ricksfolly
    You are good at the traditional canard levelled against Jews as to that fabled 'Jewish lobby", but you seem to lack the understanding necessary to realize that Iran has a most powerful lobbying tool that it uses throughout the world -- oil.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by GayLibertarian View Post
    My stated opinion about Iran was made objectively clear for you but you have chosen to ignore it.
    Hi Sock Puppet. (yes, you're a sock puppet, the question is now WHO'S sock puppet).

    Disagreeing =/= ignoring.

    Iran is emboldened by left-wing anti-Semitism in America and Israel in same fashion North Vietnamese Communists were emboldened by pro-Marxist student demonstrators during the Vietnam War (1955-75).
    You actually believe that? Iran will do what it wants independent of what we say or believe.

    Unfortunately, after the Fall of Saigon in 1975 (when left-wing, pro-Communist students went back to their university classrooms), the Communist victors in Vietnam exterminated 3,500,000 South Vietnamese, Catholics, Christians, and cultural minorities
    Woot! Numbers out of nowhere!

    Iran has threatened to exterminate Israel in the same manner that the North Vietnamese Communists exterminated the South.
    Yeah. Just so happened when their economy was in the toilet. Tell me, if they hate Jews so much, why are there 20,000+ and growing in Iran?

    More partisan vomit with nothing resembling intelligence behind it. NEXT!
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Never said it was okay, said there was a difference. The only reason the SAVAK and Shah was in business was because of the US and UK. Without their backing, both monetary and trainingwise, the Shah would never have been put back in power. Without US training, the SAVAK would never have become so brutal as they became.
    SAVAK would have been just as brutal, without any help from the United States. Even if the Shah had never been put into power, Mosah Deg would have done the same thing.



    You dont know your own history do you? 2 US aircraft were shot down during bombing raids in Lebanon by US forces against Syrian positions. Also the New Jersey shelled Lebanon during the same period. As for sources.. google it or look it up in this wikipedia article

    Multinational Force in Lebanon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Oh, you're talking about the multinational peace keeping force that was supported by th UN. You made it sound as if we invaded Lebanon and targetted civilian population centers. The French also flew sorties in Lebanon. Are they bad guys, too? Why haven't they been attacked? Because, ever since, they've rolled over to the Islamofacists?

    BTW, gotta link for all those thousands of civilian casualties that US warplanes inflicted?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    SAVAK would have been just as brutal, without any help from the United States. Even if the Shah had never been put into power, Mosah Deg would have done the same thing.
    And not the point and you know it. Stop trying to divert attention away from the facts and point of the comments.

    Oh, you're talking about the multinational peace keeping force that was supported by th UN.
    Of course

    You made it sound as if we invaded Lebanon and targetted civilian population centers.
    No I did not.. that is your paranoid fantasies taking over again.

    The French also flew sorties in Lebanon. Are they bad guys, too? Why haven't they been attacked?
    No because they dont blindly support Israel. The French are not popular either though, but when there is a bigger boogie man in the room, then focus will be put on him

    Because, ever since, they've rolled over to the Islamofacists?
    And you can of course prove this accusation?

    BTW, gotta link for all those thousands of civilian casualties that US warplanes inflicted?
    And where exactly did I state thousands of civilian casualties were inflected?
    PeteEU

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    Re: Israel has '8 days' to hit Iran nuclear site: Bolton

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    And not the point and you know it. Stop trying to divert attention away from the facts and point of the comments.



    Of course



    No I did not.. that is your paranoid fantasies taking over again.



    No because they dont blindly support Israel. The French are not popular either though, but when there is a bigger boogie man in the room, then focus will be put on him



    And you can of course prove this accusation?



    And where exactly did I state thousands of civilian casualties were inflected?
    Basically, what you posts attempted to do, is justify an attack, that killed 3,000 American civilians, using half-assed facts and revised history.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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