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Thread: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Homeschooled kids are frequently, if not always the top percentile of educated per grade level in the United States.


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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Homeschooled kids are frequently, if not always the top percentile of educated per grade level in the United States.


    j-mac
    Except in Southern Utah, where they're married by age 14.

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    arizona, arkansas, colorado, kentucky, louisiana, mississippi, missouri, new mexico, north carolina, utah, west virginia, and wyoming

    compare the rankings of these non-teacher-union states with those of the other states with teachers' unions

    compare them to the educational attainment in finland, sweden, denmark, germany and japan ... where the unions are strong and the teachers are well compensated

    and to those who insist that it is the teacher and not the student and their parents, who is to be found responsible when educational achievement is not attained ... just look around and compare the high scoring schools and the low scoring schools. it will be rare to find instances where the affluent schools do not have high achieving students and the impoverished locales do not have a disproportionate number of low scoring students. in my community, those exceptions were the result of placing highly desirable magnet programs in the distressed community schools, which attracted the high achieving students from the more affluent neighborhoods

    we can correlate inferior academic achievement to economic environment, and to states without teacher unionization ... neither of those indicators point to the teachers as being the problem with our present education system
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Homeschooled kids are frequently, if not always the top percentile of educated per grade level in the United States.


    j-mac
    nope. the data does not support that. they tend to be average ... with very wide swings in individual performance. in many instances, the tests administered to home schooled students are not like those administered to public school students. that results in an apples to oranges comparison. additionally, there is nothing which prevents the home schooler from being assisted during that exam, unlike in the public schools, which would skew the home school data in its favor

    and the private schools tend to perform weaker than the public schools (once the disabled student population the public schools are required to "teach" are eliminated from the scoring models). especially the Christian schools. admittedly, the jesuit schools do exceed public school performance. however, the southern baptist schools turn out students who are very weak academically
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    nope. the data does not support that. they tend to be average ... with very wide swings in individual performance. in many instances, the tests administered to home schooled students are not like those administered to public school students. that results in an apples to oranges comparison. additionally, there is nothing which prevents the home schooler from being assisted during that exam, unlike in the public schools, which would skew the home school data in its favor

    and the private schools tend to perform weaker than the public schools (once the disabled student population the public schools are required to "teach" are eliminated from the scoring models). especially the Christian schools. admittedly, the jesuit schools do exceed public school performance. however, the southern baptist schools turn out students who are very weak academically

    Sorry Bubba, but that would just plainly be wrong....


    Dr. Brian Ray, in the most in-depth nationwide study on home education across the United States, collected data on 5,402 students from 1,657 families. Homeschool students’ academic achievement, on average, was significantly above that of public-school students. In addition, the home educated did well even if their parents were not certified teachers and if the state did not highly regulate homeschooling.3
    · Home educators are able to be flexible and tailor or customize the curriculum to the needs of each child.
    · In study after study, the home educated score better, on average, than those in conventional state-run schools (see table).2

    .... Reading Language Math
    Public Schools 50 50 50
    Home Education 65-80 65-80 65-80

    National Home Education Research Institute - Facts on Homeschooling

    j-mac
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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Except in Southern Utah, where they're married by age 14.
    Wrong again

    MARRIAGE BY MINORS

    Applicants under the age of 18 years of age are required to have :

    * If the applicant is 16 or 17 years of age, a parent or legal guardian must be present to sign consent.
    * If the applicant is 15 years of age, an authorization to marry must be provided by a juvenile judge of the court exercising juvenile jurisdiction in the county where either party to the marriage resides. The written authorization may also be obtained from a court commissioner as permitted by rule of the Judicial Council. Please contact our office for a form. (Section 30-1-9 Marriage by Minors)
    * Applicants 14 years of age and younger cannot obtain a marriage license under Utah law.


