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Thread: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

  1. #601
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by rhinefire View Post
    One has to respect the sensitvity of others.
    You're right.... you can oppose it all you want.

    Yes our constitution is our platform but anyone would have to question why INSIST on this location?
    That isn't the point. As I understand it, they bought the land in 1998... those evil Muslims knew 9/11 was gonna happen.

    The more I see the opposition to this... the more I just don't care anymore. Is it a good idea? No. But this thing isn't going to "Tower Over Ground Zero" As has been suggested. It's 2 blocks away, people need to get over themselves, this mosque won't change anything.

    The law does not require you to attend your mothers funeral but you should go anyway should you not?
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Should we believe the anti-Mosque-ovites we would have to believe that:
    1. All Muslims are terrorists
    2. Barack Obama is a Muslim
    3. Barack Obama is secretly conspiring with the Muslims (terrorists) to take over the USA
    4. Saudi Aarbia is a good country to do business with and a great base for our military, but they are evil Muslims (terrorists)
    5. That the Islamic Cultural Centre will really be just a Mosque
    6. That the 'Mosque' will be built over the remains of the Twin Towers
    7. That the people who will use the centre will be sitting inside laughing at how they have managed to invade the heart of the infidel, "Ha ha! Die American dogs!"
    nonsense, to oppose this project all one needs do is believe that it is NOT improving relations, which it's not

    look around

    what is the purpose for building this mosque, again?
    Last edited by The Prof; 08-16-10 at 10:19 AM.

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    You're right.... you can oppose it all you want.
    I am sure we all appreciate your permission.


    That isn't the point. As I understand it, they bought the land in 1998... those evil Muslims knew 9/11 was gonna happen.

    In 1998 you say? Hmmmm....Well, in 1993 there was an event that many now consider the precursor to 9/11....


    The 1993 World Trade Center bombing occurred on February 26, 1993, when a truck bomb was detonated below the North Tower of the World Trade Center in New York City. The 1,500 lb (680 kg) urea nitrate–hydrogen gas enhanced device[1] was intended to knock the North Tower (Tower One) into the South Tower (Tower Two), bringing both towers down and killing thousands of people.[2][3] It failed to do so, but did kill six people and injured 1,042.

    1993 World Trade Center bombing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    So when you say that Imam Rauf and his mysterious partners in this affront didn't know in 1998....They did indeed know that an attempt had already happened, and they very well could have been privy to the chatter surrounding attacking America by radicals that ultimately did.

    he more I see the opposition to this... the more I just don't care anymore. Is it a good idea? No. But this thing isn't going to "Tower Over Ground Zero" As has been suggested. It's 2 blocks away, people need to get over themselves, this mosque won't change anything.
    Um, wrong again. Look, There is nothing yet rebuilt on the Ground Zero site, which IMHO is a travesty to begin with, however, we should not even be having this argument until the site is redeveloped with what they are going to replace the Twin Towers with. PERIOD! In that case the mosque will indeed tower over the site in a manner of speaking.

    Now one of your ridiculous claims is that it is not directly on the site so we in opposition should just suck it up and let it go forth, ya know, to show 'tolerance' and all. There are over 90 mosques in NYC alone, and over a thousand nation wide. Tolerance they want? Really? Where is their tolerance in the sensibilities of building this grotesque symbol of conquest a mere 600 feet from where 3,000 people lost their lives, and families still grieve their loss.

    Let's take a look at the naming of this insulting temple of conquest.

    After the Islamic conquest of the Visigothic kingdom the Emir Abd ar-Rahman I bought the church.[3] Abd ar-Rahman I and his descendants reworked it over two centuries to refashion it as a mosque...

    Great Mosque of Córdoba - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    The true history of Cordoba, not to mention the whole of Andalusia, is far less inspiring than what Western academics portray: the Christian city was conquered by Muslims around 711, its inhabitants slaughtered or enslaved. The original mosque of Cordoba—the namesake of the Ground Zero mosque—was built atop, and partly from the materials of, a Christian church. Modern day Muslims are well aware of all this. Such is the true—and ominous—legacy of Cordoba.

