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Thread: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Jerusalem Post is an independent newspaper, although I am fully aware of your damaged opinion that Israeli newspapers cannot be independent if only because they are Israeli, but that controversial notion is irrelevant to the facts.
    Now if you want to claim it's biased then feel free to do so, but it is certainly not a "mouthpiece of the Israeli government" as it has no governmental control.
    Yes it is independent, but so is the Times of London, the Washington Times and so on and so on. And they are hardly unbiased sources and have many times been used by certain political parties or even governments to promote a certain view.

    As for my comment that they are a mouth piece of the Israeli government.. then explain why there was a change in the tone and information in the reporting so to have a much more negative view of Turkey than the original article, at a time when Israel and Turkey are not the best of friends?
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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Yes it is independent, but so is the Times of London, the Washington Times and so on and so on. And they are hardly unbiased sources and have many times been used by certain political parties or even governments to promote a certain view.

    As for my comment that they are a mouth piece of the Israeli government.. then explain why there was a change in the tone and information in the reporting so to have a much more negative view of Turkey than the original article, at a time when Israel and Turkey are not the best of friends?
    Maybe because like all newspapers in the world they look to sell papers. Makes sense that the Israeli public, not just the government is unhappy with Turkey. So finding something negative to write is good business. The fact that everyone knows that Turkey kills many PKK and probably civilians who are in the way helps the narrative.

    If yo were not so negative toward Israel, it wold not be hard to come up with a more reasonable explanation for the article.

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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Yes it is independent, but so is the Times of London, the Washington Times and so on and so on. And they are hardly unbiased sources and have many times been used by certain political parties or even governments to promote a certain view.
    So which newspapers would you consider to be genuine media outlets? I'm guessing only those that lean to the left.

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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Yes it is independent, but so is the Times of London, the Washington Times and so on and so on. And they are hardly unbiased sources and have many times been used by certain political parties or even governments to promote a certain view.

    As for my comment that they are a mouth piece of the Israeli government.. then explain why there was a change in the tone and information in the reporting so to have a much more negative view of Turkey than the original article, at a time when Israel and Turkey are not the best of friends?
    First of all it could be that the JP is merely biased, so there is no logic behind the automatic claim for "being a mouthpiece for the government".

    As to the article at hand, here is the original article from the Der Spiegel:
    Shocking Images of Dead Kurdish Fighters: Turkey Accused of Using Chemical Weapons against PKK - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International

    German experts have confirmed the authenticity of photographs that purport to show PKK fighters killed by chemical weapons. The evidence puts increasing pressure on the Turkish government, which has long been suspected of using such weapons against Kurdish rebels. German politicians are demanding an investigation.
    As you can see the original article is much more strongly worded and is actually confident in its stance that Turkey has indeed used Chemical weapons, so this kinda makes your accusation towards the Israeli report on that article to be pretty bizarre and irrational.

    I myself think that the OP should have been the article from the Der Spiegel instead of a report on that article from any other source, but I don't see how the difference is working against the Turks here.
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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    The damage done does not seem similar to any chemical weapon that I know of but is sounds more like an explosive of somesort that causes burning (fuel air bomb?)
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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    So, Turkey is big bad evil, but when Saddam's use of WMD was shown... we were told not to care? Odd.

    And why is this in Der Speigel and not elsewhere. PS When did this occur, the article caused my old ass PC to crash.
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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Several European newspapers have picked up this story, which was reported by UPI (one of the big three global media sources) and Reuters (hardly a fan of Israel). The story emanated in Germany, and even if it's been basically ignored in the USA, it would have significant consequences in Europe should it be found to be true.

    I honestly can't see how this could be turned into an Israeli thread. The mind boggles...

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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    First of all it could be that the JP is merely biased, so there is no logic behind the automatic claim for "being a mouthpiece for the government".
    JP is biased and more than not it does the bidding of the Israeli government. It always has, and always will.

    Not the original article. The original article is below.

    Kämpfe in Ostanatolien: Türkei soll Kurden mit Chemiewaffen getötet haben - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Politik

    And there is a mark difference. The whole first paragraph in the English version is different than the German on many levels and sets the tone of the whole article. And there is a mark difference in tone. For one the English version starts off with:

    German experts have confirmed the authenticity of photographs that purport to show PKK fighters killed by chemical weapons
    This sets a tone of, "experts" have confirmed that Turkey uses chemical weapons.

    Now the original paragraph in German mentions nothing about German experts what so ever. Basically the whole first paragraph in English is totally different than the German version. The rest of the article is pretty much correctly translated but the tone is already set. Why Der Spiegel changed the wording I have no idea, just as I have no idea why JP used the translated English version and not the original version in their attack on Turkey.

    The original article first paragraph sounds like this.

    Human rights activists accuse Turkey of using chemical weapons against Kurdish revolutionaries. Experts confirms accusation. German politicians demand international investigation.
    Now that is quite the difference to the English version.

    Plus JP omits stuff from the English version.. like Turkey denying even having chemical weapons.

    As you can see the original article is much more strongly worded and is actually confident in its stance that Turkey has indeed used Chemical weapons, so this kinda makes your accusation towards the Israeli report on that article to be pretty bizarre and irrational.
    As I said, your link is not the original article.

    I myself think that the OP should have been the article from the Der Spiegel instead of a report on that article from any other source, but I don't see how the difference is working against the Turks here.
    Yes he should, the link I provided.

    But it does not matter, because like it or not it is an accusation that so far has not been backed up what so ever, and accusations coming from a Kurdish "human rights" group. Turkey has denied even having chemical weapons. Turkey has denied everything in matter of fact.

    This whole thread belongs in conspiracy theories more than in breaking news.
    PeteEU

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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    Several European newspapers have picked up this story, which was reported by UPI (one of the big three global media sources) and Reuters (hardly a fan of Israel). The story emanated in Germany, and even if it's been basically ignored in the USA, it would have significant consequences in Europe should it be found to be true.
    Have not seen it anywhere and yes I do read quite a few newspapers. But saying that, these accusations have been around for decades and have only been that.. accusations.

    I honestly can't see how this could be turned into an Israeli thread. The mind boggles...
    It started off as a part Israeli thread.. the OP posted an article from an Israeli newspaper that was conveniently changed from the original version to create a more negative view of Turkey. That sets off a lot of alarms considering the present Turkish vs Israeli relations.
    PeteEU

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    re: Turks hit PKK with chemical weapons'

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    So, Turkey is big bad evil, but when Saddam's use of WMD was shown... we were told not to care? Odd.
    My reaction exactly.

    Is anyone else seeing the double standard?
    Either way, Turkey is in NATO. If the West turns it back on genocides, we will not care about the Kurds


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