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Thread: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

  1. #621
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Primarily, to provide a place of worship for those individual believers of the Muslim faith.

    Secondly, to provide "a cultural center that strengthens ties between Muslims and people of all faiths and backgrounds".

    Again, I understand the sensativity issue here, as well as the suspicion and mistrust so many people have concerning the building of this Mosque. It's why I've said that the government should still do their investigative work and if it is discovered that there's some shadiness involved in the funding or use of this Mosque law enforcement should do their due diligence. In other words, allow it to be built because there's no credible evidence to deny it's construction. The owner followed local law, paid the prerequisite permit fee, and his building plans met approval by the city building commission. There's no real reason to deny its construction except for our own emotional hangup. Again, I get the objection here.

    -The 9/11 attackers used charitable organizations to funnel money into the U.S. that ultimately was used to pay for supplies, as well as, the daily living expenses of terrorist who laid in wait to attack us.

    -Members of terrorist sleeper cells used Mosques, specifically in NYC but also in other cities across this country, as a hiding place to coordinate their attack.

    -Imans at some Mosques use these holy places to further the spread of hatred against the very country that provides them basic human rights, and they used those rights against us.

    Believe me, I GET IT! But I also understand that to deny its construction would violate some of our basic rights and values. And that, above all else, is far more important than catering to our fears.

    If we're going to tell the world that democracy matters, then we had very damned well practise what we preach. (Excuse the pun.)
    yes, you DO get it, you don't have to work so hard to convince me of that, i've already seen

    he has the right, that's already been decided

    to deny him his right would be unamerican, and, worse, illegal

    whatever

    but, mr rauf, if you really want to "strengthen ties between Muslims and people of all faiths and backgrounds," what you're doing isn't working, it's making things much worse

    you need to LISTEN to all these people who are not amenable to what you are pushing

    the fact that you disagree with their thinking is only all the more reason you need to LISTEN

    (he will, give him time, 9-11's coming, and it's gonna be HOT and LOUD)

    if you really want to strengthen ties, that is

  2. #622
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Moderator's Warning:
    President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosqueThe personal attacks and one liner/worder baiting posts need to cease or further thread bans will be issued

  3. #623
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    As I've said in this thread before, they could probably sell the land for a tidy profit and build a better and bigger community centre with a mosque inside it elsewhere if it really offends you that much.
    Exactly my point. So ask yourself why don't they do that?


    The only assertions being made in this thread and in others is that all Islam means terror. This is not correct.
    No, this is the construct that allows you to place those that oppose your naive view of this as somehow bigoted when they are not.

    I made no assertion, I posed a question of true or false? Which I see now is false. Cheers!
    Maybe that is how you see it, but I assure you that your "question" is an assertion, based in how you view those opposed to your POV.

    If you can stop one. You can stop one again... and again... and again.
    If they continue to attempt to build a Mosque of conquest at Ground Zero, then I certainly hope so.

    and I suggest you take your fear and emotional arguments out of the equation as well.
    Fear, and emotion are constructs that you are attributing to my argument which you seem to have trouble breaking, so you then just dismiss it under this absurd paradigm. Why don't you actually address the argument instead of your masked name calling, and obfuscation.

    This mosque may be a bad idea. I never said it wasn't.
    "May be"???? Ya think?

    But the fact of the matter is, it's not going to "Tower Over Ground Zero"
    How much of the Twin Towers are rebuilt?

    If you take away their rights, you rienforce the cycle of fear between you, you prove that you are everything the radicals said you would be. You have to do what you must to end that cycle, or it will destroy you.
    Yeah, yeah....pfft! This is clap trap designed to silence opposition to this Cordoba house. The American people don't agree with you sir.

    While a majority of American voters think the Muslim group that wants to put a mosque near ground zero has the right to build it there, most think it would be wrong to do so.

    A Fox News poll released Friday found that 61 percent of voters think the Muslim group has the right to build a mosque in lower Manhattan.

    However, 64 percent think it would be wrong to put a mosque there.

    FOXNews.com - Fox News Poll: 64 Percent Think It's Wrong to Build Mosque Near Ground Zero
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    Im pretty sure i said "erdogans attempts to pervert it aside".

    Secularism has been doing strong for 100 years, so your claims hold very little credibility. Its not instinctive within the population, its being bought about by the fascists in power who have introduced increasingly oppress enviournments for our journalists to further there agenda's against the Kemalists and the Turkish army establishment. The EU has helped in this process, no doubt.

    I hope the army overthrows Erdogan and burns him on a cross as much as anyone. So back to the topic. Not too sure what your point is, if your suggesting its not possible they integrate/become secular and/or coexist with them, its your logical that is deeply flawed and baseless.

    Hmmm, Erdogan is your leader, so he controls the direction of the country. I posted an article, did you read it? You can hope with all your might that the Army overthrows your government, they have not right now and that is what matters. Turkey is lurching toward fundamentalist Islam.

