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Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operate

Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

The conclusion to the stupidity that was, bureaucratic non-sense, is upon us.
AP said:
PORTLAND, Ore. — The 7-year-old Oregon girl who found herself at the center of a national flap about childhood lemonade stands versus government bureaucrats is going to Disneyland.

Julie Murphy managed to make $1,838.31 in her second attempt at selling lemonade — enough to bankroll a trip for her and her mother, Maria Fife.LINK
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And all is right with the world... at least for this little girl and her mother.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

That's great for her. I hope she has fun on her trip.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Damn I wish I made that much money when I tried to sell lemonade.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

reefedjib said:
Yes
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That's a scary thought because it means I dont have to have any training, any preparation, or any precautions to keep what I'm selling clean.

American said:
You hang on the letter of the law, and not the intent.
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The intent of the law is to ensure that people are not sold potentially contaminated food by monitoring those who sell the food and ensuring they are following health codes. I dont care if shes 9 or 90, she is selling something that will be consumed by the public and as such she needs to do so in such a way that follows health codes.

I'm not opposed to having a sort of starter business license with an extremely low cost
for cases like this but I absolutely do not support the unregulated sale of items of consumption to the general public. We dont let adults get away with it, we shouldn't let kids get away with it because they're kids.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Hoplite said:
That's a scary thought because it means I dont have to have any training, any preparation, or any precautions to keep what I'm selling clean.
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Inspectors mostly don't prevent that stuff, either. Why should the government play watchdog? Especially if they aren't effective. Another cost to the business.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

reefedjib said:
Inspectors mostly don't prevent that stuff, either.
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Health inspectors check for a hygenic set-up for serving food. If that isnt found, the business is shut down.

Why should the government play watchdog?
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Because it's demonstrably effective and there needs to be independent insurance that a restaurant or food stand is selling food that wont poison people.

Especially if they aren't effective.
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Im sorry, how many times have you had food poisoning in your life? How many people do you know that have died from contaminated or spoiled food?

I'd be willing to bet it's been EXTREMELY few times. That is due to food safety regulations and their enforcement.

Another cost to the business.
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Salmonella is much more expensive
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

reefedjib said:
Inspectors mostly don't prevent that stuff, either. Why should the government play watchdog? Especially if they aren't effective. Another cost to the business.
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Heh, I remember when I worked in food service.
The inspectors would always call ahead of time to let us know of the impending visit.
Time to clean up extra good that night before.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Harry Guerrilla said:
Heh, I remember when I worked in food service.
The inspectors would always call ahead of time to let us know of the impending visit.
Time to clean up extra good that night before.
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What the hell. Doesn't that sort of defeat the purpose of inspecting if you give them enough time to make the place look good for a day?
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

soccerboy22 said:
What the hell. Doesn't that sort of defeat the purpose of inspecting if you give them enough time to make the place look good for a day?
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Pretty much. :lol:

They did it twice a year, if I remember correctly.
That's why I don't get the need for a business license and all the inspections.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

There are scheduled visits and surprise visits by inspectors.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Harry Guerrilla said:
I can't remember ever having a surprise inspection in the 8 years I worked in food service.
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In 4 1/2 years with me and various restaurants --- no surprise inspections ever happened either. We always knew well in advance and needless to say, we cleaned up the kitchen, back and front lines, changed the fry oil, brushed all the grunge from behind the flat-top and broiler and scrubbed & hosed down the tile floor until we no longer slid on the grease and cleaned out the walk-ins. Never know what you'll find in walk-in's... but that's another story.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Ockham said:
In 4 1/2 years with me and various restaurants --- no surprise inspections ever happened either. We always knew well in advance and needless to say, we cleaned up the kitchen, back and front lines, changed the fry oil, brushed all the grunge from behind the flat-top and broiler and scrubbed & hosed down the tile floor until we no longer slid on the grease and cleaned out the walk-ins. Never know what you'll find in walk-in's... but that's another story.
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Worked in food service from my mid teens up till my early twenties.

Yea walks in, yikes they can be disgusting.
It didn't really effect the food, those gaskets get nasty quick though.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Ockham said:
In 4 1/2 years with me and various restaurants --- no surprise inspections ever happened either. We always knew well in advance and needless to say, we cleaned up the kitchen, back and front lines, changed the fry oil, brushed all the grunge from behind the flat-top and broiler and scrubbed & hosed down the tile floor until we no longer slid on the grease and cleaned out the walk-ins. Never know what you'll find in walk-in's... but that's another story.
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I am never going to eat out again. Well unless it is a first date. That is disgusting.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

soccerboy22 said:
I am never going to eat out again. Well unless it is a first date. That is disgusting.
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:lol:

I was pretty anal about keeping my work area clean in most places.
The dishes though, good thing the ones I used ran through an oven.
Bastard dish washers loved to half ass it.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

soccerboy22 said:
I am never going to eat out again. Well unless it is a first date. That is disgusting.
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Nothing compared to a family of mice who were living in a pan of sliced eggplant. The dead giveaway was the pile of dried grass. The mice apparently got in through the insulation behind one of the light fixtures which was dented. They apparently jumped on the top shelf, scurried down into the back where the pan was pushed in the corner. Found a few deal little mice in a few other pans too. No telling how long those little guys were in there. Which is why when I go out to eat I tend to eat deep fried food - it might kill me with heart failure, but at least I won't get tape worms or some other disease ... and we were pretty good about keeping clean. We weren't exceptional... but we were very aware of cross contamination, raw meats and never left things out... they always went in the walk-in.... with the mice.

blech.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Ockham said:
Nothing compared to a family of mice who were living in a pan of sliced eggplant. The dead giveaway was the pile of dried grass. The mice apparently got in through the insulation behind one of the light fixtures which was dented. They apparently jumped on the top shelf, scurried down into the back where the pan was pushed in the corner. Found a few deal little mice in a few other pans too. No telling how long those little guys were in there. Which is why when I go out to eat I tend to eat deep fried food - it might kill me with heart failure, but at least I won't get tape worms or some other disease ... and we were pretty good about keeping clean. We weren't exceptional... but we were very aware of cross contamination, raw meats and never left things out... they always went in the walk-in.... with the mice.

blech.
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The amount of stuff the public doesn't know about food service, they'd all freak out.

