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President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

apdst said:
Yes!........
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OMG, really?! We must stop them! There is a Muslim terrorist organization that is trying to build a Mosque in Manhattan simply to spite Americans and as a symbol of their conquest over America! They have even infiltrated the Whitehouse by putting one of their own in office! Haven't you seen his middle name?! Isn't it obvious he's a terrorist Muslim?! Our country is getting taken over by Muslims and by communist and by socialist and by a black Hitler all at the same time!! The sky is falling! The sky is falling!
 
Johnny DooWop said:
I understand that the situation is touchy. I was really weirded out by the mosque idea when I first heard it. However, when you were younger and someone did something wrong to you did and you wanted get them back, did you ever hear one of your parents say "Don't sink to their level. Be the better person." If A**holes in this world make nice people turn into A**holes, then the world will be filled with A**holes! That's why people like me believe in letting these Muslims, who have no connection to the 9/11 attacks, or to terrorism, and who have condemned the attacks, build their Mosque.
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I never said they didn't have the right to build their Mosque, that's not the issue, the issue is whether or not they should, and it is clear that they shouldn't. If this was about cultural outreach as they claim then why not build a memorial to the victims of 9-11 which would actually engender goodwill from the American people towards the Muslim community?

Due to the words of the Imam behind this initiative it is clear that this only an attempt at provocation not mutual understanding.

Its kind of like how other countries allow their officers to torture and starve POWs while we don't. Sure we could be like one of those European countries that fosters religious division and holds bitterly to previous conflicts, or we could be the better guys. And that's the difference between conservatives (even the ones who pretend to be anarchist) and liberals. Liberals want to make the world a better, more tolerant place. While conservatives want to foster religious division and discriminate against people because of their race, religion and sexual-orientation.
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lol I love it when the left claims to have this respect for property rights when it suits their agenda. This Mosque is not making the world a more tolerant place it is in fact causing religious division because the entire point of the mosque being built there is as an act of provocation and incitement. If this Muslim groups intent was cultural understanding and cooperation then why was space not set aside for a synagogue and a christian church in this "community center" along with the Mosque? Why didn't they build something that would have actually fostered goodwill towards the muslim community like building a memorial for the victims of 9-11 instead?

If you support this Mosque being built and not just the right to build it then I suppose you support building an Orthodox Cathedral in the town of Srebrenica.
 
Johnny DooWop said:
OMG, really?! We must stop them! There is a Muslim terrorist organization that is trying to build a Mosque in Manhattan simply to spite Americans and as a symbol of their conquest over America! They have even infiltrated the Whitehouse by putting one of their own in office! Haven't you seen his middle name?! Isn't it obvious he's a terrorist Muslim?! Our country is getting taken over by Muslims and by communist and by socialist and by a black Hitler all at the same time!! The sky is falling! The sky is falling!
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The imam that is building the mosque refuses to admit that hamas is a terrorist orginization. That says alot.
 
Caine said:
ROFL.

*cough* you were thread banned *cough*
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Moderator's Warning:
There is no need to comment on such matters. The moderators review the threads and take such steps as are necessary to enforce the rules.
 
I don't think Obama should've commented at all. He should've just avoided this non-issue and if asked say 'no comment'. Thad what I would've done if I were him.

Hey, if they own the property they have the right to build what they want.

But people against it have the right to speak out aganst it.

Freedom is a two way street.
 
apdst said:
The imam that is building the mosque refuses to admit that hamas is a terrorist orginization. That says alot.
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Is that the best you got? if so, I don;t think you have anything at all.
 
Boo Radley said:
Is that the best you got? if so, I don;t think you have anything at all.
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He wants a Sharia compliant U.S., he blamed the U.S. for 9-11 and said OBL was made in the USA less than 3 weeks after the 9-11 attacks, and has refused to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization. This isn't some a-political kumbaya singing paragon of multiculturalism, he's an Islamist POS and his intentions to incite are abundantly clear as many actual moderate Muslims have readily expressed.
 
"You know to be fair, we've been building ground zero's near Iraqi Mosques since 2003" - thought that was kind of amusing.
 
Agent Ferris said:
I never said they didn't have the right to build their Mosque, that's not the issue, the issue is whether or not they should, and it is clear that they shouldn't.
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Well, I'm an anarchist so I believe everyone should be able to do whatever the hell they want.