    More pointedly, throughout Islam's history, whenever a region was conquered, one of the first signs of consolidation was/is the erection of a mosque atop the sacred sites of the vanquished: the pagan Ka'ba temple in Arabia was converted into Islam's holiest site, the mosque of Mecca; the al-Aqsa mosque, Islam's third holiest site, was built atop Solomon's temple in Jerusalem; the Umayyad mosque was built atop the Church of St. John the Baptist; and the Hagia Sophia was converted into a mosque upon the conquest of Constantinople.

    (Speaking of, in 2006, when the Pope visited the Hagia Sophia in Turkey, there was a risk that the "Islamic world [would go] into paroxysms of fury" if there was "any perception that the pope is trying to re-appropriate a Christian center that fell to Muslims," for example, if he had dared pray there—this even as Muslims today seek to build a mosque on the rubble of the Twin Towers.)

    The Two Faces of the Ground Zero Mosque :: Raymond Ibrahim
    This is a building of conquest and Imperial subjugation of America for the new caliphate, and the Imam Rauf is a liar.

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    I'll tell him right now that in all five major schools of Islam the only accepted views are that the penalties for apostasy, adultery, sodomy, and/or premarital sex are corporal and/or capital punishment and that is why mainstream Islam is out of touch with the modern world and antithetical to a liberal society.
    And that is true, which is why the Middle East needs to take Western countries as a perfect example of the benefits and the humanity of secularism. Christianity too, though not as much, is out of touch with liberal society.

    Just because it has conservative views in nature, does not mean they are all bad people and they are all terrorists. They can become secular and as Western as any folk, as Israel and Turkey has proved (Erdogans recent attempts to pervert it aside).

    It is possible to live beside them if we educate them. We fight and spread our values of freedom around the world, not respecting these values at home undermines our legitimacy as Democratic people who respect the freedom of others.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    unbelievable
    Reported.
    Last edited by kaya'08; 08-16-10 at 10:51 AM.
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    I am sure we all appreciate your permission.
    My point is you have every right to oppose it, as they have to build it.

    In 1998 you say? Hmmmm....Well, in 1993 there was an event that many now consider the precursor to 9/11....
    True, but where was all the fear about muslims back then. If they had built a mosque 2 blocks away after that attack, would anyone have said anything?

    So when you say that Imam Rauf and his mysterious partners in this affront didn't know in 1998....They did indeed know that an attempt had already happened, and they very well could have been privy to the chatter surrounding attacking America by radicals that ultimately did.
    You wanna prove he had prior knowledge of 9/11? Remember, under the law, we're asked to prove positives, not negatives.

    Um, wrong again. Look, There is nothing yet rebuilt on the Ground Zero site, which IMHO is a travesty to begin with, however, we should not even be having this argument until the site is redeveloped with what they are going to replace the Twin Towers with. PERIOD! In that case the mosque will indeed tower over the site in a manner of speaking.
    Is it all the muslims fault that nothing has been built at ground zero yet?

    Now one of your ridiculous claims is that it is not directly on the site so we in opposition should just suck it up and let it go forth, ya know, to show 'tolerance' and all. There are over 90 mosques in NYC alone, and over a thousand nation wide. Tolerance they want? Really? Where is their tolerance in the sensibilities of building this grotesque symbol of conquest a mere 600 feet from where 3,000 people lost their lives, and families still grieve their loss.
    600 feet... 900 feet... 1000 feet... how far is too far?



    This is a building of conquest and Imperial subjugation of America for the new caliphate, and the Imam Rauf is a liar.

    j-mac
    /Facepalm

    Says the person who's country has bases in 63 countries around the world.

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    And that is true, which is why the Middle East needs to take Western countries as a perfect example of the benefits and the humanity of secularism. Christianity too, though not as much, is out of touch with liberal society.