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    absolutely, it IS wrong to build a mosque THERE

    because it WORSENS relations

    simple

    now, if you really wanna see some new york terrorists:

    Bedbug City: 1 in 10 New Yorkers has grappled with bedbugs in their home

    just kidding

    carry on

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Exactly my point. So ask yourself why don't they do that?
    Fortunately or Unfortunately that is not for us to decide. But I think it will happen soon because of all this.


    No, this is the construct that allows you to place those that oppose your naive view of this as somehow bigoted when they are not.
    Oh please! If people weren't so afraid of muslims being terrorists, and could Differentiate between Islam and radical Islam, we couldn't be having this conversation.

    Maybe that is how you see it, but I assure you that your "question" is an assertion, based in how you view those opposed to your POV.
    Oh I see! So we're still making baseless accusations that the Imam may have known about 9/11? and we still can't prove it. Good to know, cheers

    If they continue to attempt to build a Mosque of conquest at Ground Zero, then I certainly hope so.
    Opinion. Fear. Emotional argument.


    Fear, and emotion are constructs that you are attributing to my argument which you seem to have trouble breaking, so you then just dismiss it under this absurd paradigm. Why don't you actually address the argument instead of your masked name calling, and obfuscation.
    Please, this entire thing is about fear. People fear Islam. If they did not, we wouldn't care about this whole thing.

    How much of the Twin Towers are rebuilt?
    It's not across the street J-Mac, it will not "Tower Over" for gods sake, get a grip on reality here.

    I know who's fault it is the twin towers are gone. Radical Islamists.

    But I know it's not Islams fault nothing has been rebuilt there. Try again

    Yeah, yeah....pfft! This is clap trap designed to silence opposition to this Cordoba house. The American people don't agree with you sir.

    j-mac
    Is it possible that the people can be wrong?

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    My apologies for asking this question ... and thereby breaking (back) into this thread, but:

    Where is Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, the Ground Zero Imam? Since the scheisse has hit the fan, Imam Rauf jetted off to the Middle East and cannot be reached for comment. Has anyone read any news stories of his where abouts? According to Claudia Rosett (Forbes Magazine), he was last seen in Abu Dhabi for a stop at a Wahhabist Mosque for prayers; all phone calls and emails from CNN, Forbes, FOX and others have gone unanswered. All attempts at interviews by Reuters about the money, bank statements and tax receipts by the Cordoba Initiative have gone unanswered as well.

    If anyone has any information on this, I would be interested.

    My apologies for breaking into the thread guys ....
    Last edited by GayLibertarian; 08-16-10 at 12:36 PM.
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Fortunately or Unfortunately that is not for us to decide. But I think it will happen soon because of all this.
    I hope they don't build it there, it would be a nightmare, during, and after construction.


    Oh please! If people weren't so afraid of muslims being terrorists, and could Differentiate between Islam and radical Islam, we couldn't be having this conversation.
    Nonsense. As I already pointed out there are over a thousand Mosques nation wide. If we were so afraid then why haven't they been shuttered?

    Oh I see! So we're still making baseless accusations that the Imam may have known about 9/11? and we still can't prove it. Good to know, cheers
    he may have, he may not have. Neither can be proven. But I would lay out there that so far the Imam's actions in this mess have been little more than outright lies.

    Opinion. Fear. Emotional argument.
    Opinions come from a plethora of different places from different people. I think it is rather presumptuous of you to narrow it down to the neat little offensive box you do.

    Please, this entire thing is about fear. People fear Islam. If they did not, we wouldn't care about this whole thing.
    Could I not just as easily label you as complacent to radical Islam through an unwillingness to understand the threat that comes out of radical Islam? I think so.


    It's not across the street J-Mac, it will not "Tower Over" for gods sake, get a grip on reality here.
    It is 600 feet. Too close.

    I know who's fault it is the twin towers are gone. Radical Islamists.
    Congratulations. Then you also know that you will not make friends with them by prostrating yourself in front of them, right?

    But I know it's not Islams fault nothing has been rebuilt there. Try again
    Yeah? Who's fault is it then? I know, do you?

    Is it possible that the people can be wrong?
    Seems as though that is the only thing liberals can say when opinion goes against whatever they propose today? Healthcare takeover? Against 70%, DO IT ANYWAY! Finance Reform current existence? 70% Against, DO IT ANYWAY! NYC mosque? 65% Against, 'well the people are wrong, DO IT ANYWAY!

    How long you libs think this will work with the American people?


    j-mac
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    We all know damn well there is going to be trouble at that building. It will become everybody's favorite place to protest Muslims and maybe hurt them.

    I'm having a hard time imaging how anything good can come from this. It's just a bad idea to build a Muslim church at that particular location and there should be nothing illegal about stopping it.

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    What the hell....
    You know, like when I was a bill collector. "Do you want to pay the bill voluntarily, or do we need to pursue this through legal avenues?"

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