Agent Ferris said:
Due to the words of the Imam behind this initiative it is clear that this only an attempt at provocation not mutual understanding.
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This is an assumption and an example of typical conservative paranoid delusion. The sky is falling! Everyone is after us!

Could they have thought of a better way to "build bridges"? Maybe. I remember when I was a kid there was another kid in my class and we hated each other. Anyway, so the teacher thought it would be a great idea to sit us next to each other in the class. I guess she figured it would force us to be around each other and talk and that we'd realize the other person wasn't so bad after all. Did it work? No. But I'm not naive or paranoid enough to believe that she was doing that to "spite" us.
 
Agent Ferris said:
He wants a Sharia compliant U.S., he blamed the U.S. for 9-11 and said OBL was made in the USA less than 3 weeks after the 9-11 attacks, and has refused to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization. This isn't some a-political kumbaya singing paragon of multiculturalism, he's an Islamist POS and his intentions to incite are abundantly clear as many actual moderate Muslims have readily expressed.
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That's closer, but can you link all that, just to make sure you actually have it straight. ;)
 
apdst said:
The imam that is building the mosque refuses to admit that hamas is a terrorist orginization. That says alot.
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That's all the evidence I need! The feds should be raiding his house any day as a suspected terrorist. No need to fear anymore my fellow patriot. We won't let these Muslims take over our country, if thats the last thing we do!
 
Johnny DooWop said:
Well, I'm an anarchist so I believe everyone should be able to do whatever the hell they want.
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I don't know what that is but it's not anarchism. You can't do whatever the hell you want if it infringes upon the rights of others. I'm an anarchist, I believe in their intrinsic right to build their Mosque but I don't think that they should build their Mosque and support the intrinsic right of the citizenry to protest against it being built.

This is an assumption and an example of typical conservative paranoid delusion. The sky is falling! Everyone is after us!
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No it's not an assumption it is based on the available evidence, this Imam has stated that the U.S. was partially responsible for the 9-11 attacks and that OBL was made in the USA he said that less than 3 weeks after the attacks, likewise he refuses to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization and support a Sharia compliant U.S. legal system.

Could they have thought of a better way to "build bridges"? Maybe.
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If they were interested in building bridges they wouldn't build the Mosque because it is having the exact opposite effect. If they were interested in building bridges they would have built a memorial to the victims of 9-11 or a multicultural community center rather than an Islamic community center. They are not interested in building bridges as made evidently clear by their actions and their stubborn refusal to change their mind as a result of the reaction to those actions.

I remember when I was a kid there was another kid in my class and we hated each other. Anyway, so the teacher thought it would be a great idea to sit us next to each other in the class. I guess she figured it would force us to be around each other and talk and that we'd realize the other person wasn't so bad after all. Did it work? No. But I'm not naive or paranoid enough to believe that she was doing that to "spite" us.
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Then why didn't they build a multicultural center with a mosque, a church, a synagogue, hindu temple etc? No they built a Mosque doubling as an Islamic community center. Islamic as in non-Muslims need not apply.
 
Agent Ferris said:
He wants a Sharia compliant U.S., he blamed the U.S. for 9-11 and said OBL was made in the USA less than 3 weeks after the 9-11 attacks, and has refused to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization. This isn't some a-political kumbaya singing paragon of multiculturalism, he's an Islamist POS and his intentions to incite are abundantly clear as many actual moderate Muslims have readily expressed.
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I'd be really interested to see a psychological study that seeks to find whether conservatives have a higher tendency for fear and paranoia than liberals or moderates. That would explain a lot of the conservative worldview. I know there are studies that have shown conservatives tend to have a greater fear of change, fear of uncertainty and show more tendencies and traits of Social Dominance Orientation than liberals or moderates.
 
Johnny DooWop said:
I'd be really interested to see a psychological study that seeks to find whether conservatives have a higher tendency for fear and paranoia than liberals or moderates. That would explain a lot of the conservative worldview. I know there are studies that have shown conservatives tend to have a greater fear of change, fear of uncertainty and show more tendencies and traits of Social Dominance Orientation than liberals or moderates.
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Yep, that's the ticket, building a Mosque at ground zero to promote American understanding of Muslims is like building an Orthodox Cathedral at Srebrenica to promote reconciliation between Christians and Muslims, and I'm the one who needs to be studied. :roll:

But hey way to address the points I made, I understand that defense of the indefensible is tuff which is why you must resort the red-herrings.
 