    Just because it has conservative views in nature, does not mean they are all bad people and they are all terrorists. They can become secular and as Western as any folk, as Israel and Turkey has proved (Erdogans recent attempts to pervert it aside).

    It is possible to live beside them if we educate them. We fight and spread our values of freedom around the world, not respecting these values at home undermines our legitimacy as Democratic people who respect the freedom of others.

    Nonsense. We don't even begin to understand fully the religious teachings, that for example allow its followers in a caliphate to do anything to win the submission of those they are focusing on to conquer.

    Including lying, and killing them.

    Your naive approach is exactly what has allowed many in history to by ruled, and killed by an Islamic yoke for centuries.


    j-mac
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    absolutely---when mr rauf says he's building this mosque in order "to improve west-muslim relations," he's either an idiot or he's not really speaking his heart

    meanwhile, abc this morning

    President Obama's Mosque Comments Add Issue to Democrats' Election Challenge - ABC News

    things were already tuff enough as is for the blues, notes rick klein---the president's SUMMER OF RECOVERY turned out to be one very unfunny joke, we will end the hot months with FEWER jobs than we started with, "barring an astounding august turnaround"

    The president spoke in forceful tones about the need for American values to win out at the site near Ground Zero -- though he seemed to muddle the message a day later by saying that he wasn't necessarily endorsing the idea of building the mosque and cultural center.

    But from the perspective of rank-and-file Democrats who represent districts far from downtown New York City, this is an unwelcome distraction that leaves them on the minority side of a hot-button issue.

    In a CNN poll taken last week, 68 percent of respondents said they opposed the plan to build a mosque near Ground Zero.
    forceful tones and muddled messages---that's our barry!

    gallup sunday has the putz at a new all time low, what will tomorrow bring

    Gallup.Com - Daily News, Polls, Public Opinion on Government, Politics, Economics, Management

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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Nonsense. We don't even begin to understand fully the religious teachings, that for example allow its followers in a caliphate to do anything to win the submission of those they are focusing on to conquer.

    Including lying, and killing them.

    Your naive approach is exactly what has allowed many in history to by ruled, and killed by an Islamic yoke for centuries.


    j-mac
    What exactly are you saying?
    "If religious instruction were not allowed until the child had attained the age of reason, we would be living in quite a different world" - Christopher Hitchens
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    My point is you have every right to oppose it, as they have to build it.
    No one has said that they don't, but public pressure to do the right thing can often bring about change in location for a great many things.


    True, but where was all the fear about muslims back then. If they had built a mosque 2 blocks away after that attack, would anyone have said anything?
    I prefer to live in the here and now, back then is of no concern to what is happening today, other than to prove you wrong in your assertion.

    You wanna prove he had prior knowledge of 9/11? Remember, under the law, we're asked to prove positives, not negatives.
    I never said that he absolutely did. I said it was possible, destroying yet another of your assertions.

    Is it all the muslims fault that nothing has been built at ground zero yet?
    Again, no one has said that "ALL" muslims bear responsibility for what happened on 9/11, in fact I went to lengths to show that there are plenty of mosques in NYC and the US proving that fact.

    /Facepalm
    You have nothing, try again. This time educate yourself on the history and possible motives of this mosque before posting.


    Says the person who's country has bases in 63 countries around the world.
    Are you conceding that this mosque is a possible 'Base' of operation for the Islamic Jihad?

    j-mac
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    Re: President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque

    Quote Originally Posted by SgtRock View Post
    New York Post
    Aug 13, 2010 President Obama comes out in support of Ground Zero mosque - NYPOST.com

    As of today 61% of New Yorkers many of them democrats, are aginst the ground zero mosque. Obama comes out in support. Not a very smart move on his part.
    I answered this earlier that he didn't really support the mosque -- he supported their right to build a mosque.

    After reading the thread and hearing the pundits, I now think it was a big mistake for him to weigh in on this issue at all. And everything he and his White House reps say to clarify his comments does nothing but dig a deeper hole. He shoulda' kept his mouth shut.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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