    Utah County Marriage License Requirements

    And since "southern Utah" is not its own state the same law applies.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Sorry Bubba, but that would just plainly be wrong....





    j-mac
    read this and see:
    //www.mensafoundation.org/Sites/foundation/NavigationMenu/Publications/Journal/Samplearticle/SampleArticle.htm

    those home schoolers who go to four year colleges have equivalent college performance when compared to those who attended public schools
    however, a smaller portion of the home schooled students go on to higher education ... and that is especially pronounced when compared to students in public school honors programs

    compared to the the public school graduates, a smaller portion of the home school graduates appear less qualified - or possibly they are only less inclined - to pursue a higher formal education
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    I am a teacher and I support standards, though many of the standards they are making I think are superficial and poorly thought out. I would rather focus on developing critical thinking skills (among high school students, which is what I teach) rather than focus on wrote memorization, which is what most of these tests encourate.

    I would use a combination of observation and results, but those results have to be looked at over time with a clearly developed baseline. I taught a lot of ESL kids when I was in the States. Great kids and I loved the work, but it was hard. And if you thought these kids were going to score 500 on the verbal part of their SAT, you had another thing coming. Not fair to compare the scores of that teacher to another who is teaching AP classes. Also, it is hard to compare year to year because students change from year to year. One year, I might teach ESL level 1 students, the next I may have Level 3 and mainstream classes. You can't compare the results from year to year.
    I am married to an English professor (and me being from the south...oh boy dont we have a lot of fun...) and her family has several teachers as well. I very much value teachers and think they are underpaid and underappreciated. That doesnt change the fact that there are some real piece of **** teachers (like there are professionals in EVERY field) and those people MUST be identified and removed...especially when in such an important role. Teachers HATE testing...God knows I hear it from my relatives all the time. Wah. Our education system is struggling and at SOME point those abject failures have to be identified and removed. People say if you test, then teachers will teach to the test. Well...1-thats only true if they know the test, and 2-Thank GOD...at least they are teaching SOMETHING for a change.

  9. #49
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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Pay should be negotiated on an individual level.
    There are a lot of teachers and a lot of people who want to be teachers.
    They shouldn't have high pay because we've built it into being some holy rollin, noble profession.
    It's a job.

    Unionizing has caused disastrous results, especially because your customers are captive to you.
    They have to buy the product whether they want it or not.



    It's not right that I still have to pay for the local school.
    My wife instructs my kids.

    That's why I said it shouldn't be compulsory, not to forget that the budget would be lean and based on cost efficiency.

    I've had it with state managed education.
    The same things have been happening for at least 30 years and they have no intention of really changing for the positive, all the while a bunch of children fall to the way side because of their inaction.

    They have had their chance, they need the boot in total.
    I agree with much of what you say but I DO think teachers should at the very least get paid more...but until they find a way to create a standard then they shouldnt be paid individually. Then salary because poltical...who you know...who you blow...

    And I have great respect for homeschoolers, but like people that never have kids have to pay taxes (public schools...greater societal good...all that bull****) then you should still have to pay for public schools. maybe an education voucher would be the way to go for homeschoolers.

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    Re: Teachers union threatens ‘massive boycott’ of Los Angeles Times

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    Wrong again

    MARRIAGE BY MINORS

    Applicants under the age of 18 years of age are required to have :

    * If the applicant is 16 or 17 years of age, a parent or legal guardian must be present to sign consent.
    * If the applicant is 15 years of age, an authorization to marry must be provided by a juvenile judge of the court exercising juvenile jurisdiction in the county where either party to the marriage resides. The written authorization may also be obtained from a court commissioner as permitted by rule of the Judicial Council. Please contact our office for a form. (Section 30-1-9 Marriage by Minors)
    * Applicants 14 years of age and younger cannot obtain a marriage license under Utah law.


    Utah County Marriage License Requirements

    And since "southern Utah" is not its own state the same law applies.
    Im pretty sure she was making a joke...could have applied to just about anywhere.

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