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Agent Ferris said:
Meh meh. I've already done that like ten times, here I'll just give you the link in this thread where I already did it:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ort-ground-zero-mosque-31.html#post1058920302
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OK, are you sure you read this:

Home Page | Cordoba

If so, I don't think you quite understood it. It is not what you claim and not particular radical at all.

Nor is either of the other two claims what you say either. He denounces the terrrorist attacks clearly, but much like MLK, who called the US the greatest preyor of violence in the world today, he acknowledges that we have made errors. Only someone radical concerning the US would not admit to that. No one says that excuses 9/11 or terrorist attacks, and they shouldn't, but honesty requires acknowledgement of our own sins as well.

Frankly, this iman seems far less radical than what you're arguing.
 
Agent Ferris said:
Yep, that's the ticket, building a Mosque at ground zero to promote American understanding of Muslims is like building an Orthodox Cathedral at Srebrenica to promote reconciliation between Christians and Muslims, and I'm the one who needs to be studied. :roll:
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Building a Mosque is like building an Orthodox Cathedral at Srebrencia? I've never heard that phrase before. As a matter a fact, I'm pretty sure that's the first time you've posted it! Now I understand! Lets go stop these genocidal Muslims! We can not let this happen! We must uphold our ideal of conservative-anarchism and protest the construction of this building that is only being built to spite all Americans and to foster more division! Lets go stop this insanity! We are in danger! In real danger! Doesn't anyone realize this?
 
How come no one protests the Pentagon for having a mosque?
 
Boo Radley said:
OK, are you sure you read this:

Home Page | Cordoba
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That is the very link I provided.

If so, I don't think you quite understood it. It is not what you claim and not particular radical at all.
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He supports sharia his only opposition is on the strict penal codes which means that he supports criminalizing homosexuality, apostasy, etc and supports sexist inheritence policies, and everything else sharia entails. He wants a sharia compliant U.S. or in his words: "ensure that their secular laws are not in conflict with the Quran or the Hadith."
Nor is either of the other two claims what you say either. He denounces the terrrorist attacks clearly,
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He said that the U.S. was an accessory to the 9-11 attacks.

but much like MLK, who called the US the greatest preyor of violence in the world today, he acknowledges that we have made errors.
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He said that the U.S. is an accessory to 9-11 IE he blamed the U.S. for 9-11.

Only someone radical concerning the US would not admit to that. No one says that excuses 9/11 or terrorist attacks, and they shouldn't, but honesty requires acknowledgement of our own sins as well.
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He blamed the U.S. for 9-11. He said that U.S. actions made us an accessory to the crime. This is a definitive clear cut case of blaming the victim.

Frankly, this iman seems far less radical than what you're arguing.
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He has said or refused to say everything I claimed, and supports everything I claimed he supported.
 
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This might be the biggest non-issue on this board..... It is an Islamic cultural center, which includes a Mosque and its more then two blocks away. 1) its not on ground zero and 2) so what if it is? People that get their panties in a bunch over this issue need to get a grip.... on real issues.

It is just disgusting to me how intolerant we Americans have become. I thought we were better than this.....
 
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upsideguy said:
This might be the biggest non-issue on this board..... It is an Islamic cultural center, which includes a Mosque
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lol you can call it whatever you want but it's a large building holding daily prayer services for Muslims only, it's a Mosque.

and its more then two blocks away. 1) its not on ground zero
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Ground zero includes the surrounding area not just the actual site of the WTC's.

It is just disgusting to me how intolerant we Americans have become. I thought we were better than this.....
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Tolerance of the intolerant is not a virtue.
 
I wonder why Christians don't get the same priority as the Muslims do in their request to build a church, this is my problem. No Christian church...no Mosque why the preferential treatment for Rauf to build his Mosque but yet NYC stonewalls the Orthodox Christian Church the permit to rebuild their church. Somethings up and it stinks...
------Article
St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church, which once sat right across the street from the World Trade Center, was crushed under the weight of the collapse of Tower Two on September 11, 2001. St. Nicholas was the only church to be lost in the attacks, and nine years later, while City of New York officials are busy removing every impediment to the building of the Cordoba mosque two blocks from the site, St. Nicholas’ future remains unclear.

source:
Ground Zero Islamic Mosque Moves Forward, Christian Church in Limbo - HUMAN EVENTS
 
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