One of the other franchise restaurants in our group closed for about a month to "remodel."
The true story was that, the walls were infested with roaches and had to be stripped down, cleaned and redone.
It was nasty.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

soccerboy22 said:
Damn I wish I made that much money when I tried to sell lemonade.
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Undoubtedly you weren't as pretty.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Hoplite said:
That's a scary thought because it means I dont have to have any training, any preparation, or any precautions to keep what I'm selling clean.

The intent of the law is to ensure that people are not sold potentially contaminated food by monitoring those who sell the food and ensuring they are following health codes. I dont care if shes 9 or 90, she is selling something that will be consumed by the public and as such she needs to do so in such a way that follows health codes.

I'm not opposed to having a sort of starter business license with an extremely low cost
for cases like this but I absolutely do not support the unregulated sale of items of consumption to the general public. We dont let adults get away with it, we shouldn't let kids get away with it because they're kids.
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A piece of paper doesn't ensure safety, only revenue for the city. Next?
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Agent Ferris said:
lmfao, if the kid is to stupid to run a lawn mower then he's to stupid to make it in the world and will probably end up on welfare and it should be left up to natural selection.
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Ummm...Agent...I am the LAST person to bust people on spelling and grammer...but...

when insulting someone elses intelligence one should probably use the proper form of 'too'...

;) :2wave:
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

Barbbtx said:
Today my parents would have been arrested for half the things they let me do when I was a kid.
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That's partly my point.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

I'm wondering... now that the little girls lemonade stand made like 1,800+ bucks... how many people got food poisoning from it? I mean, she still didn't have her little $120 piece of paper and all. Anyone see anything in the blogs or news identifying a breakout of bubonic plague from the lemonade stand?
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

j-mac said:
Look Sam, you seem like an intelligent liberal, surely you know what a strawman is right? You should stick to facts. It isn't $5 we are talking about here, it is $120. Did you even read the article? And the larger question that we are supposedly discussing, (although it takes two to discuss) is whether the government should be concerning themselves with a 7 year olds lemonade stand at a yard sale, instead of that restaurant with rats in the basement that they accepted a $1000. kickback (or fine if you wish) to look the other way. This is about some low level liberal with power accreting that power on a defenseless child in a bullying way. Oh, I am sure she could feel the "S" on her pink leotard under her clothes shinning as she effortlessly closed down the kids stand, and threatened a fine. What a model human being....She should be proud she thwarted a 7 year old from making a $1.50, what a joke!

Hey, she should have left the kid alone, Obama could have claimed 7 more jobs saved from that one.
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But here's the thing. Yes, this particular instance is pretty silly, and yes, it does indeed stick of bureaucratic bull****.

However, there is a larger issue at play here: what should be towards children who want to sell goods or services?

Should they have to purchase a $120 business license like adults have to? No, absolutely not, as a child won't make enough of a profit to justify it.

But does that mean we should let a child go about making money however he pleases without any knowledge of the rules and regulations we have regarding what he's doing? No, I think not, for issues having to do with public health and safety as well as for reasons regarding litigation.

So while most of the conservatives here shout that this shows the idiocy of liberal bureaucracy, I see it as an example of something that has fallen through the cracks of law. And that's why I propose that we have business licenses for children that are cheap enough for them to purchase and causes the clerk who hands them a license pamphlets on general safety for their well being and that of the public.

It's not that I condone the actions of the bureaucrat - it's that the law has taken these instances into account, and I think it is something that should be addressed.
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

samsmart said:
But here's the thing. Yes, this particular instance is pretty silly, and yes, it does indeed stick of bureaucratic bull****.

However, there is a larger issue at play here: what should be towards children who want to sell goods or services?
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Look, it's always been caveat emptor and that's all it will ever be. As long as the child is supervised by what looks to be a responsible adult - there is no larger issue.

samsmart said:
So while most of the conservatives here shout that this shows the idiocy of liberal bureaucracy, I see it as an example of something that has fallen through the cracks of law. And that's why I propose that we have business licenses for children that are cheap enough for them to purchase and causes the clerk who hands them a license pamphlets on general safety for their well being and that of the public.
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A cheaper liberal bureaucracy that still doesn't test for diseases protecting the general safety and well being? Why - so the liberal bureaucracy can be more palatable? It still is useless, whether it's $120 or $1. Same uselessness, just a different price of the stupidity.

samsmart said:
It's not that I condone the actions of the bureaucrat - it's that the law has taken these instances into account, and I think it is something that should be addressed.
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Caveat emptor. If you don't want to risk getting sick on a kids lemonade stand, don't buy the lemonade. :shrug:
 
Re: Portland lemonade stand runs into health inspectors, needs $120 license to operat

reefedjib said:
It is the principle of requiring a child to get a business license.
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Needing a business license to sell lemonaid is like ... needing a license to have a child. The inspector(s) responsible for this nonsense need to be suspended without pay for a week... and they need to be forced to write a letter of apology.
 
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